Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

For the discussion of movies and TV shows not distributed by Toho.

Which movie is your favorite?

The Terminator (1984)
1
14%
Terminator 2: Judgement Day (1991)
5
71%
Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines (2003)
1
14%
Terminator: Salvation (2009)
0
No votes
Terminator: Genisys (2015)
0
No votes
Terminator: Dark Fate (2019)
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 7

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Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby The One and Only » Tue Oct 01, 2019 10:56 pm

New Trailer.
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Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:09 am

Just wanted to say, I use a lot of clips from terminator 2 in some of my classes to teach perfect progressive tenses. The kids get really interested when I show them things like the scene with John Connor on his bike escaping the T1000. They write a lot of good sentences on what’s going on, such as “The truck is exploding” or “The Terminator is protecting the boy”.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby Birdman » Wed Oct 02, 2019 7:25 am

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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby GojiDog » Wed Oct 02, 2019 7:47 am

For Terminator, I choose to ignore the existence of anything that happened after T2.

T3 felt like a retread of T2 but with a downer ending, instead of the more ambiguous ending that I liked.

Salvation...wasn't good, but at least I can forgive it for moving the story forward.

Genesys made me retch. Why are we still doing time traveling robots? Hasn't this already been covered.

Dark Fate. WHY ARE WE STILL DOING TIME TRAVELING ROBOTS?

The only thing post T2 that I liked was The Sarah Connor Chronicles, which sadly ended up a huge cliffhanger that will never get resolved. Bummer.

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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby KManX89 » Wed Oct 02, 2019 8:09 am

GojiDog wrote:For Terminator, I choose to ignore the existence of anything that happened after T2.

T3 felt like a retread of T2 but with a downer ending, instead of the more ambiguous ending that I liked.

Salvation...wasn't good, but at least I can forgive it for moving the story forward.

Genesys made me retch. Why are we still doing time traveling robots? Hasn't this already been covered.

Dark Fate. WHY ARE WE STILL DOING TIME TRAVELING ROBOTS?

The only thing post T2 that I liked was The Sarah Connor Chronicles, which sadly ended up a huge cliffhanger that will never get resolved. Bummer.


Salvation was such a mess on so many levels that, quite frankly, I don't see how the rumored sequels (and it was supposed to span a new trilogy based on the future war) would've done the concept justice unless they got a whole new director and writers (who, ironically, were rehired to do Salvation after intentionally butchering T3 just to spite T2, which they infamously hated).

For example, the T-800s are shown to be immune to normal human gunfire all throughout the first 3 movies, SO WHY THE skreeonk ARE THE RESISTANCE SOLDIERS SHOOTING THEM DOWN WITH REGULAR BULLETS WITH EASE RIGHT FROM THE GET GO? It makes no damn sense.

And I gotta love how this "advanced AI network" didn't think to track down the Resistance soldiers at any point in the film. The CinemaSins vid covered it pretty well. "Man, the machines deserve to lose". I couldn't agree more.

Also gotta love the huge gaping plothole with Marcus as a Skynet plant who helps the Resistance with the most epic faily "plan" ever, even looking past the convoluted logic of how an executed inmate can be brought back to life as a cyborg.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Wed Oct 02, 2019 5:32 pm

While I don't think Terminator Salvation is a good film at all, I think the idea is that the Terminators/Machine Soldiers in that film weren't as strong or durable as the T100, maybe the metal used to make them wasn't as good.

Terminator Genisys did move the story forward, but in a really backwards and confusing way. We at least finally get to see when Kyle Reese went back in time.

I have no idea if Terminator Dark Fate will be any good, but I do find it funny how the film series is on a perpetual cycle of new reboot, (Salvation, Genisys) that's intended to start a new trilogy) only for it to backfire miserably.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby KManX89 » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:45 am

It's holding up fairly well on Rotten Tomatoes with a 67% as of this writing.

Not great by any stretch, but surely a lot better than many were expecting it to be. And I know you shouldn't put a lot of weight into early-screening reviewers for obvious reasons, but I've read various posts from users on other boards who've said they really enjoyed it. I'd take their word over studio-handpicked test-screeners who know they probably won't get invited to future screenings if they talk bad about the film in question.

