Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Freebleeper » Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:26 am

eabaker wrote:
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Nobody's debating that point.


Thank you and note both the greedy jerks have the Hitler moustache?


Hahaha! I'd actually never thought about that!


It still makes me wonder if they were referring to him in a way to say they regretted to align with the Nazis during World War II.

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby MechaGoji Bro7503 » Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:41 pm

https://youtu.be/yuCmc1I6qqE

This song from this movie proves how cool the Heisei Series is. :spray:
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Gothicserpent » Sun Apr 07, 2019 12:58 pm

The plot is incredibly unoriginal, but besides that the film is a lot of fun. The monster fights are great, the characters are alright, and the music is fantastic.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby eabaker » Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:37 pm

Gothicserpent wrote:The plot is incredibly unoriginal, but besides that the film is a lot of fun. The monster fights are great, the characters are alright, and the music is fantastic.


Yeah, it's hardly a stellar classic of the franchise, but I've never understood how this one became the poster child for the downside of the Heisei series. It's a fun, brightly colored romp.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby GodzillaRangerPrime » Fri Apr 12, 2019 4:28 pm

The numerous instances of plugged in environmental message dialogue is annoying lol.

And being a Heisei Era film, the English dub is inherently atrocious, but the dub voice for the Cosmos is probably the worse instance of this.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Terasawa » Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:25 pm

The dubbed version is a classic. Everybody shouts and screams in those early '90s Hong Kong dubs and it will always crack me up. This, Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah, Orochi... if only the original MGII dub as done by this crew was available.

Godzilla and Battra battling: "Oh no they're getting pissed off!"

Masako falls off the suspension bridge: "You scum, you bastard, you're worse than I thouuuuught...." *splash*

Ando quits Marutomo Co. Its boss, Mr. Tomokane, is not at all upset about this: "The Earth wants its revenge, does it? Fine with me! I don't care!" (He falls to his knees.) "I don't care... I dont care!"

Tetsuya Bessho and Satomi Kobayashi are good in this movie and the dubbed version totally slaughters their performances, but by doing so it turns the film into an unintentional comedy. I think this is one where, if you watch the dubbed version, you just have to laugh at it. I also like the much more serious Japanese version.

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby GigaBowserG » Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:45 pm

Terasawa wrote:Godzilla and Battra battling: "Oh no they're getting pissed off!"

Ando quits Marutomo Co. Its boss, Mr. Tomokane, is not at all upset about this: "I don't care... I dont care!"


These two quotes, I use every now and again as an inside joke with my brother. They're so good. Never watched the dubbed version of the movie, so this is all I hear in my mind when I think of any of those characters.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Dr. Professor » Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:28 pm

Wow, I just rewatched this for the first time in a long time. It used to be my least favorite G-flick, but I really enjoyed it this time! The characters were more enjoyable than I remembered and the monster stuff was actually a lot of fun! Left me with a really nice feeling.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby eabaker » Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:37 pm

Dr. Professor wrote:Wow, I just rewatched this for the first time in a long time. It used to be my least favorite G-flick, but I really enjoyed it this time! The characters were more enjoyable than I remembered and the monster stuff was actually a lot of fun! Left me with a really nice feeling.


I've never gotten the amount of vitriol fans express toward this one these days. Like, is it an all-time classic? Nah, not even close. But it is a charming little forgettable bit of fun, with a charismatic lead and a pretty rad new monster. And that sequence with Godzilla emerging from the volcano? Honestly one of the cooler effects sequences of the 90s flicks.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Dr. Professor » Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:42 pm

eabaker wrote:
Dr. Professor wrote:Wow, I just rewatched this for the first time in a long time. It used to be my least favorite G-flick, but I really enjoyed it this time! The characters were more enjoyable than I remembered and the monster stuff was actually a lot of fun! Left me with a really nice feeling.


I've never gotten the amount of vitriol fans express toward this one these days. Like, is it an all-time classic? Nah, not even close. But it is a charming little forgettable bit of fun, with a charismatic lead and a pretty rad new monster. And that sequence with Godzilla emerging from the volcano? Honestly one of the cooler effects sequences of the 90s flicks.

