Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Thu May 10, 2012 4:24 pm

wataru wrote:Batman Forever and Batman & Robin are shit compared to Burton's work.


...That doesn't mean 1994 was a bad year for films.

And I can compare Star Wars to Gone With the Wind and Wizard of Oz. Because using YOUR arguement - they changed how films were made - because Star Wars DID change how films were made. And sadly this change 20 years later caused Lucas to change how HE made films and he skreeonk over the original trilogy and then gave us the story-shitfest, CGI-jerk off prequels.


...Star Wars still changed the way films were made, and is still influencing the way films are made nowdays. Sure Lucas won't stop changing the film, but he can't change film history.

Let's say I make a movie, Gone With the Wind style (a bright romance gay little musical) but use the story of the genocide in Africa, or Black Hawk Down, or Hurt Locker. It's not going to work because it's not accurate.


It's also too soon.

These films had a theme and the theme was in GWTW the Civil War and in WoO - a fantasy world and a quest in a strange scarey world. Both failed to portray their core.


Wait, what?

Gone With The Wind and Wizard Of Oz didn't fail at anything. If they did fail at something, we wouldn't be talking about them right now.

But Blade Runner did both perfectly (and to be honest, since you've not seen The Final Cut of Blade Runner, you cannot compare them).


...I've seen Blade Runner. I know the plot, I know what happens, I know the characters, I know the history behind the film, I know what the film talks about in terms of what it means to be human and whatnot. I don't care if I haven't seen ever single cut of the film, because I've still seen Blade Runner. I typically only watch different cuts of films that I actually enjoy.

Also, I completely forgot about another very influencial film from 1939: Rules Of The Game. Yeah, 1939 wins.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby wataru » Thu May 10, 2012 4:27 pm

1939 had one good thing going for it - mah daddy was born.

And yes, 1994 was a turning point year for film because BF and B&R were the shit rolling downhill of the Batman franchise.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Thu May 10, 2012 4:34 pm

wataru wrote:1939 had one good thing going for it - mah daddy was born.

And yes, 1994 was a turning point year for film because BF and B&R were the shit rolling downhill of the Batman franchise.


I remember hearing about a documentary on TCM a few months ago, entitled "1939: The Greatest Year" (or something like that), in which they talked about all the great films from 1939 and how each one changed films forever.

I still fail to see how 1994 is bad for the reasons you state, when there was no Batman related movie in 1994. If you want to get upset at the year of movies for the beginning of bad Batman films, then get upset at 1995 when Batman Forever was released. And even if you still don't like 1994 for that reason, there's still way more great things that 1994 has to offer, for reasons I've already said.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby wataru » Thu May 10, 2012 4:52 pm

1994 gave us House Party 3 and Junior. That's enough reason.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Thu May 10, 2012 4:59 pm

wataru wrote:1994 gave us House Party 3 and Junior. That's enough reason.


1994 also gave us Pulp Fiction, Shawshank Redemption, Hoop Dreams, Forrest Gump, Ed Wood and Red. I'll stick with 1994.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby wataru » Thu May 10, 2012 5:01 pm

GotengoXGodzilla wrote:
wataru wrote:1994 gave us House Party 3 and Junior. That's enough reason.


1994 also gave us Pulp Fiction, Shawshank Redemption, Hoop Dreams, Forrest Gump, Ed Wood and Red. I'll stick with 1994.


Let me compare this to Hitler.

I dont care that he gave us Volkswagon, he still killed alot of Jews.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Thu May 10, 2012 5:05 pm

wataru wrote:
GotengoXGodzilla wrote:
wataru wrote:1994 gave us House Party 3 and Junior. That's enough reason.


1994 also gave us Pulp Fiction, Shawshank Redemption, Hoop Dreams, Forrest Gump, Ed Wood and Red. I'll stick with 1994.


Let me compare this to Hitler.

I dont care that he gave us Volkswagon, he still killed alot of Jews.


You're making it sound like '94 gave us more bad than good, when that's just not true. Even if we take the movies that you think ruined the year and compare it to the movies I've listed, it's still six good movies against two bad movies. Good wins.

