The Reiwa Era and Godzilla Movie Grouping

[M.U.T.O.]

With the news out of Japan today that the new Imperial Era shall be called the Reiwa Era, what do you think this means for how we refer to these eras of Godzilla movies? Or will it matter at all?

I don't really have anything more to add. Just...discuss as you wish.

[Mr_Goji_and_Watch]

I hope it's common to group Shin and the Anime trilogy with Heisei, I'd be nice to round that one off with some good films. Going from stagnant films to a creative turning point that serves as a jumping off point for the next series makes sense. I expect the World of Godzilla films to be wildly different from those two, and as the first cinematic universe (that is actually being planned) from Toho it's an inherently stark contrast from the past two decades of Japanese Godzilla films which were mostly standalone experiences. The Monsterverse is a bit iffy, but it's continuing into this new era as a universe so you might as well lump G14 into it

To make it simpler, the Heisei era of the genre should be defined by it's trilogies, standalone films, and the transitions from practical to CGI starting back in 1992, while the Reiwa era's first Godzilla film will literally be in the Monsterverse and have a Japanese cinematic universe in a couple of years. 2014 would be the odd one out but you might as well group it with the new era like you do with 84 as it's connected to the first films in that time period.

Oh yeah and Shin is a time capsule for the 3/11 disasters, it thrives in the context of it. That's already a defining moment for the Heisei era, and to pull an 84 with it and associate it with future Reiwa Godzilla films would be odd

[G2000]

With the news out of Japan today that the new Imperial Era shall be called the Reiwa Era, what do you think this means for how we refer to these eras of Godzilla movies? Or will it matter at all?

I don't really have anything more to add. Just...discuss as you wish.

I think trying to group them by imperial era is fallacious in the first place, because then you wind up with odd ones out like Godzilla '84

That being said, as time goes on I might could see the "Millennium series" get lumped in with the Heisei era; not just because they were in the Heisei era proper, but because in terms of suitmation effects they really weren't all that different from the Heisei era, and there was only a five-year gap between them in the first place (that wasn't even really a gap because you had the Rebirth of Mothra and the Gamera trilogies to fill it).

Meanwhile I could see G14, Shin, and perhaps the anime series getting lumped into the Reiwa period, in part because there was a definite shift from using suits, miniatures, soundstages, and other traditional tokusatsu effects to using CGI

[LSD Jellyfish]

I meant to reply to this earlier.

Anyways, basing the eras on the imperial situation is pointless, other then the showa era, and maybe Heisei era. The era names are not perfect, and not exact anyways. I’ve heard, that the “Heisei” series is just called the vs series. And if we really get technical, what separates Shin from the Millenium series? Why isn’t shin included there? I know the answer, because really the differentiation of Japanese eras is overarching theme, but what really?

The simplest thing to do, is just call everything G14 onwards, maybe until the world of Godzilla, it’s own era.
Shin is an easy name as it just means “new”. New describes the Legendary Trio, the Anime Trio and Shin rather effectively. Obviously, Reiwa will last a while, so let’s save that for WOG?

Showa (1954-1975)
Heisei (1984-1995/8)
Millennium(1999-2004)
Shin(2014-2020)KG14-GVK
Reiwa-Anything post GVK

[Dr. Professor]

The simplest thing to do, is just call everything G14 onwards, maybe until the world of Godzilla, it’s own era.
Shin is an easy name as it just means “new”. New describes the Legendary Trio, the Anime Trio and Shin rather effectively. Obviously, Reiwa will last a while, so let’s save that for WOG?

Showa (1954-1975)
Heisei (1984-1995/8)
Millennium(1999-2004)
Shin(2014-2020)KG14-GVK
Reiwa-Anything post GVK

This sounds good to me.

[CCMan]

I mean, it's all academic anyway but it is cool to finally have a name to call the new stuff. I feel like the Monsterverse should be listed separately though since it seems odd to group the America series based on the Japanese political situation.

[omgitsgodzilla]

In my opinion, the Japanese eras really only make sense as a classification for the Japanese films, so I personally don't take the American films into account with regard to the eras.

My thinking is, if considering Return of Godzilla a Heisei film despite coming out a good five years before the start of the Heisei era is fair game, it seems like roping Shin and the anime trilogy into Reiwa makes sense as well. More sense than considering them their own era, anyway.

What makes the most sense to me, though, is doing what Japanese fans do and... actually using the era names properly. I've talked with a Japanese Godzilla fan I follow on Twitter (as well as consulting the Japanese Wikipedia article listings) and what I was told is that Showa Godzilla, as one might expect, covers the 1954 film up through the 1984 film. Heisei Godzilla is all Godzilla films produced during the Heisei era, meaning the VS series, the Millennium series, Shin Godzilla and anime Godzilla are all Heisei.

(Return of Godzilla, while part of the VS series, is still considered a Showa-era film -- instead of extending the Heisei era backwards for the purposes of the series' name, the VS series is simply acknowledged as covering the boundary between Showa and Heisei.)

