Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
- Chrispy_G
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
Yes sure, bootlegs of everything will always exist for the extremely low number of people interested/willing to go that route to watch a version of something they want to see.
But as far as the legal, official releases go...none of the fans, casual or hardcore, who buy officially released material will likely ever see any US versions outside of KOTM, KK v G(because we only seem to be able to get the US version for now), the US versions on the Classic Media DVDs, and G2K.
Although I do hope that hopefully one day Return of Godzilla and Godzilla 1985 get the same kind of special edition release that Criterion gave to the original film.
But I'm betting future Blu Ray(or, lord willing, 4K Blu Ray) releases will have more and more of a focus on the original cuts, and international dubs.
I'm just being practical, Toho will shell out to clean up and restore THEIR versions and likely make them available to US distribs who are interested in doing new releases....but those same US distribs are unlikely to give two shakes about spending such time/money/effort in restoring the US versions in the same way. OUTSIDE of a select few US versions like KOTM, G2K....maybe KKvG and 1985(if those rights issues are ever cleared up)...
Maybe if someone can convert some crazy billionaire into being a super die-hard kaiju fan...we'll get ultimate releases with every version and every dub/sub option available...all restored and cleaned up with the utmost care and respect. But again, we have to be practical here. "Bootlegs for life" when it comes to most of that stuff.
But as far as the legal, official releases go...none of the fans, casual or hardcore, who buy officially released material will likely ever see any US versions outside of KOTM, KK v G(because we only seem to be able to get the US version for now), the US versions on the Classic Media DVDs, and G2K.
Although I do hope that hopefully one day Return of Godzilla and Godzilla 1985 get the same kind of special edition release that Criterion gave to the original film.
But I'm betting future Blu Ray(or, lord willing, 4K Blu Ray) releases will have more and more of a focus on the original cuts, and international dubs.
I'm just being practical, Toho will shell out to clean up and restore THEIR versions and likely make them available to US distribs who are interested in doing new releases....but those same US distribs are unlikely to give two shakes about spending such time/money/effort in restoring the US versions in the same way. OUTSIDE of a select few US versions like KOTM, G2K....maybe KKvG and 1985(if those rights issues are ever cleared up)...
Maybe if someone can convert some crazy billionaire into being a super die-hard kaiju fan...we'll get ultimate releases with every version and every dub/sub option available...all restored and cleaned up with the utmost care and respect. But again, we have to be practical here. "Bootlegs for life" when it comes to most of that stuff.
"I'm saying a prayer, George. A prayer for the whole world."
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
You're like a broken record. The above post is full of things you've already said about a dozen times already. All of this shit is common sense.
UltramanGoji wrote: Cranky because you got mad I implied GFW isn't a good movie aren't you
Chrispy_G wrote:I'll say it one last time, Trump wins in a landslide.
I'll gladly eat crow if it doesn't turn out that way....but at this point it feels painfully obvious, as it has for months.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
At this point he's probably just being deliberately obtuse.
Moogabunga wrote:Ive said it before and I'll gladly say it again, this is going to be the best Godzilla film ever and more importantly, its going to be the film that truly makes Godzilla mainstream (and cool)
SoggyNoodles2016 wrote:I'm glad to be a fake fan.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
Can we change the title to "Comprehensive Guide to Hating Anything but the Original Japanese Versions," please?
寺沢. He/him/his, etc.
- A list of known Toho export dubs (a colossal, perpetual work in progress)
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- Chrispy_G
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
I don't hate anything but the original Japanese versions.
I really like King of the Monsters, Godzilla vs The Thing, and Godzilla 2000. Heck even Ghidrah the three headed monster is pretty solid, and Monster Zero.
It is Godzilla Raids Again and King Kong vs Godzilla that I really dislike...and the notion of considering Godzilla vs Hedorah with a different English dub and "Save the Earth" as a genuine, worthwhile, alternate version of the film.
I really like King of the Monsters, Godzilla vs The Thing, and Godzilla 2000. Heck even Ghidrah the three headed monster is pretty solid, and Monster Zero.