Besides, every year is going to have it's share of bad movies. Compared to how many good movies came out in '94 versus every other year from the '90s, '94 has the most. That's why I say it was the best year for movies from the '90s.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby wataru » Thu May 10, 2012 5:11 pm

Damn GxG, you defend 1994 like it was the year you were born. Chill. The Shadow came out in 1994, it's a mediocre film, superhero films in the 90s seemed to suffer 1994 on until 1999, just let it go, man.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby SoleMan » Thu May 10, 2012 6:31 pm

wataru wrote:No, the point is - Gone With The Wind is a romance movie based off a historical romance novel about a time when romance was the last thing on Johnny Reb's mind as he lay out in the cold marshes with no shoes, shirt or ammo freezing his ballsack off with the Uni's were telling him what to do with his plantation.

You want to see a historically accurate Civil War film? Watch Glory.

Wizard of Oz IS like Wonderland. But the movie is a technicolor shadow of the novels.

Are these films BAD? No. Are these films GOOD? Sure. Are these films accurate? Hell no. Is Blade Runner better? Yes. Why? Because it is what it is - a steampunk dystopian sci-opera semi-action drama. It's not Star Wars or Star Trek. It's not Hillstreet Blues, Blue Steel or Body Heat. It's a movie that IS what it IS and isnt some film maker saying "Let's just do this shit...",


You do know that Blade Runner was based Philip K. Dick's novel Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? right? It doesn't hold very true to the source material either.

And I know what you're going to say: "It doesn't have the same name, it's dissassosciative" Well, it lifted character names, settings, and the entire concept of doubting reality because of technology. (A major theme of Mr. Dick's. Go ahead, laugh) Your logic is flawed.


Oh, and the whole reason I made that comment in the first is because I WAS born in '94.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby wataru » Fri May 11, 2012 6:14 am

SoleMan... um yeah, I do. And while it's not accurate TO THE NOVEL, it is accurate to the point of the movie and the novel. Gone With The Wind and Wizard of Oz are not.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby Viva la revolucion! » Fri May 11, 2012 1:17 pm

Let me put it like this:

The Avengers
Iron Man 2
Iron Man
Captain America (WUT!)
THe Dark Knight
Green Lantern
Punisher War Zone

I think RDJ is the best actor that played supeheroes with his macho attiutede and very convicingly delibered dialogs and lines, what a cool guy.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Fri May 11, 2012 2:53 pm

wataru wrote:SoleMan... um yeah, I do. And while it's not accurate TO THE NOVEL, it is accurate to the point of the movie and the novel. Gone With The Wind and Wizard of Oz are not.


To which I say, who really cares if Wizard Of Oz doesn't follow the novel to a tee? The film is still a lot of fun with its unique visual style, fun characters and lots of memorable scenes. Not to mention being way ahead of its time.

To my understanding, Gone With The Wind fairly accurately depicts the novel that it's based off of. But even if it doesn't, I still pose the same question: Who cares?
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby wataru » Fri May 11, 2012 3:27 pm

It's not about being true to novel, it's about being true to the subject matter.

As I stated before, the Civil War was not a swashbuckling bright technicolor romance, nor was Wizard of Oz a gay bright cheerful family musical. These films took subject matter and perverted it into a style that was not true to spirit of the story or times of the story.

Compare the original True Grit with Open Range. Both are westerns. Which is the BEST western? True Grit is a classic, but it's dated, and even in it's year it wasnt accurate at ALL to the true American west. It is the classic MOVIE western. It is not a true western story. Open Range is worlds better on the subject matter AND acting. Which is the best MOVIE? Open Range. It has nothing to do with it being 'newer' and True Grit being 'older', it has to do with the story telling, acting and all the techs of the film (set design, costumes, sound, etc etc).

People watch classics and watch them with a mind-set of it being old and dated and to take it with a grain of salt. You're watching it with film snob goggles. In terms of STORY - Blade Runner and Open Range stomp Wizard of Oz and Gone With The Wind into the ground. Stagecoach Im going to abstain from comparing it to Open Range as Ive not seen it in awhile..
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby SoleMan » Fri May 11, 2012 7:08 pm

wataru wrote:SoleMan... um yeah, I do. And while it's not accurate TO THE NOVEL, it is accurate to the point of the movie and the novel. Gone With The Wind and Wizard of Oz are not.


