Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

For the discussion of Toho DVDs, Blu-Rays, CDs, streaming services, VHS, and other formats where Toho films and soundtracks can be found.
Post Reply
Legion1979
Justiriser
Posts: 15853
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:45 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Legion1979 »

It's not about shaking the old image. They allowed Criterion to include the dubs they created for Son of Godzilla, DAM, Megalon and the MG films. They let Krakken have their dubs for Sea Monster, Hedorah and Gigan. (My guess is some rights issue with Krakken has prevented those three dubs from being included in the Janus package). They also seem to be convinced they have some ownership over the Nick Adams dub of MZ, so we get that too.

Again, this is very clearly Toho insisting on only letting US distributors use what they themselves are 100% positive they're in control of. So no WB version of Raids Again, no Titra dubs for Mothra vs Godzilla, the island films, DAM or Hedorah, no Continental Ghidrah dub and
goofy Barney Rubble Minya.

User avatar
Anguirus
Gotengo Officer
Posts: 1714
Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:31 am

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Anguirus »

I would think that Toho would definitely not allow the commentary on that old Godzilla Raids Again dvd, where the guy keeps exclaiming his indifference to the film. Even if they allowed non Toho commentaries currently.

Legion1979
Justiriser
Posts: 15853
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:45 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Legion1979 »

Toho made their stance on commentaries very clear when they took so long to approve the Biollante commentary that Mill Creek had to release the disc without it.
Last edited by Legion1979 on Mon May 23, 2022 10:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Chrispy_G
Gotengo Officer
Posts: 1830
Joined: Mon May 23, 2016 11:02 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Chrispy_G »

It would all be real simply if Toho just commissioned passable dubs of all of the original cuts.

At this point I am far less invested and interested in the "Every film deserves an audio commentary/companion essay!" notion. Kaiju film commentaries often involve a lot of "off topic" discussion about trivia related to the people involved in the making of the film...and a lot less discussion on the film istelf.

Talk about the script, the visuals, the effects, the themes and story of the film and the execution of those things....and behind the scenes material of THIS film. Don't ramble off highlights of the filmography of every actor and actress on-screen. It feels like all of them follow that structure. The folks involved do SO MUCH research that they don't know how to edit any of it to focus on the matter at hand. Almost every commentator also has to somehow snipe in some weird borderline lukewarm 'hot take' about some topic related to these films or thing surrounding them.

PLUS....in the age of the internet, YouTube has an embarrassment of riches when it comes to informational videos about these films. There are great YTubers out there just crushing video essays, trivia compilations, behind the scenes info, and even fan commentaries for these films. There are podcasts like Tokyo Lives that do episodes on these films that are often longer than the films themselves. The internet completely fills the void in terms of discussion and analysis of these films in ways that the often stuffy, lukewarm commentaries just don't do.

At this point....give me all of the films in their original cuts, give me an option to watch them with good subs and an option to watch them with at least a mid-tier quality dub. Give them the best picture and sound quality possible...and leave it at that.
"I'm saying a prayer, George. A prayer for the whole world."

User avatar
Godzilla21
Keizer
Posts: 8887
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 8:39 pm
Location: Colorado

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Godzilla21 »

Mac Daddy MM wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 12:47 pm Decades of great work on non-Godzilla titles, sure. Fully agree, I have a few of them. But they didn't drop the ball on Godzilla just once. They dropped the ball on it TWICE, dating all the way back to their original gimmicky release of 1954 that couldn't even bother to use the 1954 Godzilla and instead went with the 2002 version.
So I know that Toho has to final approve everything related to Godzilla. We have stories going back 50 years on this. So they obviously saw the 2002 Godzilla on the Criterion box and still OK'ed it for release. Or did Toho insist on the 2002 Godzilla? We know they make some batshit crazy decisions at times.

I see a lot of blame for Criterion here but do we know Toho's role in this case?
SpaceG92 wrote:
<=25% joke. >=75% topic. Even then - that's pushing it.