It is Godzilla Raids Again and King Kong vs Godzilla that I really dislike...and the notion of considering Godzilla vs Hedorah with a different English dub and "Save the Earth" as a genuine, worthwhile, alternate version of the film.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
A'ight. As per the threads original post regarding the point of this topic, see below;
To avoid mass deletion/pruning of posts and to try and keep to the topic at hand. Please move all movie discussion to the appropriate sub-forums and topics. Posts may otherwise end up vanishing and/or being moved.This guide is meant to organize all known English versions of the Toho-produced films into one comprehensive list. It is useful for new fans and people who are wondering exactly what English version they have. If you are confused by all the different English versions or know little to nothing about them, this guide simplifies matters. Basic information is included for each version.
- Great Hierophant
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
Best Official Versions of Theatrical/TV Releases :
Godzilla, King of the Monsters - Criterion Blu-ray
Gigantis the Fire Monster - Video Treasures VHS/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
Title Card/U.S. Alterations & Audio/Japanese Common Footage
King Kong vs. Godzilla - Universal Blu-ray
Godzilla vs. the Thing - Scimitar DVD/Toho Blu
Full Widescreen/Japanese Common Footage
Ghidrah, the Three-Headed Monster - Video Treasures or Anchor Bay VHS/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan/U.S. Alterations & Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Monster Zero - Scimitar DVD/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan/U.S. Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla versus the Sea Monster - Video Treasures or GoodTimes VHS/Kraken Blu-ray
True U.S. Print Scan, Alterations and Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Son of Godzilla - Video Treasures or Anchor Bay VHS/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan, Alterations and Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Destroy All Monsters - Kraken 2011 Blu-ray
AIP Dub Audio, Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla's Revenge - Scimitar DVD/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan/U.S. Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla vs. the Smog Monster - Orion VHS/Kraken Blu-ray
True U.S. Print Scan & Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla on Monster Island - Family Tyme VHS/Kraken Blu-ray
Title Card & Credits & Edits/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla vs. Megalon - Alpha Video DVD/Media Blasters "Mistake" DVD/Media Blasters Blu-ray
U.S. Edit Reference/Title Card & Credits & Edits/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla vs. the Cosmic Monster - GoodTimes VHS/Toho Blu
Title Card & Credits & Edits/Japanese Common Footage
Terror of Godzilla/Terror of Mechagodzilla - Classic Media 2002 DVD/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan/U.S. Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla 1985 - New World Pictures LD/Kraken Blu
U.S Alterations & Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla 2000 - Sony Blu-ray
From Ghidrah onward, reconstructions rear themselves. For Ghidrah, Monster Zero, Revenge and Terror, Classic Media used the Toho Japanese source wherever possible. Errors have been pointed out. While the old VHS tapes looked horrible and were panned and scanned, they were scanned from a true U.S. source. The U.S. TV or theatrical dubs for Sea Monster, Son, Smog Monster are only available in this form.
Godzilla, King of the Monsters - Criterion Blu-ray
Gigantis the Fire Monster - Video Treasures VHS/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
Title Card/U.S. Alterations & Audio/Japanese Common Footage
King Kong vs. Godzilla - Universal Blu-ray
Godzilla vs. the Thing - Scimitar DVD/Toho Blu
Full Widescreen/Japanese Common Footage
Ghidrah, the Three-Headed Monster - Video Treasures or Anchor Bay VHS/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan/U.S. Alterations & Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Monster Zero - Scimitar DVD/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan/U.S. Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla versus the Sea Monster - Video Treasures or GoodTimes VHS/Kraken Blu-ray
True U.S. Print Scan, Alterations and Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Son of Godzilla - Video Treasures or Anchor Bay VHS/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan, Alterations and Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Destroy All Monsters - Kraken 2011 Blu-ray
AIP Dub Audio, Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla's Revenge - Scimitar DVD/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan/U.S. Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla vs. the Smog Monster - Orion VHS/Kraken Blu-ray
True U.S. Print Scan & Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla on Monster Island - Family Tyme VHS/Kraken Blu-ray
Title Card & Credits & Edits/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla vs. Megalon - Alpha Video DVD/Media Blasters "Mistake" DVD/Media Blasters Blu-ray
U.S. Edit Reference/Title Card & Credits & Edits/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla vs. the Cosmic Monster - GoodTimes VHS/Toho Blu
Title Card & Credits & Edits/Japanese Common Footage
Terror of Godzilla/Terror of Mechagodzilla - Classic Media 2002 DVD/Classic Media 2006 DVD/Toho Blu
True U.S. Print Scan/U.S. Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla 1985 - New World Pictures LD/Kraken Blu
U.S Alterations & Audio/Japanese Common Footage
Godzilla 2000 - Sony Blu-ray
From Ghidrah onward, reconstructions rear themselves. For Ghidrah, Monster Zero, Revenge and Terror, Classic Media used the Toho Japanese source wherever possible. Errors have been pointed out. While the old VHS tapes looked horrible and were panned and scanned, they were scanned from a true U.S. source. The U.S. TV or theatrical dubs for Sea Monster, Son, Smog Monster are only available in this form.