Realistically, the existing terminology is pretty entrenched, but I think adopting the Japanese system would make more sense than the current system and clear up the confusion about where the new era starts -- anything Toho puts out after Godzilla vs. Kong is Reiwa Godzilla, and anything from Biollante up until then is Heisei, possibly falling into one sub-series or another.

[Shoopwoop17]

While using the Imperial eras is good for timing, '54-'75, '84-'95, '99-'05, and '14-onward all have their own distinct feel. Admittedly, the fact that the Monsterverse, Shin, and the Anime trilogy are all so different makes it hard to lump them together, maybe the fact that they are all so distinct gives cause for them to be lumped together.

Also, it probably doesn't need to be said, but this is in no way an April fools joke, right?

[UltramanGoji]

I don't like using the Imperial system to classify the films because it doesn't actually take any of the films into account, just the times they were released in.

1954 - 1980 is it's own distinct era. To me, that's the Showa era of Godzilla and the kaiju genre as a whole, from Godzilla (1954) all the way up to Ultraman 80. G84 does not get thrown into that, even if it came out during the true Imperial Showa era because it just isn't the same as those other films. It's the first film of the second Godzilla series, which continued on into the Imperial Heisei era. Heisei to me, is 1984 - 1998. Gamera 3 has a similar effect; it's technically part of my time range for the Millenium era but I throw it back into the Heisei era because it's the final chapter of a series that started in the Heisei Era. To disconnect it purely because of the time range would just be silly.

These are my personal eras for the entire kaiju genre:
- The Proto-Kaiju Era (1925 - 1953): Not really an era as there isn't any real kaiju films yet, it encompasses all sorts of inspirations for what will eventually become the genre.
- The Showa Era (1954 - 1980): The "Golden Age", where nearly every Japanese studio tried their hand at the genre. Begins with G54 and ends with Ultraman 80.
- The Heisei Era (1984 - 1998): The "Silver Age", not much competition for the Godzilla series but you still have stuff like the beginning of Heisei-era Ultraman and the Gamera trilogy. Gamera 3, as mentioned before, is thrown in for continuity's sake.
- The Millenium Era (1999 - 2006): The "Bronze Age", mostly notable for the advancements in technology which allowed for more ambitious effects and for information to travel faster around the world. End is signaled with the release of Gamera: The Brave which did not perform well at the box office, making it the last "tentpole" kaiju film for the years to come.
- The Wilderness Era (2007 - 2012): Named after a similar period in the Doctor Who fandom, this era saw virtually no new films from the bigger names of the genre (even Ultraman was held up by a spin-off show focusing solely on the monsters) and the release of more independently produced films and one-shots like Cloverfield. End of this era coincides with the announcement that Legendary Pictures secured the rights for a new Godzilla film.
- The Resurgence Era (2013 - Likely 2020): The current era, this one starts with Pacific Rim which arguably put the term "kaiju" into the mainstream and kickstarted a "resurgence" of new kaiju media. Of course, you can probably give the true praise to the 2014 Godzilla film which jumpstarted more new stuff than Pacific Rim, but I digress. The Resurgence Era will likely end with 2020's Godzilla vs. Kong which is being framed as the "finale" of the MonsterVerse. Toho's Shin and the Anime films came about as a result of the 2014 Godzilla film and it's hard to classify them as the beginning of the "Reiwa Era" when they've been relatively self-contained pieces. World of Godzilla will probably be the first "true" series in the Reiwa Era for me.

[eabaker]

- The Heisei Era (1984 - 1998): The "Silver Age", not much competition for the Godzilla series but you still have stuff like the beginning of Heisei-era Ultraman and the Gamera trilogy. Gamera 3, as mentioned before, is thrown in for continuity's sake.
- The Millenium Era (1999 - 2006)

Gamera 3 was released in March of 1999, while G2K was released in December, so there's a perfectly clear break between eras if we simply say that the Heisei era ends in March of '99 and the Millennium era begins the following December.

- The Resurgence Era (2013 - Likely 2020): The current era, this one starts with Pacific Rim which arguably put the term "kaiju" into the mainstream

That's a strangely Americentric point to apply to a primarily Japanese genre, unless your point is that this signals the beginning of greater significance to American genre output.

[UltramanGoji]

Gamera 3 was released in March of 1999, while G2K was released in December, so there's a perfectly clear break between eras if we simply say that the Heisei era ends in March of '99 and the Millennium era begins the following December.

Fair, if one wants to interpret it that way I can definitely agree that there's a break.

That's a strangely Americentric point to apply to a primarily Japanese genre, unless your point is that this signals the beginning of greater significance to American genre output.

Kind of? It's a really sophomoric reason, but I saw a lot more Western "nerd culture" outlets using the term "kaiju" and things like Marvel's American Kaiju character and the Kaijumax comic series popped up after Pacific Rim was released. It made me realize that Pacific Rim kind of popularized the term "kaiju" outside of the fandom and in its home country, if that makes sense.