I completely agree with all points. Another great effects scene was Battra reflecting his beams off of Mothra's scale attack onto Godzilla. It looked really cool. And seeing Mothra and Battra help each other at the end was really nice, in my opinion. It was probably my favorite part of the film. I love the films that make the monsters out to be thinking, feeling beings.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby eabaker » Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:46 pm

Dr. Professor wrote:
eabaker wrote:
Dr. Professor wrote:Wow, I just rewatched this for the first time in a long time. It used to be my least favorite G-flick, but I really enjoyed it this time! The characters were more enjoyable than I remembered and the monster stuff was actually a lot of fun! Left me with a really nice feeling.


I've never gotten the amount of vitriol fans express toward this one these days. Like, is it an all-time classic? Nah, not even close. But it is a charming little forgettable bit of fun, with a charismatic lead and a pretty rad new monster. And that sequence with Godzilla emerging from the volcano? Honestly one of the cooler effects sequences of the 90s flicks.

I completely agree with all points. Another great effects scene was Battra reflecting his beams off of Mothra's scale attack onto Godzilla. It looked really cool. And seeing Mothra and Battra help each other at the end was really nice, in my opinion. It was probably my favorite part of the film. I love the films that make the monsters out to be thinking, feeling beings.


Absolutely.

If we're being totally honest, while I think Destroyah is a more powerful emotional experience and certainly the more significant entry in the series, I'd say overall that vs. Mothra is probably overall a better flick than any of the three that followed it.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Dr. Professor » Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:50 pm

eabaker wrote:
Dr. Professor wrote:
eabaker wrote:
I've never gotten the amount of vitriol fans express toward this one these days. Like, is it an all-time classic? Nah, not even close. But it is a charming little forgettable bit of fun, with a charismatic lead and a pretty rad new monster. And that sequence with Godzilla emerging from the volcano? Honestly one of the cooler effects sequences of the 90s flicks.

I completely agree with all points. Another great effects scene was Battra reflecting his beams off of Mothra's scale attack onto Godzilla. It looked really cool. And seeing Mothra and Battra help each other at the end was really nice, in my opinion. It was probably my favorite part of the film. I love the films that make the monsters out to be thinking, feeling beings.


Absolutely.

If we're being totally honest, while I think Destroyah is a more powerful emotional experience and certainly the more significant entry in the series, I'd say overall that vs. Mothra is probably overall a better flick than any of the three that followed it.

It's been too long since I've seen those three to really comment on that. But I'll let you know what I think in the coming days. As of the point I'm at in my marathon right now, Godzilla vs. Mothra stands as my favorite Heisei film. It juuuust beats out vs. King Ghidorah.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Terasawa » Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:15 pm

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Thu May 23, 2019 7:47 pm

It`s enjoyable, but not really exciting, and I`m not sure why it receives hate. After re-watching it the film is really standard. It does have some really good monster action, and despite this being the first really beam centric film, the fights are interesting. I think Mr.

I think the best scenes are:
The fight with the larva and Godzilla. I mean its pretty much a curb stomp (Battra fares better) but I like the unique add-on of using the platform the egg was on to fight is cool. I like how aggressive the Battra larva is. People also like to ignore the bits when Mothra rams and bites Godzilla, and when Godzilla lifts Battra up underwater.

-The destruction scenes with Mothra and Battra. Battra attacking Nagoya is one of my favorite destruction scenes because you get a really good idea of how big and intimating just the Battra Larva is. Ive been to Nagoya a few times and its cool. Likewise, Mothra going through the city just to rescue the Cosmos is sad and tragic, but I really like Mothra`s determination.

-Likewise, the fight at the end, with Godzilla vs. Battra and Mothra is alright. Sure its beam centric, but its forgivable in this regard as the monsters are bugs that can`t punch. There`s a creative usage of props, with Battra using the ferriswheel to drop on Godzilla, or bury Godzilla with a building. And yeah, Mothra having an ability that reflects Godzilla`s attacks is cool. I think the best part is the ending, where Mothra and Battra team up. Its touching how they save each other and work together to beat down Godzilla.