- Goji
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
Hey GH, thanks for posting. This is definitely useful for the uninitiated, but I do have a couple of questions.
-Why are the Japanese (Toho) Blu-Ray's mentioned?
-What exactly do you mean by "Japanese Common Footage"?
-Why is the Kraken Blu of ROG mentioned, since it doesn't include G'85?
-Why are the Japanese (Toho) Blu-Ray's mentioned?
-What exactly do you mean by "Japanese Common Footage"?
-Why is the Kraken Blu of ROG mentioned, since it doesn't include G'85?
UltramanGoji wrote: Cranky because you got mad I implied GFW isn't a good movie aren't you
Chrispy_G wrote:I'll say it one last time, Trump wins in a landslide.
I'll gladly eat crow if it doesn't turn out that way....but at this point it feels painfully obvious, as it has for months.
- Great Hierophant
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
My idea was to put together a set of materials that would allow you to build your own English version using the best materials available. So, to take Gigantis the Fire Monster, if you want the footage in common between the U.S. and Japanese versions, you take the Toho Blu-ray (or the German one, it's cheaper But you need the Classic Media DVD for the English audio and the little bits (prologue, Dino footage, stock footage) and the VHS for the Gigantis the Fire Monster title. I didn't go further than the official sources.
Japanese common footage means that footage used in both the U.S. and Japanese versions. The best quality for that footage can usually be found on the Japanese Blu-rays at present. If Toho does a 4K scan of the Godzilla series, then there will be newer, higher quality materials.
Toho or Kraken's Blu would do equally well for G1985, Kraken's is much, much cheaper. The MonstersHD recording is the best available version for the U.S. bits, but it was not officially released on video, so the Laserdisc comes next. The Laserdisc really isn't useful for a fan reconstruction because it is Pan & Scan. I'm not sure there is an AIP Smog Monster version available that is not Pan and Scan.
Japanese common footage means that footage used in both the U.S. and Japanese versions. The best quality for that footage can usually be found on the Japanese Blu-rays at present. If Toho does a 4K scan of the Godzilla series, then there will be newer, higher quality materials.
Toho or Kraken's Blu would do equally well for G1985, Kraken's is much, much cheaper. The MonstersHD recording is the best available version for the U.S. bits, but it was not officially released on video, so the Laserdisc comes next. The Laserdisc really isn't useful for a fan reconstruction because it is Pan & Scan. I'm not sure there is an AIP Smog Monster version available that is not Pan and Scan.
- dannydangle
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
I made a similar list about collecting the best releases of every version of every godzilla film. It's here if anyone is interested or wants to give suggestions: https://rateyourmusic.com/list/wizenhym ... very-film/
- Great Hierophant
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
I made a somewhat different blog entry regarding the International versions as can be found on the most recent U.S. release of each film :
http://nerdlypleasures.blogspot.com/201 ... ssion.html
Warning, picture heavy.
A couple of questions :
1. What happened to the original credits on the Destroy All Monster releases? They are gone in the Media Blasters Blu-ray and the ADV Films DVD I own. What do they look like?
2. Does anyone have a picture of the International title for GvMGII?
3. Are the overlaid International titles on GvKG and GvM as non-descript as they appear on the Godzilla wiki? Those seem more appropriate for a P&S video release than a theatrical print.
http://nerdlypleasures.blogspot.com/201 ... ssion.html
Warning, picture heavy.
A couple of questions :
1. What happened to the original credits on the Destroy All Monster releases? They are gone in the Media Blasters Blu-ray and the ADV Films DVD I own. What do they look like?
2. Does anyone have a picture of the International title for GvMGII?
3. Are the overlaid International titles on GvKG and GvM as non-descript as they appear on the Godzilla wiki? Those seem more appropriate for a P&S video release than a theatrical print.