User avatar
Chrispy_G
Gotengo Officer
Posts: 1830
Joined: Mon May 23, 2016 11:02 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Chrispy_G »

Godzilla21 wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 10:07 pm
Mac Daddy MM wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 12:47 pm Decades of great work on non-Godzilla titles, sure. Fully agree, I have a few of them. But they didn't drop the ball on Godzilla just once. They dropped the ball on it TWICE, dating all the way back to their original gimmicky release of 1954 that couldn't even bother to use the 1954 Godzilla and instead went with the 2002 version.
So I know that Toho has to final approve everything related to Godzilla. We have stories going back 50 years on this. So they obviously saw the 2002 Godzilla on the Criterion box and still OK'ed it for release. Or did Toho insist on the 2002 Godzilla? We know they make some batshit crazy decisions at times.

I see a lot of blame for Criterion here but do we know Toho's role in this case?
I always just assumed that Criterion did not feel beholden to use ONLY the 54 Godzilla for that release, and frankly I've never understood how fans get in such a twist about "They used the wrong Godzilla!"

The cover art has a certain "look" and when you fold it out, the pop-up is the 2002 version of the character, and I think the image "behind the disc" may even be of the GMK head.

For me, I sort of see associated artwork and imagery of Godzilla as all being in one big pot of representing the character. It's ALL Godzilla, unless you are outright using the wrong "Movie-specific poster" for a film, general stylized/filtered images of Godzilla on package artwork doesn't really HAVE to be a 100% match of that movie. Especially when you are talking about 'artwork'

Now, if they had images, straight up images, of other Godzilla movies on the back of the Criterion case, as if to say "That is in this movie" that's a little weird.

I don't buy for a second that they thought "Hey, this is Godzilla, all Godzilla looks the same, so whatever"....I think it was more of a matter of wanting to use the package to visually reflect that Godzilla still exists in a modern incarnation for modern audiences (The Criterion disc was in 2011-2012, so at that point a Millennium iteration of the character would have been one of the 'newest' to use) and was not restricted or contained to that original 54 film.

Either way, I've always felt that was a rather insane detail for people to lose their minds over. Just like when they complained about the various hyper-stylized pieces of artwork for the Criterion set "Not being the right designs!"

They are capturing the spirit of Godzilla and playing into the variety of the character. Godzilla and Mothra have faced off many times, I'm not about to lose my mind if a really cool piece of Mothra vs Godzilla artwork has a Godzilla design that gives me 2002 vibes. To me the artwork felt all about variety and about being a stylized interpretation of the film it was representing.

I mean, is anyone looking at the Ghidorah, The Three Headed Monster Criterion artwork and saying "What, Godzilla doesn't look like THAT in the movie, that kind of art-style isn't in the movie! 0/10!"

Maybe it just means a heck of a lot more to other people than it does to me. I just don't get the fuss. Neither the original Criterion release OR the Box Set ever felt like they were mis-representing the character at all.
"I'm saying a prayer, George. A prayer for the whole world."

User avatar
Mac Daddy MM
Xilien Halfling
Posts: 5044
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:27 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Mac Daddy MM »

Chrispy_G wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 10:26 pm
I mean, is anyone looking at the Ghidorah, The Three Headed Monster Criterion artwork and saying "What, Godzilla doesn't look like THAT in the movie, that kind of art-style isn't in the movie! 0/10!
I DO hate how almost all of the artwork is obviously just work for hire and not done by true fans, going as far as traces (or VERY SIMILAR poses) for kaiju from other media AND use the complete wrong versions (again). IIRC, GvMZ uses Heisei Rodan, MvG has 02 and Heisei, etc. The package itself has fucking BIO-GOJI.

0/10? Nah, that's some Daizula DA caliber scoring. But definitely less than a 5.