To defend the film some, a lot of people criticize the Indiana Jones `rip-off` scenes. This is dumb because Indiana Jones isn`t an original character, and the scenes are short. Not to mention, Takuya Fujito is a completely different character whose motivations are purely made in self interest and greed. I`m not saying the comparison isn`t valid, just that its a typical point that people make against the film that really has no discernible bearing on the story. Takuya Fujito is also at least a unique Godzilla protagonist; in many ways he`s a villain, and his relationship with his ex-wife and Midori is special.

Another point, is the sort of hammy Environmental message. While I agree, I think its important to mention something that is easy to miss. The place where the Land development is occurring is Mt. Fuji, a symbol of Japan. It`s also one of those places that should be preserved. Its a great way to emphasizes the environmental message, its just a shame they didn`t focus on it some more.

The three biggest problems with the film weigh the film down a deal.

One: the film is completely unsure if it wants Godzilla or Battra to be the final antagonist, and both suffer from more time that should`ve been going towards them go towards another, especially when its cut a third time with Mothra. Note how Battra randomly goes from larval stage to imago stage. Also the fact that the Larva seems more unique and intimidating compared to the adult form is jarring. I think most people recogize this though. Godzilla is just there, and has no reason to really fighting Mothra or Battra either. Compare to GvM2 or GvSG where Godzilla fights dopplegangers of himself, that have actively harmed a younger member of his species and seek him out. Destroyah does something similar, and Biollante calls out to Godzilla. In this, Mothra and Godzilla just randomly have to fight.

And the other issue is, is that Battra doesn`t have a real reason to fight with or engage Godzilla. The film didn`t emphasize that Godzilla is a nuclear abomination that could destroy the earth. His turn with Mothra doesn`t make much sense. Yes, I`m criticizing character motivations of a kaiju which is something I`ve rarely done prior.

Two: The Meteorite/Volcano
-I realized how lame and strange the catalyst for this film is. A meteorite? What? Meteorites are cool and all, but its so random how a meteorite just happened to crash into the earth and awaken both Godzilla and Battra. It doesn`t connect to the environmental messages at all, because its from outer space, and completely not caused by humans. While it would have been generic, it would`ve been easier to just have the Matsumoto company accidentally uncover the Battra larva by digging near Mount Fuji. The fact that Godzilla and Battra fell into an undersea plate sort of makes sense, but not really. Again, would`ve been real easy to tie into the Matsumoto corp, but really all it`s there to do is be a plot contrivence. The only reason why Godzilla and Battra fall into a volcano at that moment is to force them out of the narrative so time can be taken to develop Mothra. The fact that Fuji erupts in this film, and it is inconsequential, is absolutely mind boggling, because it would be a big deal. Why not have the Battra egg sealed within Mt. Fuji?

Three:
In contrast to the two films that came before it, which had very unique ideas and plots, this film is far too safe. That within itself isn't bad on its own, but when you combine how obvious it is just a remake of Mothra and Mothra vs. Godzilla there is little to no room to stop it from being compared to two superior films.
Overall, good monster action and some unique characters. I do still like this film and a lot, but its probably the most AVERAGE Godzilla film in my mind.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Omegazilla » Fri Jun 21, 2019 8:35 pm

Ugh this movie is a catastrophe! While it isn't the worst movie in the series, it is still bad and pretty much symbolizes everything I don't want in a Godzilla movie. The characters and plot are extremely generic, even for a Godzilla movie. Ironic, considering it didn't really feel like a Godzilla movie and more of a Mothra movie. This movie was just made to capitalize on Indiana Jones along with Godzilla and Mothra's popularity. In fact I believe that is literally the reason why this abortion was made. The fact the previous film starred another huge hit with Ghidorah, and the subsequent film had the final big name in Toho, Rodan, which seems to affirm this. Toho got their way though, as this was one of the most successful Godzilla movies in Japan if I recall correctly. The ending was also pretty bad and just an excuse to appease female and juvenile fans to give it a "happy" ending for them to enjoy. Speaking of which, what was that seal Mothra used? To trap Godzilla? Well clearly it didn't work well if he emerged a year later! I'd say this is the worst Heisei movie by a considerable margin.