- Goji
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
Just so you know, as genuine as they may look initially, Son of GodzillaGreat Hierophant wrote:I made a somewhat different blog entry regarding the International versions as can be found on the most recent U.S. release of each film :
http://nerdlypleasures.blogspot.com/201 ... ssion.html
actually doesn't feature the original English credits. I believe they're seen on an old Castilian release. The title card isn't the original either, though they tried pretty hard to faithfully recreate it, I'll give them that. Here's the original.
(There are other discrepancies in the blog post about the other films, but I'll have to address them later since I have to leave for work in a few minutes)
It's the same title card as seen in your blog post, just from a different source (so a lot less discolored and with different source damage).A couple of questions :
1. What happened to the original credits on the Destroy All Monster releases? They are gone in the Media Blasters Blu-ray and the ADV Films DVD I own. What do they look like?
Nope. It's never turned up. Even the Hindi version of the film, which uses the original English credits and inserts, had it replaced by a fade to a video generated "Jurassic City" title card. Had they not done that, we would have seen it there.2. Does anyone have a picture of the International title for GvMGII?
I don't ever visit the awful Godzilla wiki, so I don't know, but if this is them, then the answer is yes.3. Are the overlaid International titles on GvKG and GvM as non-descript as they appear on the Godzilla wiki? Those seem more appropriate for a P&S video release than a theatrical print.
UltramanGoji wrote: Cranky because you got mad I implied GFW isn't a good movie aren't you
Chrispy_G wrote:I'll say it one last time, Trump wins in a landslide.
I'll gladly eat crow if it doesn't turn out that way....but at this point it feels painfully obvious, as it has for months.
- Great Hierophant
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
The Godzilla wiki has almost all the International Titles, so it can't be that bad
I'm still on the fence about SoG, the cast and crew credits look untouched. I find it weird though that there are no contemporary cast and crew credits for DAM on either disc.
I'm still on the fence about SoG, the cast and crew credits look untouched. I find it weird though that there are no contemporary cast and crew credits for DAM on either disc.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
They're not the originals. Nothing to be on the fence about.Great Hierophant wrote: I'm still on the fence about SoG, the cast and crew credits look untouched.
UltramanGoji wrote: Cranky because you got mad I implied GFW isn't a good movie aren't you
Chrispy_G wrote:I'll say it one last time, Trump wins in a landslide.
I'll gladly eat crow if it doesn't turn out that way....but at this point it feels painfully obvious, as it has for months.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
What do you mean? Are you aware that the credits don't immediately follow the title? They're placed after the SY3 launch in the Japanese and international versions. (AIP moved them to the end of the film.)Great Hierophant wrote: I find it weird though that there are no contemporary cast and crew credits for DAM on either disc.
Edit: as for Son, Goji is right, the TriStar DVD has new credits.
Export
TriStar
The end titles are different, too: export vs. TriStar
寺沢. He/him/his, etc.
- A list of known Toho export dubs (a colossal, perpetual work in progress)
- Kaiju and Tokusatsu Movies on The Sci-Fi Channel (1992 - 2010)
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
I can't believe that I had completely forgotten where the credits were supposed to be for DAM! So many films, so much to process.Terasawa wrote:What do you mean? Are you aware that the credits don't immediately follow the title? They're placed after the SY3 launch in the Japanese and international versions. (AIP moved them to the end of the film.)Great Hierophant wrote: I find it weird though that there are no contemporary cast and crew credits for DAM on either disc.
Edit: as for Son, Goji is right, the TriStar DVD has new credits.
Export
TriStar
The end titles are different, too: export vs. TriStar
I now accept that SoG's credits were remade, the ones you show from earlier sources have much larger text sizes and the typeface is not an exact match (the "t" is a good example). Corrections will be made. Interestingly, the letter size for the redone SoG is much smaller than what Tristar did for its predecessor.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
The first Mechagodzilla movie played theatrically in late 1976 rather than March of 1977, as is commonly reported, as GODZILLA VS. BIONIC MONSTER, though the announcer in the TV spot called it GODZILLA VS. THE BIONIC MONSTER. I'm certain as to the time of release because that's when I saw it on the big screen. I relish the memory and enjoyed the all-too-infrequent TV showings of it, later in the early 80s under the COSMIC MONSTER title. From the opening Cinema Shares logo accompanied by the sound of drums to the final scene of the King Seesar statue, it was most enjoyable.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
Proof that the movie was being shown in November and December 1976, at least on a limited basis (mostly in North Carolina). It was in wide release as "Bionic Monster" in February 1977, later as "Cosmic Monster" starting in July.Ron Burton wrote:The first Mechagodzilla movie played theatrically in late 1976 rather than March of 1977, as is commonly reported, as GODZILLA VS. BIONIC MONSTER, though the announcer in the TV spot called it GODZILLA VS. THE BIONIC MONSTER. I'm certain as to the time of release because that's when I saw it on the big screen. I relish the memory and enjoyed the all-too-infrequent TV showings of it, later in the early 80s under the COSMIC MONSTER title. From the opening Cinema Shares logo accompanied by the sound of drums to the final scene of the King Seesar statue, it was most enjoyable.