So... I guess I can safely go in cautiously optimistic next weekend? Which is more than I can say for the last few films.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby Living Corpse » Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:51 am

GojiDog wrote:For Terminator, I choose to ignore the existence of anything that happened after T2.

T3 felt like a retread of T2 but with a downer ending, instead of the more ambiguous ending that I liked.

Salvation...wasn't good, but at least I can forgive it for moving the story forward.

Genesys made me retch. Why are we still doing time traveling robots? Hasn't this already been covered.

Dark Fate. WHY ARE WE STILL DOING TIME TRAVELING ROBOTS?

The only thing post T2 that I liked was The Sarah Connor Chronicles, which sadly ended up a huge cliffhanger that will never get resolved. Bummer.


I see everything after T2 as just non-cnon what if stories.

I hate to be a downer but I'm a huge Terminator fan and yet with every trailer for Dark Fate I just can't muster the energy to care.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby Rhedosaurus » Fri Nov 01, 2019 6:10 am

The Box Office predictions for Terminator: Dark Fate are now lower then Salvation.

Given all the Terminator sequels, lack of promotion then it truly needed, and how the movie

Spoiler:
Kills off John at the beginning.


This movie was doomed from the get go.

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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby _JNavs_ » Fri Nov 01, 2019 6:13 am

Rhedosaurus wrote:The Box Office predictions for Terminator: Dark Fate are now lower then Salvation.

Given all the Terminator sequels, lack of promotion then it truly needed, and how the movie

Spoiler:
Kills off John at the beginning.


This movie was doomed from the get go.

I had hoped that spoiler was just a rumor, now I honestly have no plans to see the film.

If you're going to do a direct sequel, make sure you use ALL of the cast from the last film EFFECTIVELY.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby eabaker » Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:44 am

_JNavs_ wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:The Box Office predictions for Terminator: Dark Fate are now lower then Salvation.

Given all the Terminator sequels, lack of promotion then it truly needed, and how the movie

Spoiler:
Kills off John at the beginning.


This movie was doomed from the get go.

I had hoped that spoiler was just a rumor, now I honestly have no plans to see the film.

If you're going to do a direct sequel, make sure you use ALL of the cast from the last film EFFECTIVELY.


Spoiler:
Killing off a familiar character can be a very effective use of said character, depending upon what the emotional needs of the story are. I haven't seen Dark Fate, of course - nor do I have the level of affection (read: **any** affection) for Terminator II, so I'm not bringing that baggage to this - but if this movie needs to open by undercutting the optimism of T2's ending, this seems like a potentially effective way of achieving that end.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby Rhedosaurus » Fri Nov 01, 2019 8:27 am

eabaker wrote:
_JNavs_ wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:The Box Office predictions for Terminator: Dark Fate are now lower then Salvation.

Given all the Terminator sequels, lack of promotion then it truly needed, and how the movie

Spoiler:
Kills off John at the beginning.


This movie was doomed from the get go.

I had hoped that spoiler was just a rumor, now I honestly have no plans to see the film.

If you're going to do a direct sequel, make sure you use ALL of the cast from the last film EFFECTIVELY.


Spoiler:
Killing off a familiar character can be a very effective use of said character, depending upon what the emotional needs of the story are. I haven't seen Dark Fate, of course - nor do I have the level of affection (read: **any** affection) for Terminator II, so I'm not bringing that baggage to this - but if this movie needs to open by undercutting the optimism of T2's ending, this seems like a potentially effective way of achieving that end.


Except that T2 was one of those rare movies where a sequel surpassed the original movie. Add the fact that the ending wrapped up everything so well, and it's no wonder why people won't give this movie a chance. And even if they do, it's safe to say that what happens in the beginning of Dark Fate will cripple any joy people will have for the rest of the movie like that one fight scene in JP3 did for that movie.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby eabaker » Fri Nov 01, 2019 10:01 am

Rhedosaurus wrote:Except that T2 was one of those rare movies where a sequel surpassed the original movie.


This popular opinion has always struck me as bizarre to the point of incomprehensibility.

The original is a tight, tense, dynamic classic. T2 is an overblown, cheesy relic.

Add the fact that the ending wrapped up everything so well, and it's no wonder why people won't give this movie a chance. And even if they do, it's safe to say that what happens in the beginning of Dark Fate will cripple any joy people will have for the rest of the movie like that one fight scene in JP3 did for that movie.