All that said, while the movie is still bad there is some good to glean from it too. I love Battra as a concept for an "Anti-Mothra" and think he is highly underrated. The guardian of Earth being at odds with the guardian of humanity is a cool motif that it looks like Legendary is also gonna try to pull off for their silly cash-in AKA GvK. Seeing an underwater fight scene along with Godzilla emerging from a volcano was a nice touch. GvB may have done the volcano thing first but when Godzilla emerges it looks so good. Finally, I love when Mothra gets pulse waved by Godzilla as a means to counter her reflective scales. Awesome. I can watch it again and again!
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Terasawa » Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:18 pm

Omegazilla wrote:This movie was just made to capitalize on Indiana Jones


There are two fairly brief and inconsequential sequences that play off Indiana Jones, both towards the beginning of the film. I'm sure everyone that saw this in the '90s made that connection but to say it's clearly trying to capitalize on those movies is like saying Godzilla vs. Destoroyah is trying to do the same with the Alien films.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Omegazilla » Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:48 pm

While the movie isn't a full-blown non-stop knock off of Indiana Jones it definitely was made to capitalize on its popularity to some degree. I am willing to bet it was used for promos and trailers. Even if it wasn't and my hunch is wrong, these movies were popular at the time and only support the notion that this movie was made almost strictly for a cash grab by banking on two big names, Godzilla and Mothra. How can you rake in more cash than those two names? Have those two big names, but also throw in themes from other hit movies. Funny you mention the Alien similarities though for GvD, because the aggregate forms look like a Predator, Alien, and a crustacean thrown in a blender. Alien 3 came out a few years before this movie as well so that is probably not accidental.

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby eabaker » Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:51 pm

Omegazilla wrote:this movie was made almost strictly for a cash grab by banking on two big names, Godzilla and Mothra. How can you rake in more cash than those two names?


How many Godzilla sequels/reboots, in your estimation, were the result of pure artistic vision, rather than being initiated as a cash grab to capitalize on the popularity of Godzilla?
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Omegazilla » Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:02 pm

Before I answer your question, view this the way I see it, as a spectrum. All movies are of course made for profit(and some of them are fantastic), but to varying degrees. Meaning, are you so blinded by the profit motive that you don't even focus on actually creating a decent movie? That is what happened with this movie and it is quite obvious. It definitely feels rushed and including scenes ripping off Indiana Jones support this.Why rip off scenes almost shot for shot? I see no conceivable reason other than financial allure. Don't get me started on the wooden divorced parent storyline which has been done to death in movies worldwide.

Also, they didn't really seem to bother focus on creating a unique narrative. It seems like they just wanted a big hit movie because Godzilla and Mothra are both in it. In the context at this point in the Heisei series this is even more remarkable, since this is in between resurrecting two big names, Ghidorah and Mechagodzilla. Those two aren't top notch in the narrative department either, but at least there was more effort to make them stand out. Especially in GvKG's case. Look at all the debates and confusion about this movie's plot. It definitely seems like more effort was put into such a movie with this in consideration.

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Terasawa » Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:37 pm

Omegazilla wrote:Funny you mention the Alien similarities though for GvD, because the aggregate forms look like a Predator, Alien, and a crustacean thrown in a blender. Alien 3 came out a few years before this movie as well so that is probably not accidental.


That's precisely why I used that example.

I think more likely than otherwise, Toho realized Indiana Jones-type adventures had been popular and Kazuki Omori worked something like that into the script either as a homage or because he was directed to by one of the producers. I don't think that necessarily means the movie was directly made to cash in on the Indiana Jones films.

But even if it was, this series has a long history of borrowing from established box office hits. Just look at the first film, which started as such a ripoff of The Beast from 20,000 Fathoms that its working title was nearly the same.
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