I probably phrased it poorly, I didn't mean to imply that PR made the word "kaiju" more mainstream everywhere, just in the context of the Western general audience.

[omgitsgodzilla]

While using the Imperial eras is good for timing, '54-'75, '84-'95, '99-'05, and '14-onward all have their own distinct feel. Admittedly, the fact that the Monsterverse, Shin, and the Anime trilogy are all so different makes it hard to lump them together, maybe the fact that they are all so distinct gives cause for them to be lumped together.

I hear what you're saying, but if Sentai and Rider fans still find the Heisei era a useful category despite stretching, in Sentai's case, from the end of Liveman through the beginning of Ryusoulger, I think Godzilla fans can deal with a few disparate takes on the franchise being categorized together. I suspect as the Heisei era becomes more distant the commonalities between the VS series, Millennium series and post-Millennium films will become more apparent, not that it needs to be hard and fast anyway -- the eras are like decades, they're arbitrary divisions that sometimes roughly align with certain cultural and historical shifts.

Basically, I'm of the opinion that the Imperial era names aren't going anywhere, so we should try to apply them correctly instead of getting rid of them, and use names like VS/Versus, Millennium and so on when we're specifying a shorter span of the series' history than the actual Heisei period.

[Terasawa]

Toho's FX films from Godzilla vs. Hedorah to The War in Space all feel very different from the '50s and '60s films yet fans have no problem classifying those together. The '84 to '04 films cover several different film continuities but with the exception of one were all made in the same Imperial era and with much of the same personnel behind the camera.

There's no great solution but I think omgitsgodzilla's approach works best. The VS, Millennium, and anime series are all part of the greater Heisei era of Godzilla.

[Mr_Goji_and_Watch]

Realistically, the existing terminology is pretty entrenched, but I think adopting the Japanese system would make more sense than the current system and clear up the confusion about where the new era starts -- anything Toho puts out after Godzilla vs. Kong is Reiwa Godzilla, and anything from Biollante up until then is Heisei, possibly falling into one sub-series or another.

Yeah, it's pretty messy how western fans arbitrarily split and extend what we call eras, for the sake of ease we should follow the actual system. We should do what Japanese, toku, and Gamera fans have been doing for decades and call everything from 1989 to 2019 the Heisei era. No split between 1998 and 1999. It's a bit silly how we associate the name of a 30 year long era to a line of 7 flicks made in the span of 11 years.

[Arbok]

We should do what Japanese, toku, and Gamera fans have been doing for decades and call everything from 1989 to 2019 the Heisei era.

What you are referring to IS the Heisei era. If you are talking about the Heisei series, a lot of Japanese fans actually use the name "versus series" when talking about the Godzilla movies from 1984-1995. This is fan coined, although Toho was aware of it and probably tried to help them out for the 1999-2004 films by going with the X approach, although I never saw a hint it caught on in the same way.

No split between 1998 and 1999. It's a bit silly how we associate the name of a 30 year long era to a line of 7 flicks made in the span of 11 years.

You're going to have to make a case to Toho. As long as Toho continues to define the 1984-1995 films as the Heisei Godzilla series and the 1999-2004 films as the Millennium Godzilla series, fans will as well, and there is evidence of them still doing this in 2017 after Godzilla Resurgence was released.

[Mr_Goji_and_Watch]

What you are referring to IS the Heisei era.

Yeah, that's the point. No need to label one series with the name of the era it's in, we'd be much better off with sub-series names like VS and Millennium and use the Heisei name to encompass all of the film in it's span. Shifting around labels like western fans did with 84 and continuing that with Shin and the anime trilogy would be silly.

[Arbok]

Shifting around labels like western fans did with 84...

Toho considers The Return of Godzilla (1984) to be the start of the Heisei series. This is passed down and noted in merchandise, from books to video games and in both English and Japanese.

Just making sure that's clear, that it's not a fan coined aspect by "western fans", but something that comes from Toho and fans use as a result of that.

[MandaSaurus]

I take it that a new Emperor has been crowned? What's his full name?

EDIT: Ah, I looked it up. Naruhito, Crown Prince of Japan, Son of Emperor Akihito, who abdicated on April 30 and will be known as Emperor Heisei, after his passing. The Reiwa Era begins today, and Naruhito will be crowned on May 1, 2019.

Hey, this sort of stuff doesn't happen every day! Wonder if Trump will be attending the Coronation? Hope so...

[Arbok]

I take it that a new Emperor has been crowned? What's his full name?

Naruhito, the son of current emperor Akihito and grandson of Hirohito. Akihito is still emperor until April 30th.

As for his full name... I believe it's just Naruhito, unlike his father whose full name was Tsugu Akihito before becoming just Akihito.

[LegendZilla]

Shall we speculate what the era after Naruhito could be called? I like Chobun, meaning “long culture” as well as Angai, meaning “Peace Triumphant”.