Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

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godjacob
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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby godjacob » Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:51 pm

I have one question between both movies, why the hell do these aliens seem to know so little about their own creation? They rely on a human to fix their own machine on two occasions and even let the doctor's daughter have full control over it here.
Last edited by godjacob on Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby eabaker » Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:59 pm

godjacob wrote:I have one question between both movies, why the hell do these aliens seem to know so little about their own creation? They rely on a human to fix their own machine on two occasions and even let the doctor's daughter have full control over it here.


At least in the first one, part of the reason is that Kuronuma doesn't want headquarters to know that they bungled their initial attack, so he uses a human scientist to avoid having to report back.
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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby godjacob » Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:02 pm

eabaker wrote:
godjacob wrote:I have one question between both movies, why the hell do these aliens seem to know so little about their own creation? They rely on a human to fix their own machine on two occasions and even let the doctor's daughter have full control over it here.


At least in the first one, part of the reason is that Kuronuma doesn't want headquarters to know that they bungled their initial attack, so he uses a human scientist to avoid having to report back.


Couldn't they just fix it and not report back? I figure if evil aliens are willing to have someone do labor to avoid reporting a boo boo they wouldn't be above just lying about its status or just not mentioning it got damaged.

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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:07 pm

godjacob wrote:I have one question between both movies, why the hell do these aliens seem to know so little about their own creation? They rely on a human to fix their own machine on two occasions and even let the doctor's daughter have full control over it here.

I don't have an exact reason for GvMG, but in the context of TOMG, placing the control of MG inside Katsura actually made a lot of sense. Often I forget it, but it was them responding to the issues with MG in the previous film. Having a base where they were stuck to made them vulnerable. During the climax of the film, a big plot point is interpol entering a deserted base, only to find that it's an elaborate trap. Another big part of Dr. Mafune, and why Katsura was chosen, was because of Titanosaurus. It gave Mafune an explicit reason to not betray the aliens. First, they "saved her", and second if Mafune wanted to disable MechaGodzilla he would have to kill his own daughter. Titanosaurus was an instrumental part of their plan to kill Godzilla, as Titanosaurus works well as a partner to MG as it compensates for some of it's weaknesses.

Katsura being chosen as a vessel to control MG2 might seem convoluted, and it is, but in the context of the film it makes a lot of sense. What they didn't expect, was for Katsura and Dr. Ichinose to fall in love. It's great IMO.
Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
_JNavs_ wrote:The MV is like cheap imitation crabmeat, it tastes good, but it isn't real, while Shin is kino peak Japanese performance.

Rodan95 wrote:The Shobijin are sat on by a fatass explorer and killed. Mothra is pissed and destroys Japan.

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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby godjacob » Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:16 pm

LSD Jellyfish wrote:
godjacob wrote:I have one question between both movies, why the hell do these aliens seem to know so little about their own creation? They rely on a human to fix their own machine on two occasions and even let the doctor's daughter have full control over it here.

I don't have an exact reason for GvMG, but in the context of TOMG, placing the control of MG inside Katsura actually made a lot of sense. Often I forget it, but it was them responding to the issues with MG in the previous film. Having a base where they were stuck to made them vulnerable. During the climax of the film, a big plot point is interpol entering a deserted base, only to find that it's an elaborate trap. Another big part of Dr. Mafune, and why Katsura was chosen, was because of Titanosaurus. It gave Mafune an explicit reason to not betray the aliens. First, they "saved her", and second if Mafune wanted to disable MechaGodzilla he would have to kill his own daughter. Titanosaurus was an instrumental part of their plan to kill Godzilla, as Titanosaurus works well as a partner to MG as it compensates for some of it's weaknesses.

Katsura being chosen as a vessel to control MG2 might seem convoluted, and it is, but in the context of the film it makes a lot of sense. What they didn't expect, was for Katsura and Dr. Ichinose to fall in love. It's great IMO.


And that's fine, but the aliens seem to ignore a glaring weakness with this. If anything happens to Katsura, even on accident, they lose MG. If an enemy came in who didn't care for Katsura and just shot her while attacking the aliens they are kinda screwed over. Seems a bit risky just to keep Mafune in line.

