The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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Which are your favorite installments in the Star Wars Saga?

Star Wars (1977, dir. George Lucas)
54
22%
The Empire Strikes Back (1980, dir. Irvin Kershner)
59
24%
Return of the Jedi (1983, dir. Richard Marquand)
50
20%
The Phantom Menace (1999, dir. Lucas)
6
2%
Attack of the Clones (2002, dir. Lucas)
5
2%
Revenge of the Sith (2005, dir. Lucas)
35
14%
The Force Awakens (2015, dir. J.J. Abrams)
4
2%
Rogue One (2016, dir. Gareth Edwards)
18
7%
The Last Jedi (2017, dir. Rian Johnson)
7
3%
Solo (2018, dir. Ron Howard)
2
1%
The Rise of Skywalker (2019, dir. J.J. Abrams)
4
2%
 
Total votes: 244

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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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Rando Yaguchi wrote: Sat May 22, 2021 9:45 pm The lightsaber duel in Phantom Menace is awesome.
Absolutely. One of the best of the entire franchise if I’m being honest
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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Anakin and Obi wan duel is the best for me.

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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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goji89 wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 7:30 am Anakin and Obi wan duel is the best for me.
Battle of the Heroes felt like a great bridge between the PT and the OT to me. A great finale for the orginal 6 films.
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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darthzilla99 wrote: Sat May 22, 2021 4:47 pm One PT criticism I have never understood is the lightsaber duels. Yeah, they are choreographed and are like a dance, but that's why I love martial arts fantasy. Not every strike has to be an attempt at a killing blow and as a karate guy myself, seeing fantasy Katas is fun.
I have so many thoughts on this but I don’t have time to type them all right now. And y’all probably don’t want like a 10 page wall of text anyway…

To give a little background, I was in the (Olympic style) fencing club in college, then practiced/competed in Kendo for over a decade, and currently train in Shinkage Ryu. I’ve also got some experience with AUSKF Iaido and Toyama Ryu Battojutsu. Ultimately I have nearly 20 years of experience in different sword arts and sports.

I can (and do) enjoy a good stage or movie sword fight. NONE of them are “realistic”. They all take liberties. But that’s ok.

The problem with the prequel fights is that they take so many liberties, and mind bogglingly inept liberties at that, that they step so far beyond the realm of any kind of reasonable suspension of disbelief (even for a magical space opera fantasy) as to become utterly preposterous. Even “in universe”. And I believe this ultimately stems from the choreographer (from what research on his background ive been able to dig up) having absolutely ZERO experience or training in any sort of sword art whatsoever.

It’s kinda like if you made a movie about the Indy 500 but instead of race cars, used toddlers on tricycles. Even if you managed to film an exciting, heart pounding race it would just feel completely off to anyone who actually has driven a car. That’s not a great example but it kind of conveys the feeling of watching the prequel choreography to me.

But hey, I don’t deny that the TPM fight is exciting and energetic (and has a great score!). It just doesn’t look anything like a sword fight. And it’s easily the best of the prequel fights (well, I actually like the quick duel in the desert between Qui-gon and Maul the best of the prequels, but I’ve written enough already).

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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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Obi wan killing Darth maul in the desert.... That was beauty.

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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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My biggest gripe with the prequels is the lackluster scripts and atrocious acting. As for the sequels most the hate seems to come from (at least The Last Jedi's case) preconceived notions of what Luke Skywalker should be. A ton of people's pointless attachments to SW media that honestly has no actual bearing on the films themselves. I mean how much of the Extended Universe stuff constantly contradicted itself or what happened in the films themselves. Not saying there aren't some legitimate complaints. Kylo Ren for example had little to no personality and Adam Driver's performance left a lot to be desired. He wasn't quite ATJ in G14 bad but he wasn't far off. Sadly the most interesting characters, Poe and Finn, were given hardly anything to do after TLJ from what I've heard.
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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Tyrant_Lizard_King wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 6:06 pm My biggest gripe with the prequels is the lackluster scripts and atrocious acting. As for the sequels most the hate seems to come from (at least The Last Jedi's case) preconceived notions of what Luke Skywalker should be. A ton of people's pointless attachments to SW media that honestly has no actual bearing on the films themselves. I mean how much of the Extended Universe stuff constantly contradicted itself or what happened in the films themselves. Not saying there aren't some legitimate complaints. Kylo Ren for example had little to no personality and Adam Driver's performance left a lot to be desired. He wasn't quite ATJ in G14 bad but he wasn't far off. Sadly the most interesting characters, Poe and Finn, were given hardly anything to do after TLJ from what I've heard.
Luke not acting like Grandmaster Skywalker is one thing but he didn't act like OT Luke either.
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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miguelnuva wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 6:16 pm
Tyrant_Lizard_King wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 6:06 pm My biggest gripe with the prequels is the lackluster scripts and atrocious acting. As for the sequels most the hate seems to come from (at least The Last Jedi's case) preconceived notions of what Luke Skywalker should be. A ton of people's pointless attachments to SW media that honestly has no actual bearing on the films themselves. I mean how much of the Extended Universe stuff constantly contradicted itself or what happened in the films themselves. Not saying there aren't some legitimate complaints. Kylo Ren for example had little to no personality and Adam Driver's performance left a lot to be desired. He wasn't quite ATJ in G14 bad but he wasn't far off. Sadly the most interesting characters, Poe and Finn, were given hardly anything to do after TLJ from what I've heard.
Luke not acting like Grandmaster Skywalker is one thing but he didn't act like OT Luke either.
I know we've been over this before, but TLJ Luke, to me, is a completely natural continuation of the emotional, impulsive, conflicted character we spent the OT with.
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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goji89 wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 5:31 pm Obi wan killing Darth maul in the desert.... That was beauty.
Absolute poetry. Perfect way to cap off Maul’s story.
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canofhumdingers wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 5:28 pmI can (and do) enjoy a good stage or movie sword fight. NONE of them are “realistic”. They all take liberties. But that’s ok.
This makes me curious of what a realistic swordfight would actually look like. Are there any movie swordfights you've seen that at least come close to being authentic?
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

