Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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LSD Jellyfish
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Legion1979 wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 9:12 am Varan proved that there wasn't going to be much of a future for routine "monster on the loose" films at Toho. Not unless they shook things up a bit. Note there wasn't even a giant monster film for a few years after Varan. Mothra, with its fantasy flair, gave the genre a shot in the arm, and King Kong vs Godzilla changed everything.
It's interesting considering that for a brief bit, Toho was producing way more straightforward SF and Horror films: the Mysterians (1957), The H-Man (1958) BIOS (1959), Secret of the Telegian, Human Vapor in 1960 etc... Maybe there's some alternate universe where Varan murdered the giant monster genre, and instead we'd wind up with Shin Human Vapor vs. the Invisible Man.

A lot of people, usually not on this site, seem to ignore completely that Toho was very busy between 55 and 62, pouring out a wealth of SF and monster movies and act like nothing was going on then.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Heh. For a lot of people the only films that matter are the Godzilla movies, which is really sad because there's so much else out there. When I pick my favorite era, i tend to factor in everything else Toho was doing during those times. There is absolutely nothing topping the classic period in terms of volume and creativity. What did we really get in the 90s aside from the Godzilla films? Yamato Takeru and a Mothra trilogy for 5 year-olds? And the "Millennium Era" is literally just 6 Godzilla films.

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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Legion1979 wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:15 pm Heh. For a lot of people the only films that matter are the Godzilla movies, which is really sad because there's so much else out there. When I pick my favorite era, i tend to factor in everything else Toho was doing during those times. There is absolutely nothing topping the classic period in terms of volume and creativity. What did we really get in the 90s aside from the Godzilla films? Yamato Takeru and a Mothra trilogy for 5 year-olds? And the "Millennium Era" is literally just 6 Godzilla films.
You could say similar things about how Toei had a sort of golden age of TV tokusatsu from roughly the late 1960s through about the mid-1990s, producing everything from Ganbare! Robocop to the various Fushigi Comedy Series entries to the Metal Hero Series. Now they mostly just stick to Kamen Rider and Super Sentai (though we did get a new theatrical Robocon special earlier this year).
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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LSD Jellyfish wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 6:57 pm
Legion1979 wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 9:12 am Varan proved that there wasn't going to be much of a future for routine "monster on the loose" films at Toho. Not unless they shook things up a bit. Note there wasn't even a giant monster film for a few years after Varan. Mothra, with its fantasy flair, gave the genre a shot in the arm, and King Kong vs Godzilla changed everything.
It's interesting considering that for a brief bit, Toho was producing way more straightforward SF and Horror films: the Mysterians (1957), The H-Man (1958) BIOS (1959), Secret of the Telegian, Human Vapor in 1960 etc... Maybe there's some alternate universe where Varan murdered the giant monster genre, and instead we'd wind up with Shin Human Vapor vs. the Invisible Man.

A lot of people, usually not on this site, seem to ignore completely that Toho was very busy between 55 and 62, pouring out a wealth of SF and monster movies and act like nothing was going on then.
I think some people tend to make assumptions based on what a studio is mainly known for. Universal did several sci fi movies in the 50s, but they made dramas, comedies, and others. Hammer is known for its horror, but did other things as well. When some hear Toho, they picture guys in suits wrecking miniature sets. Toho produced some excellent movies without giant monsters.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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^^That's true, and I wasn't intending to make a negative judgement of those that view Toho as only creating Godzilla/Kaiju films.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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LSD Jellyfish wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 6:57 pm A lot of people, usually not on this site, seem to ignore completely that Toho was very busy between 55 and 62, pouring out a wealth of SF and monster movies and act like nothing was going on then.
I mean, even if you ignore the genre output, this is widely regarded as the peak artistic and commercial period of Japanese cinema.

Probably not surprising then that of the four* Toho tokusatsu movies that made Kinema Junpo's 2009 critics' list of Top 200 Japanese Films, three were produced during that golden period (and only one had a giant monster in it):

The Human Vapor ('60)
Godzilla ('54)
The Last War ('61)
Imperial Navy ('81)

*House (1977) also made the list, but that's not really a "Toho tokusatsu movie" except by a very unconventional definition.

