Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

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Terasawa
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Terasawa » Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:52 am

Godzilla21 wrote:
Smuggers wrote:
goji89 wrote:no one but a handful of people care

Where do you think we are


I mean he's not wrong. There seems to be maybe 3-4 dedicated people against the Criterion set in the Criterion thread. Meanwhile on social media (where there a lot more Godzilla fans) the response to the set seems to be universally positive. And the fact that it was #1 on Amazon for a bit says to me there is a lot of interest. But maybe this is a discussion better suited for that thread. It's amazing how testy people are getting over a box set of Godzilla films


Did it occur to you that maybe a number of those fans aren’t aware of the issues that SHM was trying to discuss?
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Maritonic » Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:52 am

Back to unpopular opinions. Less pissing contests.

Thank you.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby eabaker » Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:56 am

My unpopular opinion is that Megalon can piss farther than Gigan.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Space Hunter M » Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:56 am

goji89 wrote:
Space Hunter M wrote: Can we move on from the "just be glad" mentality, finally?


Unfortunately it's not possible. Should we all as fans rise up and demand better? Sure. But, realistically do you see this as a possibility?

Honestly, yes. Every other popular franchise has at least a dedicated minority that cares about this kind of stuff. I don't see why a franchise as old and far reaching as Godzilla shouldn't.

Plenty of fandoms wouldn't even exist today without care and collaboration between participants when by the majority the actual companies didn't give a damn.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Godzilla21 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:58 am

Space Hunter M wrote:I'll reiterate that it's apparently unpopular to want quality presentations of these films, and it kinda sucks. It seems to be a lot more popular to dismiss genuine complaints as "whining", and that we should be happy for whatever scraps Toho scrapes out of the pan for us.

I have seen this attitude prevail in the fandom at large for years and years.

This is not the 2004-2014 "dark age" any more. Can we move on from the "just be glad" mentality, finally?


I dont think anyone wants subpar films. I think the issue that I have is what is the alternative? How can we get Toho to release better versions?

And another thing that I've said multiple times is besides the hardcore guys who follow this very closely, the majority of fans have DVDs and this represents an upgrade. I feel bad for you guys that have had the Toho 08 transfers for years and wanted more. I do. But you have to realize that most casual fans don't have those and are excited for this set. Most people won't be doing side by side screen shots of the Criterion set vs a fan edit or the 4K versions Toho has done. Most people will be totally content
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby UltramanGoji » Fri Oct 11, 2019 10:59 am

I find it funny that some of the people complaining about other's issues with the Criterion set are the same people who complain about SHMA figures whenever something new is revealed. They're always saying SHMA can improve, that the figures can look better, that fans produce better-looking figures than the companies.

How is any of that different than this?
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby tyrantgoji » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:04 am

UltramanGoji wrote:I find it funny that some of the people complaining about other's issues with the Criterion set are the same people who complain about SHMA figures whenever something new is revealed. They're always saying SHMA can improve, that the figures can look better, that fans produce better-looking figures than the companies.
How is any of that different than this?


I mean they honesty can with the right person on the job. I'm shocked at how many figures joints have popped off,stuff like that should not be happening with a toy company who should know what they're doing.
Last edited by tyrantgoji on Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Space Hunter M » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:04 am

Godzilla21 wrote:But you have to realize that most casual fans don't have those and are excited for this set. Most people won't be doing side by side screen shots of the Criterion set vs a fan edit or the 4K versions Toho has done. Most people will be totally content

Sure, that may be the sad truth. That still doesn't excuse people dissing the films as being somehow inherently inferior technology-wise when confronted with further knowledge.

We are living in an increasingly media-driven age. I'm of the opinion people SHOULD care more.

UltramanGoji wrote:How is any of that different than this?

These are the films that spawned the franchise and the merchandise in the first place. Shouldn't the films take more precedence?
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby UltramanGoji » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:08 am

Space Hunter M wrote:
UltramanGoji wrote:How is any of that different than this?