Quote of the Year:
plasmabeam wrote: Tue Dec 05, 2023 3:03 am Hear me out on this. What if Godzilla is actually Suko’s father? In GvK when Godzilla defeated Kong and they were roaring at each other, what if Godzilla inseminated Kong at that moment and that’s why they were screaming?

Legion1979
Justiriser
Posts: 15853
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:45 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Legion1979 »

So yeah, pretty inane to compare one release to the other.

The box set is full of interpretative artwork, something Criterion does for their releases. Do some of the Godzillas not look like they're supposed to? Yeah but the nature of the artwork makes it not a big deal to me. It's fun to see the different styles. It'd a celebration of decades of film.

But the 2012 '54 release? That's one specific movie. And the Godzilla on the packaging - especially the pop out one - is a PHOTO of the Millennium Godzilla. That's something so specific that shouldn't be there.

User avatar
Godzilla21
Keizer
Posts: 8887
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 8:39 pm
Location: Colorado

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Godzilla21 »

Chrispy_G wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 10:26 pm I always just assumed that Criterion did not feel beholden to use ONLY the 54 Godzilla for that release, and frankly I've never understood how fans get in such a twist about "They used the wrong Godzilla!"
Even if Criterion wasn't beholden to the 54 Godzilla, Toho still had to approve the final product and they would have seen the 02 Godzilla on the cover. So I've always been curious who's decision it was to have that Godzilla there. Was it Criterion who thought that the 02 pose maybe reflected more of what they wanted and Toho approved it or did Toho mandate the 02?

I also didn't care too much about the image not being the 54. I remember some absolute meltdowns when it was released. To me what really matters is the presentation of the film.
SpaceG92 wrote:
<=25% joke. >=75% topic. Even then - that's pushing it.

User avatar
Terasawa
Xilien Halfling
Posts: 5841
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2011 10:06 am

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Terasawa »

Godzilla21 wrote: Tue Jul 12, 2022 7:28 am I also didn't care too much about the image not being the 54. I remember some absolute meltdowns when it was released. To me what really matters is the presentation of the film.
Same here. They could have had a pop-out of the Godzilla vs. Megalon tail slide and it would have been OK with me because the disc was so good.
寺沢. He/him/his, etc.

Legion1979
Justiriser
Posts: 15853
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:45 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Legion1979 »

Terasawa wrote: Tue Jul 12, 2022 7:44 am
Godzilla21 wrote: Tue Jul 12, 2022 7:28 am I also didn't care too much about the image not being the 54. I remember some absolute meltdowns when it was released. To me what really matters is the presentation of the film.
Same here. They could have had a pop-out of the Godzilla vs. Megalon tail slide and it would have been OK with me because the disc was so good.
Yes, absolutely.

But I don't think that changes the fact that there's till a difference in the packaging between the 54 disc and the Showa set. If you're crazy enough to be outraged....well, I guess it doesn't matter. Crazy is crazy.

User avatar
Great Hierophant
Interpol Agent
Posts: 410
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2013 9:38 pm
Contact:

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Great Hierophant »

I am sure this has been asked already, but searching for the answer would be difficult. If you have the Arrow sets, is there anything unique on the DVDs put out by ADV or Tokyo Shock (Gamera the Brave) or the Mill Creek Blu-rays that will not be found on the Arrow discs? I'd like to winnow out obsolete discs, but if there is something that should be extracted before doing so I'd really like to know. I do not care about trailers for other films that these distributors released.
Last edited by Great Hierophant on Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

goji1986
JXSDF Technician
Posts: 989
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2010 3:19 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by goji1986 »

Great Hierophant wrote: Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:26 pm I am sure this has been asked already, but searching for the answer would be difficult. If you have the Arrow sets, is there anything unique on the DVDs put out by ADV or Tokyo Shock (Gamera the Brave) or the Mill Creek Blu-rays that will not be found on the Arrow discs? I'd like to winnow out obsolete discs, but if there is something that should be extracted before doing so I'd really like to know. I do not care about trailers for other films that these distributors released.
You’ll find everything on this set that you could find on past releases.
PM me for Godzilla versus The Sea Monster Titra Dub HD reconstruction! BLURAY-READY EDITION NOW AVAILABLE!
(Former V2.0 still available as well)
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=5561