Well, maybe the point isn't for people to feel "joy." Until we've seen the movie, we can't really comment on the tone it aims for or achieves.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby Rhedosaurus » Fri Nov 01, 2019 10:08 am

eabaker wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:Except that T2 was one of those rare movies where a sequel surpassed the original movie.


This popular opinion has always struck me as bizarre to the point of incomprehensibility.

The original is a tight, tense, dynamic classic. T2 is an overblown, cheesy relic.

You're really in the minority on that one.



Add the fact that the ending wrapped up everything so well, and it's no wonder why people won't give this movie a chance. And even if they do, it's safe to say that what happens in the beginning of Dark Fate will cripple any joy people will have for the rest of the movie like that one fight scene in JP3 did for that movie.


Well, maybe the point isn't for people to feel "joy."


That maybe true, but at least it gave people closure. That the journey was all over. To do what it does only leaves a bitter taste in the mouths of people. And that's something no franchise can do if said movie isn't good. Add in the fact how this is the 3rd sequel and the 4th Terminator movie since T2, and this movie was always on the wrong foot from day one.

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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby eabaker » Fri Nov 01, 2019 10:13 am

Rhedosaurus wrote:
eabaker wrote:Well, maybe the point isn't for people to feel "joy."


That maybe true, but at least it gave people closure. That the journey was all over. To do what it does only leaves a bitter taste in the mouths of people. And that's something no franchise can do if said movie isn't good. Add in the fact how this is the 3rd sequel and the 4th Terminator movie since T2, and this movie was always on the wrong foot from day one.


"If the movie isn't good" is a pretty significant qualification, though. If the movie is good, then the creative risk was worth it (even if it doesn't succeed with mainstream audiences).

EDIT: Also just wanted to remind everyone that a good storyteller is concerned not with what the audience wants, but with what the audience needs.
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby Jeff-Goldblum2 » Sat Nov 02, 2019 1:57 am

Unremarkable, Unoriginal and forgettable movie.

How anyone is saying at least it's better than Genisys and the other sequels is beyond me, as I can't really find anything special about this movie at all. Dull visuals, bad action scenes, boring leads with the exact same story just with differently named characters. Sometimes it's quite dark and you can't really see anything going on.

Terminator 3 is starting to look a lot better the more and more Terminator sequels come out.

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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby _JNavs_ » Sat Nov 02, 2019 10:59 pm

Just watched Dark Fate.. and I think.. I think I liked Salvation better than this film. At least that film was a rollercoaster of exposition mixed with some pretty sick world building. Plus, Christian Bale as John Connor was epic.

Dark Fate? The opening was a dark fate. The rest of the film was a dark fate lol. 6/10 (6 because the de-aging tech was top notch and REV-9 was pretty cool)
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby Rhedosaurus » Sun Nov 03, 2019 10:20 am


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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby Giratina93 » Sun Nov 03, 2019 1:08 pm

Well, I had no interest in seeing this movie for personal reasons, but a certain user that is a friend of mine saw it, so I shall be his mouthpiece and post his thoughts on the matter:

“This is Kaiju-King42 speaking through his self-imposed temp-ban, since I wanted to give my thoughts on Dark Fate and asked Gira to post it for me.

I watched the movie yesterday in theaters, after the surprisingly high score on Rotten Tomatoes convinced me to give it a shot (I was originally planning to rent it on I-Tunes or Netflix like I did with Genesis.) And… I realize I’m in the minority, but I was shocked by just how much I ended up enjoying myself. I really, really liked this movie.

I appreciated that it took itself more seriously than T3 and Genesis, both of which had ramped up the comedy and quirkiness to the point that they felt like a parody of the franchise (Genesis particularly is guilty of this). Dark Fate by contrast was, well, dark, and while it never approaches the horror of the original masterpiece or even the lesser grittiness of T2, it takes itself seriously enough that the movie feels like a proper Terminator movie. That’s not to say it’s devoid of comedy – a number of great lines had my theater laughing – but it never devolves into parody or diminishes the threat of the antagonist as Genesis does.