...How the Hell does Wizard of Oz not hold true to the point of the novel?

But the point is that it's all dramatized. It should seem that if they wanted to romantasize the Civil War, they can. IT'S NOT REAL. They can take creative liberties, they grant themselves poetic liscense. It tells a much more moving story than Blade Runner did, which is, in truth, a boring, cliche movie that the filmmakers can't seem to get right because they have to keep releasing it every couple of years to share their true artistic vision. (Or it's all about money--which just reeks of Creativity)

I don't understand why people even like Blade Runner I fell asleep the first time I saw it, (Though I attribute that to a long day) and found that the only good part in it was the Android's speech at the end. Ignorant IGN said it best Sci-Fi movie of all time, to which I replied, 'Really?' Fortunately, I don't heed the word of IGN, so I strolled casually on.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Fri May 11, 2012 10:01 pm

wataru wrote:It's not about being true to novel, it's about being true to the subject matter.


It's subject matter is the novel. The novel won a Pulitzer for Fiction, as in even the book wasn't completely based off of true events. So when you make a movie based off a novel that was mostly fiction, of course you're going to get a movie that isn't entirely true to the Civil War. So the way I see it, that's really not fair to say if it's true to the "subject matter".

As I stated before, the Civil War was not a swashbuckling bright technicolor romance, nor was Wizard of Oz a gay bright cheerful family musical. These films took subject matter and perverted it into a style that was not true to spirit of the story or times of the story.


And as I've stated before, so what? A movie deserves to stand on its own merits, without being compared to other works. Gone With The Wind and Wizard Of Oz still obviously did something right, otherwise they wouldn't be talked about today. It doesn't matter if they strictly follow their original source material, because films can do that. There's no rule out there that says, if a film is based off a novel/short story/whatever, that it has to follow the source material to a tee.

Compare the original True Grit with Open Range. Both are westerns. Which is the BEST western? True Grit is a classic, but it's dated, and even in it's year it wasnt accurate at ALL to the true American west. It is the classic MOVIE western. It is not a true western story. Open Range is worlds better on the subject matter AND acting. Which is the best MOVIE? Open Range. It has nothing to do with it being 'newer' and True Grit being 'older', it has to do with the story telling, acting and all the techs of the film (set design, costumes, sound, etc etc).


That comparison doesn't really work, since I've never even heard of Open Range, and I bet you anything I'm not the only one.

True Grit is considered a classic American western, not because it accurately depicts the west, but because of the story and characters, and how enjoyable they are. I've yet to hear anybody talk about if a western accurately depicts the west, that it suddenly is a good western.

Most great Westerns I can think of aren't great at accurately depicting the west, such as The Searchers, Red River, The Good, The Bad and the Ugly, etc., but you know what? I could care less about that kind of stuff. That's not what film is about. It's about telling an interesting story and enjoyable and memorable characters.

I know I'm going to regret this, but I'm going to bring it up anyway, because it works here: Battle Royale. I couldn't care less if the movie accurately depicts what happens in the manga. What I care about is if the movie is entertaining and enjoyable to watch. And it is. Hell, even my favorite movie of all time, Apocalypse Now, is based off a novel, "The Heart Of Darkness". Is it faithful to the novel? From what I can gather, no. But I don't care. It's still one of the best films I've ever seen. Same goes for Battle Royale.

And this is the case for any and all movies based off another source. I never bother to ask the question: How faithful is it to the source material? Because that's a stupid question. My question is: Is it entertaining to watch in its own right?

People watch classics and watch them with a mind-set of it being old and dated and to take it with a grain of salt.


And I laugh at the people who do that.

Cinema is timeless. A film made in 1897 can be just as enjoyable as a film from 1997. It doesn't matter how old a film is, because one can easily enjoy an old film as much as a new film. This is why we still talk about films from the '30s, '40s and '50s. If people did what you say they do, nobody would talk about silent films or black-and-white films anymore.