Godzilla vs The Smog Monster AIP Dub HD reconstruction COMPLETE!
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=26132

User avatar
Great Hierophant
Interpol Agent
Posts: 410
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2013 9:38 pm
Contact:

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by Great Hierophant »

goji1986 wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 5:32 am You’ll find everything on this set that you could find on past releases.
Thank you, now I can donate these DVDs to a needy kaiju-loving family without any regrets!

Did Arrow ever fix the sync issue with the English dub on Gamera The Brave? I think the Media Blasters DVD which I have does not have any sync issues.

User avatar
SpiderZilla
Monarch Researcher
Posts: 378
Joined: Sun May 08, 2022 10:14 am

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by SpiderZilla »

Great Hierophant wrote: Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:26 pm If you have the Arrow sets, is there anything unique on the DVDs put out by ADV or Tokyo Shock (Gamera the Brave) or the Mill Creek Blu-rays that will not be found on the Arrow discs?
The Lake Texarkana dub track of Gamera 2 on ADV’s DVD box set does not match the one on Arrow’s Blu-ray box set (I have both and the DVD version is MUCH funnier IMO), but you can find the former online if you want to sell / donate the DVD.

mikelcho
EDF Instructor
Posts: 2593
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:23 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by mikelcho »

SpiderZilla wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:04 am
Great Hierophant wrote: Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:26 pm If you have the Arrow sets, is there anything unique on the DVDs put out by ADV or Tokyo Shock (Gamera the Brave) or the Mill Creek Blu-rays that will not be found on the Arrow discs?
The Lake Texarkana dub track of Gamera 2 on ADV’s DVD box set does not match the one on Arrow’s Blu-ray box set (I have both and the DVD version is MUCH funnier IMO), but you can find the former online if you want to sell / donate the DVD.
Question: I have The Gamera Trilogy Blu-ray release of all three films. Is the "Lake Texarkana Gamera" dub track on this release the same one as the one on the A.D. Vision DVD box set? Because if it is, I've got to hear it just to see how funny it really is.
Last edited by mikelcho on Sun Aug 14, 2022 8:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
StreamOfKaijuness
Monarch Researcher
Posts: 289
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2020 6:18 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by StreamOfKaijuness »

The Lake Texarkana dub track included on Arrow's Gamera 2 blu-ray disc is the same feature-length audio track from ADV's limited edition Gamera 2 DVD.

From the Toho Kingdom interview with Arrow's James Flower published in August 2020:
So im curious as apparently some fans have noticed that the Texarkana dub isn’t the full version as it’s missing portions of the redneck dub where it reverts back to the regular dub. When there is a version where it shouldn’t. Any chance of a plan to fix that issue?

Regarding the Texarkana dub, it’s been established that the version on YouTube was never released to disc and its origins are unknown. We just included the only version that was made available to us, which was the full version previously released on ADV’s DVD, which does not dub all the actors in the film.

I only have ADV's original G2 DVD which features Lake Texarkana Gamera as a 13-minute digest version of the movie among the special features. My hunch is when ADV reauthored their G2 DVD for their limited edition box set and they turned Lake Texarkana Gamera into a feature-length audio track, they didn't get the voice actors to record additional parody dialogue but simply melded the dialogue from those 13 minutes of scenes with the rest of their existing English dub to produce an alternate audio option for viewing the movie.