From the November 20, 1976 issue of the Statesville Record and Landmark (Statesville, NC):
寺沢. He/him/his, etc.
- A list of known Toho export dubs (a colossal, perpetual work in progress)
- Kaiju and Tokusatsu Movies on The Sci-Fi Channel (1992 - 2010)
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
God I need to update this.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Toho's English Versions
I just now finished reading this entire thread. Wow!
To the creators of the original post, thank you oh so much!! This was incredibly informative. While there was some info I already knew, this greatly increased my knowledge of the English versions of these films! I also very much appreciated the wealth of knowledge contained in many of the comments!
In 2004, I recorded onto a VHS tape an AMC airing of Terror of Mechagodzilla that fits the above description of the rare 1986 TV version. The entire film is fullscreen, it opens with Saperstein’s 1978 prologue, titles, and credits, and then after the credits it reverts to the 1980s UPA TV and video version. Additional cuts must have been made to this version, as it was broadcast in a 90 min time slot with commercial breaks, IIRC. I’d like to get the VHS back out and more closely examine the edits, but alas, it is in storage and not easily accessible atm. I had not realized how apparently rare this TV version is until I read this post and saw that, according to your records, it only experienced a limited broadcast on a few stations in 1986. Hope this is helpful in adding to your ever-growing database in that this version experienced at least one airing on a major cable channel in 2004.
Added in 18 hours 37 minutes 9 seconds:
To the creators of the original post, thank you oh so much!! This was incredibly informative. While there was some info I already knew, this greatly increased my knowledge of the English versions of these films! I also very much appreciated the wealth of knowledge contained in many of the comments!
I would be interested in learning more about these differences across the various copies of the US version. If there is a page—blog, forum thread, or otherwise—that describes this in more detail, I would appreciate being pointed in that direction!Tamura wrote:MOTHRA VS GODZILLA ... -It seems that no copy of the US version is the same, but we won't go into detail for it is very complicated.
I have a piece of information to offer that should prove useful.Tamura wrote:-A version shown on some TV stations in 1986 utilizes the '80s UPA TV and video version, but with the original TV prologue and opening titles added to the beginning.
In 2004, I recorded onto a VHS tape an AMC airing of Terror of Mechagodzilla that fits the above description of the rare 1986 TV version. The entire film is fullscreen, it opens with Saperstein’s 1978 prologue, titles, and credits, and then after the credits it reverts to the 1980s UPA TV and video version. Additional cuts must have been made to this version, as it was broadcast in a 90 min time slot with commercial breaks, IIRC. I’d like to get the VHS back out and more closely examine the edits, but alas, it is in storage and not easily accessible atm. I had not realized how apparently rare this TV version is until I read this post and saw that, according to your records, it only experienced a limited broadcast on a few stations in 1986. Hope this is helpful in adding to your ever-growing database in that this version experienced at least one airing on a major cable channel in 2004.
Added in 18 hours 37 minutes 9 seconds:
Curious as to why it is unknown which edits belong to which version. Does the original Brenco version no longer exist? I am aware that the 3 US VHS releases contain the re-edited TV version, and that is the only US version I’ve ever been able to find.Tamura wrote:GORATH
-US theatrical version released by Brenco in 1964. Dubbed by Ryder Sound.
-Re-edited US TV version of the Brenco cut distributed by Heritage Enterprises.
-It is not known which edits should be attributed to which version except for the cut scene of the giant walrus, Maguma.
Last edited by cheshire22 on Fri Aug 02, 2019 1:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
Insert this side into recorder ^ Do not touch the tape inside