199/200 films are listed here. The one that's absent doesn't have an IMDb entry. The readers' list from the same year instead has only Godzilla ('54) and Submersion of Japan ('73) plus two Daiei films, Gamera: The Guardian of the Universe ('95) and Daimajin ('66).
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Legion1979 wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:15 pm What did we really get in the 90s aside from the Godzilla films? Yamato Takeru and a Mothra trilogy for 5 year-olds? And the "Millennium Era" is literally just 6 Godzilla films.
A couple Kurosawa and Ghibli films (Albeit, I believe they were only distributed by Toho? Not too sure on that one).
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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I didn't think Varan was in enough things to be considered "overrated"

Like a bit of an inflated fandom is all he has, let it have that lol
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Legion1979 wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:15 pm Heh. For a lot of people the only films that matter are the Godzilla movies, which is really sad because there's so much else out there. When I pick my favorite era, i tend to factor in everything else Toho was doing during those times. There is absolutely nothing topping the classic period in terms of volume and creativity. What did we really get in the 90s aside from the Godzilla films? Yamato Takeru and a Mothra trilogy for 5 year-olds? And the "Millennium Era" is literally just 6 Godzilla films.
I get what you're saying, but you can't really fault a Godzilla fan for only really caring about the non-Godzilla films, especially if they're not a hardcore fan like a lot of us here. I've known a few that have zero interest in Gamera and only watched Rodan and Mothra because of their eventual inclusion into Godzilla. Myself, for example, didn't get into Toho's non-kaiju offerings (except Matango...) until about 10 years ago, and even then, I've only seen a handful of their horror and pre-Star Wars era sci-fi films. I still wave the flag of H-Man being the best Toho horror film around. And I really have no interest in any of Toho's other genre films. I'm not into samurai movies, WW2 films, dramas nor old comedies.

Back to Varan, I 100% agree the film takes a nose dive once Varan takes to the sky and heads for a city for a reason never really explained. If it stuck to the mountains where the SDF had to contain him, I think it would have been so much better. Some of the scenes of Varan on all fours in the village and climbing the mountain look great and is clearly Tsuburaya at his top. One thing I also LOVE about Varan (both the monster and the movie), is that he is worshipped in the same style as Kong and Mothra would be later. However, he clearly has no interest/care in it and crushes his followers upon his awakening. He was just a big, dumb monster confused to be a God by scared humans. When he crushes that village elder preying for him to forgive everyone, that scene is just so well done.
Last edited by Mac Daddy MM on Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:19 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Major sssspielberg! wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 8:46 am Battle in Outer Space is awesome.
Alright, here's the real question: Varan or 6 Ultra Brothers vs the Monster Army? No wrong answers.
Regardless of what you think of the film (Personally, I think it's entertaining and a decent Ultraman movie, albeit I know that's a low bar), Hanuman vs. 7 Ultraman/Six Ultra Brothers vs. The Monster Army is considered a landmark film in Thailand's film history. Their industry was still at a pretty primitive stage, and not a whole lot of movies on that scope had been made before it. But I agree BIOS is awesome.

I don't think Varan is unwatchable as others have said, but it's easily the worst output from the Honda/Tsuburaya/Ifukube/Tanaka team. It's definitely a case where the production history (Originally intended to be a US television movie before being hastily reworked into a theatrical feature) is a lot more interesting than the movie itself. And while Varan himself is kind of fun, he falls flat when compared to Godzilla and Rodan before him. Can't say I've ever been clamoring for him to make any sort of "grand comeback" (But a cameo or supporting role would be cool).
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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All Varan has is his solo film and a couple of cameos in DAM. You could say he's the most famous obscure kaiju.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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edgaguirus wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:09 pm All Varan has is his solo film and a couple of cameos in DAM. You could say he's the most famous obscure kaiju.
He's also the first triphibian monster, long before the Gappas came along in 1967.