These are the films that spawned the franchise and the merchandise in the first place. Shouldn't the films take more precedence?


Yeah, that's what I'm saying. How is it okay to complain incessantly about toys but trying to raise awareness of a more unknown problem with the media that spawned the toys is annoying?
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Godzilla21 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:14 am

Terasawa wrote:
Godzilla21 wrote:
Smuggers wrote:Where do you think we are


I mean he's not wrong. There seems to be maybe 3-4 dedicated people against the Criterion set in the Criterion thread. Meanwhile on social media (where there a lot more Godzilla fans) the response to the set seems to be universally positive. And the fact that it was #1 on Amazon for a bit says to me there is a lot of interest. But maybe this is a discussion better suited for that thread. It's amazing how testy people are getting over a box set of Godzilla films


Did it occur to you that maybe a number of those fans aren’t aware of the issues that SHM was trying to discuss?


Sure I bet a portion of those fans aren't aware but I'll be willing to bet the Criterion versions are just fine for them. See Terasawa you follow this stuff really closely and are really into it. Hell when I saw you discussing font types in various versions of the films I knew you were in deep. But I can tell you as someone thats more of a casual fan that I can SEE the Criterion's don't look as good as they should but its not a huge deal to me. Beyond me actually getting two TVs side by side to compare and pick out the details lacking in the Criterion I'll probably never notice or care about a difference.

Another thing to consider is despite the prevalence of HD Blu Ray and 4K now, DVD is still the best selling physically media in the country. Last I checked its like 66% of all discs with BD being like 25% and 9% 4K. For many people they are content with worse quality even though better quality sources are available. I just don't think the masses will care enough these are older transfers. They will probably just think, "wow Criterion, wow Godzilla, wow 15 movies!" I really doubt someone will be paroozing the isles at Barnes and Noble and stop at the set and say "damn these use the old 2008 HiVi transfers, which were outdated at the time. Sorry little Billy, but no Godzilla set for Christmas for you this year". I appreciate where you and SHM and others are coming from. I just don't think you quite understand how casual people see this.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Space Hunter M » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:19 am

UltramanGoji wrote:Yeah, that's what I'm saying. How is it okay to complain incessantly about toys but trying to raise awareness of a more unknown problem with the media that spawned the toys is annoying?

I never got that either. At best, I'd just say the merch collectors are really passionate.

So why is passion for the media itself unwarranted? Not even in the sense of technical visual presentation. Beyond that as well.

The Godzilla films of the 1950s through 1970s exist in a unique and interesting cultural context. Their significance has been analysed time and time again by a lot of scholarly types and impassioned fans, so when fans slip back and deride them as "cheesy rubber monster films" all over again for the sake of justifying something else, it just doesn't sit right with me.

Added in 5 minutes 43 seconds:
Godzilla21 wrote:I appreciate where you and SHM and others are coming from. I just don't think you quite understand how casual people see this.

We have. Time and time again. That's exactly why we're understandably annoyed after over two decades of bad presentations of these movies on home video.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Godzilla21 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:28 am

UltramanGoji wrote:
Space Hunter M wrote:
UltramanGoji wrote:How is any of that different than this?

These are the films that spawned the franchise and the merchandise in the first place. Shouldn't the films take more precedence?


Yeah, that's what I'm saying. How is it okay to complain incessantly about toys but trying to raise awareness of a more unknown problem with the media that spawned the toys is annoying?


I'd say there are several reasons that people go crazy in the toy threads.

#1 some people spend a ton of money on that stuff. A ton. I know people that are double dipping on Gigantic X Plus figures (which will put you into the thousands of dollars). So I think when vast sums of cash are involved, emotions can get high.

#2 There seems to be a unique passion for Godzilla toys that is at an all time high. You have toy groups on Facebook numbering in the thousands that are extremely active. When I sell Godzilla stuff on eBay it always gets the most views/watchers and usually sells quicker than anything else.