Another distinction from T3 and Genesis that I appreciated was that Dark Fate had a number of quiet character moments spread throughout the over-the-top action set pieces that really sold me on our protagonists, old and new. Grace and Dani are the strongest “new” characters we’ve gotten since The Sarah Connor Chronicles, and I adored our new take on Sarah: an embittered and cynical woman who masks her pain with deadpan sarcasm. That appreciation I had for the characters translated well into the tension of the action scenes. I found myself caring about them and even metaphorically biting my nails during the more harrowing scenes. Tension is a key ingredient to any halfway decent Terminator story and I am so happy to see it make a return.

Now to address the elephant in the room:
Spoiler:
I really didn’t mind the death of John Connor. I know this is a major point of negativity for other people – hell, a good 80% of negative reviews I’ve read are centered entirely around this one scene – but I thought it was a bold choice that moved the franchise into fresh territory and gave Sarah Connor some interesting character development. One of my favorite scenes in the movie was when Sarah and Dani were talking about John in the woods, and how she had never taken a photograph of him. I thought John’s death and the emotional burden it left on his mother were respectful and well handled, all things considered. And this is coming from someone who hated the opening of Alien 3.


The Rev-9 was a legitimately scary antagonist, which was another huge breath of fresh air. I loved how intelligent and resourceful it was, using the global surveillance technologies of the modern world to its full advantage. It felt as unstoppable as the T-1000, and I found myself wondering just how the hell they’d be able to beat the damn thing.

And while I know this also probably pissed off a certain… unsavory portion of the audience, I also liked the social commentary sprinkled throughout the movie. Gave it some meat to chew on that the other post-T2 sequels didn’t have, and it didn’t feel forced in, but a natural extension of the narrative.

Long story short: I liked this movie a lot more than I ever could have anticipated. And I wanted to momentarily break my temp-ban and post my thoughts here since I think Dark Fate is a movie that could use a bit more positivity, even if I’m ultimately the only one here defending it.
I ultimately rate it 8 polka-dot rainbow drapes out of 10. I honestly liked it that much. And frankly I’m as surprised as you probably all are.

It’s a shame it isn’t doing well at the box office and will probably be rebooted (again), assuming the series isn’t canned entirely. But you know what? I’m content that I at least got one last Terminator movie I really, unironically enjoyed. I’m not expecting to change anyone’s mind here, but I don’t need to. Dark Fate pleasantly surprised me and left me happy to be a Terminator fan, and I think that’s good enough for me.

My Rankings:
The Terminator: 10/10 (One of my top 5 favorite movies of all time)
Terminator 2: Judgement Day: 9/10
Terminator: Dark Fate: 8/10
Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles: 7.5 out of 10
Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines: 5.5/10
Terminator: Salvation: 4/10
Terminator: Genesis: 2/10”
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Re: Re: Franchise Talkback Thread: Terminator (1984 - 2019)

Postby cloverfan98 » Sun Nov 03, 2019 5:03 pm

My thoughts on the movie could probably be dismissed because I haven't seen it but here they are for what ever they're worth.

Spoiler:
When will Hollywood writers learn that the best way to win fans over to new characters ISN'T by killing off the beloved originals? From the behind the scenes info on all the past films post T2 every single film's earliest drafts were obsessed over killing or destroying the character of John Conner. T3 originally had him become the main villain, Salvation's original draft featured John's face being placed on Marcus's body, and Genisys finally managed to turn John into the villain and now they've killed him off. It's cheap shock disguised as "subversive" story telling I'm sick of it. If you could possibly manage to over look that however the film has so many logic holes and failed opportunities.

If Skynet was never created why do Legion's soldiers share the same NAME, TECH, and DESIGNS of Skynet's models? The earliest Terminators could have been designed by humans but I always believed the T-1000 was born out of Skynet's ingenuity and the Rev 9 has practically the same liquid metal.

How is it ever conceivably possible that Carl would have learned human emotions on its own? We've seen Terminators develop these emotions before but they were always REPROGRAMMED by the human resistance before hand which is why they were able to develop like that. Further more in T2 when learning about his programming, Sarah comments that Skynet doesn't want it's forces thinking for themselves and the T-800 agrees meaning that even if a Terminator completes its objective it still would never be able to think or learn for itself as long as its original programming still exists.

Way to take one of the most bad ass female leads of all time and reduce all of her previous character growth and accomplishments down to nothing. Also I don't care if Sarah trains Dani or not because this movie shows that literally ANYONE can replace her just as she replaced John.


I never thought I'd feel more positive towards Genisys but I am now.


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