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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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mikelcho wrote: Tue Nov 30, 2021 4:53 am
edgaguirus wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:09 pm All Varan has is his solo film and a couple of cameos in DAM. You could say he's the most famous obscure kaiju.
He's also the first triphibian monster, long before the Gappas came along in 1967.
True. You' think that would win him a few points.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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edgaguirus wrote: Wed Dec 01, 2021 1:39 pm
mikelcho wrote: Tue Nov 30, 2021 4:53 am
edgaguirus wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:09 pm All Varan has is his solo film and a couple of cameos in DAM. You could say he's the most famous obscure kaiju.
He's also the first triphibian monster, long before the Gappas came along in 1967.
True. You' think that would win him a few points.
This isn't really a discussion about "him," thought; it's about the quality of the movie itself.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Also, technically, Godzilla is the first triphibian monster in Japanese cinema, we just didn't know that 'til 1971.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

Post by BiitoreinGoji94 »

I just watched the Japanese version of Varan on DVD thanks to Tokyo Shock. It's a straightforward story albeit with fluctuating pacing. The biggest issues I have are the professor saying Varan ate flares at the midpoint when we didn't see him eat one - and that one guy driving the truck with the mining bomb underneath Varan when it was made clear the bomb is most effective when detonated inside, so why not have Varan eat the truck and blow it up? Even then, when Varan ate two flares with bombs attached, why did one blow up inside him and not the other at the same time?

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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Mac Daddy MM wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 11:38 am It's been a while since I watched this, and perhaps it's coming off of watching Gappa right before it, but Varan isn't nearly as bad as I thought/remember it being. Yeah, it's no Mothra, Rodan or Godzilla... But I could lump it in with Mysterians and Atragon for sure. The actual scenes of Varan, I think, are highly underrated. The miniature work on Varan's valley is Tsuburaya at his top notch. The scene of him tearing through the mountain and entering the village is some of the best non-Godzilla miniature work in the Showa era, IMO.

I think the fact the production schedule behind the film was hindered so much is one of the reasons the final product isn't as good as it could have been. If it didn't have so many issues, I REALLY think Varan would have been able to stand on the same pedestal as other non-Godzilla Showa films like Rodan and FCTW.
Giant Monster Varan is alright. It's got some nice FX sequences, but it's just kinda dull and a bit of a chore to sit through. Varan the Unbelievable is pretty bad...somehow even slower that the first film, the American cast is just given absolutely nothing to do in the second half and spend a huge chunk of the movie fiddling with a radio while stock footage from the first movie plays.
Spuro wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 2:25 pm Sure, Varan is bad compared to other contemporary Toho sci fi films.

But then go and compare it to other low-budget monster movies from other countries in the 1950s. Compare Varan to The Deadly Mantis, to The Giant Claw, to Attack of the Crab Monsters or The Beginning of the End, or, god-forbid, to Teenagers from Outer Space.

Suddenly Varan doesn’t look so bad anymore. :lol:
I'll watch The Deadly Mantis before either Giant Monster Varan or Varan the Unbelievable any day! :lol: It's just a much better written, better paced, and overall more entertaining movie!

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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Terasawa wrote: Wed Dec 01, 2021 3:59 pm Also, technically, Godzilla is the first triphibian monster in Japanese cinema, we just didn't know that 'til 1971.
Touche.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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When you consider that this was never meant to be a movie, it's not surprising that it doesn't have the same feel or scale of the other solo kaiju films. However, they did manage to make a basic monster film that isn't perfect, but can be entertaining.
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Re: Varan - Underrated or is it *THAT* bad?

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Prefacing this by saying I adore Varan's design, one of my favorite daikaiju designs ever made.

Now, about the movie: I barely remember watching it, it was like a fever dream of things happening, of Varan terrorizing and people getting mad at him. I wouldn't go as far to say it was a waste of time, but it did not leave much of a mark aside from that title character's existence. Maybe I should rewatch it (it's been years), but it is a weird and strangely unmemorable movie.
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