You're watching it with film snob goggles. In terms of STORY - Blade Runner and Open Range stomp Wizard of Oz and Gone With The Wind into the ground.


I haven't seen Open Range, so I can't talk about its story. But I can talk about Blade Runner's story...and it sucks. The story is almost nonexistent in Blade Runner. The film would rather show of its world and effects instead of telling an interesting or captivating story. Really, the film chooses style over substance.

I have this condition, where if I watch a film that chooses to focus the bulk of its attention on the world of the film or effects or whatnot, I don't give a damn about the film. I've watched Blade Runner three times now, and I've fallen asleep twice during the film. If the film actually focused on the story, then that wouldn't have happened.

So I'll say that Wizard Of Oz and Gone With The Wind have better stories than Blade Runner.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby SoleMan » Sat May 12, 2012 5:22 am

I know I'm going to regret this, but I'm going to bring it up anyway, because it works here: Battle Royale. I couldn't care less if the movie accurately depicts what happens in the manga. What I care about is if the movie is entertaining and enjoyable to watch. And it is. Hell, even my favorite movie of all time, Apocalypse Now, is based off a novel, "The Heart Of Darkness". Is it faithful to the novel? From what I can gather, no. But I don't care. It's still one of the best films I've ever seen. Same goes for Battle Royale.



It's not that far off base, actually. Aside from the Vietnam War and various modern elements, it follows the same basic plot, and has all the major characters. (Kurtz, Kilgore, whatever the Hell Robert Duvall's name was...)

Are you a verteran? I love that movie, and I've heard that it's even more powerful if you've served in the military.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby wataru » Sat May 12, 2012 7:21 am

LOL yall are a hoot... you cant even stay on a coherent argument.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Sun May 13, 2012 4:07 pm

SoleMan wrote:
I know I'm going to regret this, but I'm going to bring it up anyway, because it works here: Battle Royale. I couldn't care less if the movie accurately depicts what happens in the manga. What I care about is if the movie is entertaining and enjoyable to watch. And it is. Hell, even my favorite movie of all time, Apocalypse Now, is based off a novel, "The Heart Of Darkness". Is it faithful to the novel? From what I can gather, no. But I don't care. It's still one of the best films I've ever seen. Same goes for Battle Royale.



It's not that far off base, actually. Aside from the Vietnam War and various modern elements, it follows the same basic plot, and has all the major characters. (Kurtz, Kilgore, whatever the Hell Robert Duvall's name was...)

Are you a verteran? I love that movie, and I've heard that it's even more powerful if you've served in the military.


No, I've never been in a war. I'm not in the military, and at this point never wish to serve in it.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby Hellspawn28 » Sun May 13, 2012 10:28 pm

SoleMan wrote:
I only asked because your avatar comes from that movie. Your name seems to be related too...


I like the avatar because the image is cool and I pick my user name because I'm a fan of the character. Just I'm a fan that does not mean that I have to like everything related with the character. I haven't read the recent comics of Spawn in the past year since I have lost respect with Todd McFarlane (His artwork is still good though) with him being become a total sell out. He has been going through the George Lucas route lately since he has put no love or care with his creation in the past several years.
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Re: Most Enjoyable Comic Book/Superhero Based Films (Top 10)

Postby SoleMan » Mon May 14, 2012 4:22 am

Hellspawn28 wrote:
SoleMan wrote:
I only asked because your avatar comes from that movie. Your name seems to be related too...


I like the avatar because the image is cool and I pick my user name because I'm a fan of the character. Just I'm a fan that does not mean that I have to like everything related with the character. I haven't read the recent comics of Spawn in the past year since I have lost respect with Todd McFarlane (His artwork is still good though) with him being become a total sell out. He has been going through the George Lucas route lately since he has put no love or care with his creation in the past several years.


Oh yeah, undoubtedly. Part of the problem is that Spawn was supposed to die after his power ran out, but he went and killed God or something? I mean, I wouldn't swear to that, but it should seem they artifically extended the character's lifespan.

Another problem was that it got too gothy. I mean, it was rough to begin with, but then they just turned it into all this devil worship and fire and brimstone and Neil Gaiman making love to Tim Burton and...*shudders* Oh God!
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