Post by miguelnuva »

Rando Yaguchi wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 9:36 pm
canofhumdingers wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 5:28 pmI can (and do) enjoy a good stage or movie sword fight. NONE of them are “realistic”. They all take liberties. But that’s ok.
This makes me curious of what a realistic swordfight would actually look like. Are there any movie swordfights you've seen that at least come close to being authentic?
Real swordfights I hear are closer to old Obi-Wan vs Maul in Rebels.
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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Rando Yaguchi wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 9:36 pm
canofhumdingers wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 5:28 pmI can (and do) enjoy a good stage or movie sword fight. NONE of them are “realistic”. They all take liberties. But that’s ok.
This makes me curious of what a realistic swordfight would actually look like. Are there any movie swordfights you've seen that at least come close to being authentic?
There's a YouTube channel, Bjorn Ruther, that consists entirely of showing actual sword and halberd techniques in action. And several other channels, such as Shadiversity, Skallagrim, and scholagladiatoria, that can give you all kinds of other info on ancient and medieval weaponry and its uses. Shadiversity even has videos where he picks apart sword fights in media (including Star Wars) and analyzed their realism.
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

Post by canofhumdingers »

Those are entertaining channels, but use caution. The shadiversity guy will regularly admit he has zero experience or training with many (all?) of the weapons he then goes on to talk so “expertly” about.

A “realistic” sword fight depends on many factors. What type of swords are being used (are they designed for cutting, stabbing, or both?). Is anyone wearing armor or not? But in the end, they all share a few things in common: they are fast, intense, and brutal. And historically they were over VERY quickly (like one or two blows and it’s done). If the combatants had good armor the fight might last a bit longer, and would very likely end up in a grappling/wrestling match on the ground trying to use a dagger or something to exploit weak points or less protected areas.

I can’t speak for all styles but I do have nearly two decades of experience in sword arts starting with Olympic style fencing (not very historically accurate) and moving on to Kendo (a bit more historically accurate but still very much a sport), Toyama Ryu Batto Jutsu, and Shinkage Ryu (the last two are historically “accurate” for whatever that’s worth in that they are real combat sword arts that use real swords. Toyama Ryu was a school formed specifically to teach sword skills to the Imperial Japanese Army and Shinkage Ryu is an ancient school that goes back to the 1500’s but it has many branches and has continued to evolve over the centuries.).

Below I’ve linked a few videos showing more believable sword fights from various arts.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LHNPoSBJvn8

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=umzpmQ__XII

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=R149yynTTbE

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cyqFaS-7xJA

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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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Rando Yaguchi wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 9:36 pm
canofhumdingers wrote: Sun May 23, 2021 5:28 pmI can (and do) enjoy a good stage or movie sword fight. NONE of them are “realistic”. They all take liberties. But that’s ok.
This makes me curious of what a realistic swordfight would actually look like. Are there any movie swordfights you've seen that at least come close to being authentic?
Some of Kurosawa's earlier films. Basically if you see a sword fight that ends quickly, that would tend to be more "realistic", though his films have a lot of the more fantastical sword fights as well. Also, although it is animated, I still think of the final confrontation between old Obi-Wan and Maul in Star Wars Rebels.
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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There’s a lot more to it than just ending quickly, but yes, that is one thing that stage and film fights generally greatly exaggerate: they usually go on far too long (if realism is a desired goal. But that says nothing to dramatic effect, story pacing, and other things that real fights wouldn’t be concerned about).

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Interesting stuff, thanks guys.
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Re: The Official Star Wars Saga Thread

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So Star Wars is getting a bunny girl in that upcoming anime series. That's the point we have come to.
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JAGzilla wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:46 am So Star Wars is getting a bunny girl in that upcoming anime series. That's the point we have come to.
I'm glad I wasn't the only one who noticed, lol.
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Spuro wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 2:26 am
JAGzilla wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:46 am So Star Wars is getting a bunny girl in that upcoming anime series. That's the point we have come to.
I'm glad I wasn't the only one who noticed, lol.
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How could we, Hasbro thought it'd be a magnificent idea to make a Jaxxon 6 inch Black Series figure instead of the millions of other characters people have been clamoring for LOL

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JAGzilla wrote: Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:46 am So Star Wars is getting a bunny girl in that upcoming anime series. That's the point we have come to.
Not surprised, I'm waiting for Mickey to show up as a Grand Republic Jedi Master with the ability to hold 2 planets in his hands with just the force.

Speaking of, did you guys hear Disney went ahead and indirectly retconned Anakin's hobby of being an engineer during his slave days, and instead said if you're really good at building stuff, it's because you have a really rare Force ability. It's being introduced in the next High Republic novel, likely to explain why Rey can do so much with mechanics when she only ever scavenged dead cruisers.

They're turning the force into a Deus Ex Machina. (Or at least more so than it already was)
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