#3 you have bigger and better toys than ever before. You have amazing detail and articulation and everything else. There is something for everyone.

Im sure there are more reasons but thats what I can think of off the top of my head. Hate to say but toys seem to illicit a lot more interest and emotion than the video quality of the Criterion set.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Terasawa » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:29 am

Then I would argue this is an unpopular opinion and warrants discussion in this thread despite certain members' protests.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Godzilla21 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:30 am

Space Hunter M wrote:We have. Time and time again. That's exactly why we're understandably annoyed after over two decades of bad presentations of these movies on home video.


And as I said, beyond complaining incessantly on TK, I wish I knew what the alternative was!

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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby goji89 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:32 am

We have over four thousand members here.......how many care about it? Not trying to be insulting here, but......aside from 5 or 6 people who are truly passionate how far will you reach? Have these guy's put out a petition on the main website and have all four thousand sign it asking Toho for better quality restorations. Do something about it rather than deride people who don't care and that are content with what we are given.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Terasawa » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:37 am

Godzilla21 wrote:Beyond me actually getting two TVs side by side to compare and pick out the details lacking in the Criterion I'll probably never notice or care about a difference.


I think people would certainly notice and care if these saw screenshots from the 4K KKvG or any of the recent Matsuri version transfers.

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But anyway, we know you don't really care. We know goji89 sure as hell doesn't either. I understand that a lot of people are probably blissfully unaware of what they're getting (and will be even after watching the films on the set), but what harm is there in informing? And again, if you guys are tired of reading it, just ignore it. There are dozens of posts made here every day, including in threads I follow, that I choose to ignore because they don't appeal to me or because I don't agree with them.

...and if it's such an unpopular opinion, why try to shut it down in this thread?
Last edited by Terasawa on Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby goji89 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:39 am

Terasawa wrote:Then I would argue this is an unpopular opinion and warrants discussion in this thread despite certain members' protests.


O.k.....aside from you and the rest of the people of the criterion thread who else has joined the discussion? Its gonna be the same people from that thread discussing what you already discussed over there.....I don't see anyone else jumping at the bit to have that particular discussion here. Its gonna be the same people is my point.

I and everyone here can appreciate your passions but at this point you've beaten a dead horse to a bloody pulp.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Terasawa » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:41 am

goji89 wrote:
Terasawa wrote:Then I would argue this is an unpopular opinion and warrants discussion in this thread despite certain members' protests.


O.k.....aside from you and the rest of the people of the criterion thread who else has joined the discussion? Its gonna be the same people from that thread discussing what you already discussed over there.....I don't see anyone else jumping at the bit to have that particular discussion here. Its gonna be the same people is my point.

I and everyone here can appreciate your passions but at this point you've beaten a dead horse to a bloody pulp.


Just ignore me then? I'm not gonna stop talking about this in this thread until a mod forces me to.

  • It's on topic.
  • It merits discussion.
  • It isn't breaking any site rules.
Last edited by Terasawa on Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby goji89 » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:46 am

Terasawa wrote:
Just ignore me then? I'm not gonna stop talking about this in this thread until a mod forces me to. It's:

  • On topic
  • Merits discussion
  • Isn't breaking any site rules


O.k you can talk about it.

You win.
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Re: Unpopular Godzilla Opinions

Postby Space Hunter M » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:48 am

Godzilla21 wrote:
Space Hunter M wrote:We have. Time and time again. That's exactly why we're understandably annoyed after over two decades of bad presentations of these movies on home video.


And as I said, beyond complaining incessantly on TK, I wish I knew what the alternative was!

Actually, a lot of us do know what the alternative is, and are actively working towards it, but we'll still talk about it anyway because we can.

I don't see why we can't have this discussion here, either. If we have nothing positive to say about the Criterion set in its own thread (because that'd be too much of a cesspool), why not move talks here?
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