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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby Terasawa » Mon Jan 06, 2020 6:42 pm

Because, dramatically, these are the stories the writers wanted to tell.
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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Mon Jan 06, 2020 6:56 pm

I like Katsura being the MG controller a lot more than later incarnations where MG because a stock standard bland mecha.
_JNavs_ wrote:The MV is like cheap imitation crabmeat, it tastes good, but it isn't real, while Shin is kino peak Japanese performance.

Rodan95 wrote:The Shobijin are sat on by a fatass explorer and killed. Mothra is pissed and destroys Japan.

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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby godjacob » Mon Jan 06, 2020 7:04 pm

LSD Jellyfish wrote:I like Katsura being the MG controller a lot more than later incarnations where MG because a stock standard bland mecha.


I wouldn't exactly call Kiryu a bland mecha...

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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby HedorahIsBestGirl » Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:36 am

godjacob wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:I like Katsura being the MG controller a lot more than later incarnations where MG because a stock standard bland mecha.


I wouldn't exactly call Kiryu a bland mecha...

I wouldn't either, but having Mechagodzilla be controlled by one of the film's main characters, leading to a tragic ending where she is forced to kill herself to shut it down, is one of the best narratives in the whole Godzilla series. Kiryu being possessed by the spirit of Godzilla is interesting, but honestly makes a lot less sense than a controller being inserted inside of a cyborg if we're going to start questioning the logic of these movies.

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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby godjacob » Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:22 am

HedorahIsBestGirl wrote:
godjacob wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:I like Katsura being the MG controller a lot more than later incarnations where MG because a stock standard bland mecha.


I wouldn't exactly call Kiryu a bland mecha...

I wouldn't either, but having Mechagodzilla be controlled by one of the film's main characters, leading to a tragic ending where she is forced to kill herself to shut it down, is one of the best narratives in the whole Godzilla series. Kiryu being possessed by the spirit of Godzilla is interesting, but honestly makes a lot less sense than a controller being inserted inside of a cyborg if we're going to start questioning the logic of these movies.


In theory it could be, but for me the film doesn't do much to really get you to fully sympathize with Katsura and that relationship she has the lead so I never got the emotional hook the filmmakers intended. Doesn't help she has love for a father whose motivation for wanting to destroy the world is a bit over the top and hard to get behind.

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Re: Talkback: Terror of Mechagodzilla (1975)

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:26 pm

HedorahIsBestGirl wrote:
godjacob wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:I like Katsura being the MG controller a lot more than later incarnations where MG because a stock standard bland mecha.


I wouldn't exactly call Kiryu a bland mecha...

I wouldn't either, but having Mechagodzilla be controlled by one of the film's main characters, leading to a tragic ending where she is forced to kill herself to shut it down, is one of the best narratives in the whole Godzilla series. Kiryu being possessed by the spirit of Godzilla is interesting, but honestly makes a lot less sense than a controller being inserted inside of a cyborg if we're going to start questioning the logic of these movies.

The fact that Godzilla's bones are in Kiryu is so underdeveloped and plays little to no part in the film. Kiryu goes berserk once, and then runs out of power, only to be later used as if little happened. In the sequel, there's something Shintoistic regarding returning the bones to the sea, but Mothra quickly stops caring and it's abandoned.

Meanwhile, in TOMG, Katsura is the focus of the film, serving both as a direct antagonist and love interest for the hero, as well as being the daughter of one of the antagonists. It's one of the most interesting character dynamics ever, and is fully realized as her being a cyborg directly ties into the ending.

Sure, Kiryu being made from Godzilla is interesting on paper, but TOMG does way more with it.
_JNavs_ wrote:The MV is like cheap imitation crabmeat, it tastes good, but it isn't real, while Shin is kino peak Japanese performance.

Rodan95 wrote:The Shobijin are sat on by a fatass explorer and killed. Mothra is pissed and destroys Japan.


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