The version on YouTube that has parody dialogue throughout the whole movie was probably made by whichever fans first uploaded it to YouTube.
Image

User avatar
SpiderZilla
Monarch Researcher
Posts: 378
Joined: Sun May 08, 2022 10:14 am

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by SpiderZilla »

mikelcho wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:01 pm Question: I have The Gamera Trilogy Blu-ray release of all three films. Is the "Lake Texarcana Gamera" dub track on this release the same one as the one on the A.D. Vision DVD box set? Because if it is, I've got to hear it just to see how funny it really is.
Do you mean the Gamera Trilogy Blu-ray box set that Mill Creek put out in 2011 on 2 discs where the 1st disc had the first two movies and the 2nd disc had the third movie and all the box set’s bonus materials? I have that box set too (yes I am embarrassed to say that I have 3 box sets of the same 3 movies) but I can’t find the Lake Texarkana Gamera dub anywhere on that box set. Are you sure it’s there?

Of my 3 box sets, only ADV’s DVD box set has what I would call the “full” Lake Texarkana Gamera dub. Arrow’s Blu-ray box set has a “lite” version and Mill Creek’s Blu-ray box set doesn’t have it at all. But you can also find the “full” version online if you look.

BTW, I have heard that ADV’s Gamera 2 DVD which was released for individual sale has only a few minutes of the dub. The full dub was only released in the box set so be careful if you try to purchase a used version of the movie to listen to the dub.

User avatar
SpiderZilla
Monarch Researcher
Posts: 378
Joined: Sun May 08, 2022 10:14 am

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by SpiderZilla »

StreamOfKaijuness wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:50 pm The Lake Texarkana dub track included on Arrow's Gamera 2 blu-ray disc is the same feature-length audio track from ADV's limited edition Gamera 2 DVD.
I have both box sets and I am certain that the dub tracks do not match. Both tracks are feature length. Arrow’s version has SOME of the same lines from ADV’s version and in a few places has different jokes, but Arrow’s version is the weaker of the two IMO.
StreamOfKaijuness wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:50 pm The version on YouTube that has parody dialogue throughout the whole movie was probably made by whichever fans first uploaded it to YouTube.
I can’t be certain which version you heard on YouTube but the version I am thinking of matched the version on my ADV DVD box set.

mikelcho
EDF Instructor
Posts: 2593
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:23 pm

Re: Gamera Arrow Limited Edition set

Post by mikelcho »

SpiderZilla wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:10 pm
mikelcho wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:01 pm Question: I have The Gamera Trilogy Blu-ray release of all three films. Is the "Lake Texarkana Gamera" dub track on this release the same one as the one on the A.D. Vision DVD box set? Because if it is, I've got to hear it just to see how funny it really is.
Do you mean the Gamera Trilogy Blu-ray box set that Mill Creek put out in 2011 on 2 discs where the 1st disc had the first two movies and the 2nd disc had the third movie and all the box set’s bonus materials? I have that box set too (yes I am embarrassed to say that I have 3 box sets of the same 3 movies) but I can’t find the Lake Texarkana Gamera dub anywhere on that box set. Are you sure it’s there?

Of my 3 box sets, only ADV’s DVD box set has what I would call the “full” Lake Texarkana Gamera dub. Arrow’s Blu-ray box set has a “lite” version and Mill Creek’s Blu-ray box set doesn’t have it at all. But you can also find the “full” version online if you look.

BTW, I have heard that ADV’s Gamera 2 DVD which was released for individual sale has only a few minutes of the dub. The full dub was only released in the box set so be careful if you try to purchase a used version of the movie to listen to the dub.
Yes, that's the one I've got. I'll have to check it out, I guess.

UPDATE: I just looked up Gamera 3: Revenge of Iris on its page in the DVD/Blu-ray section and you're right, the Lake Texarkana Gamera dub isn't listed as being on the contents of the bonus features disc.

Btw, (if any mods or admins see this post) while I was looking there, I noticed that the page for The Gamera Trilogy Blu-ray box set from 2011 is not mentioned in the Blu-ray releases of said section. Can someone please put it in there? Thanks!
Last edited by mikelcho on Sun Aug 14, 2022 8:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Post Reply