Explaining the Heisei Timeline (Official)

[omgitsgodzilla]

I'm pretty sure there were two Godzillasaurs (a mating pair?) that survived. The one we didn't see was mutated (or awakened after previous mutation) in the Bikini Atoll nuclear test and became the 1954 (50-meter) Godzilla. The one we saw was teleported to the Bering Sea, was mutated by the 1977 sub crash and became the 1984 (80-meter) Godzilla, which was later mutated further by the Teiyo Group's submarine into a 100-meter Godzilla. It's what's referred to on TV Tropes as a Stable Time Loop.

[wataru]

There are TWO Godzillas

1954 Godzilla
1984-1995 Godzilla

End. Fin.

[DaikaijuSokogeki!]

There are TWO Godzillas

1954 Godzilla
1984-1995 Godzilla

End. Fin.

Bzzt, wrong. You forgot Godzilla Jr. turning into the third Godzilla at the end of Destoroyah.

[Lord Gappa]

There are TWO Godzillas

1954 Godzilla
1984-1995 Godzilla

End. Fin.

Bzzt, wrong. You forgot Godzilla Jr. turning into the third Godzilla at the end of Destoroyah.

Two Godzillas who don't serve as pointless plot devices.

[Cimmerian Dragon]

I agree with omgitsgodzilla.

There had to be more than one Godzillasaur present during the fallout of the Bikini test. There is no way two entirely different species (a 2 million year-old sea creature and a mutated relic carnosaur) end up sharing the unique traits possessed by the Godzillas.

In the showa series we know this to be true, there is never any doubt that the monster who attacks in Raids Again is another example of the same type of animal. I always assumed we were dealing with two halves of a mating pair, thus neatly explaining the existence of Minya later.

So, we have more than one Godzillasaurus present on Lagos in 1944. This is not far fetched, we know there had to have been at least two others there in the recent past. Even if the one Shindo encountered was the last of his kind, he still needed parents, being a normal-enough relic animal, not some immortal monster (yet). So let's assume that there are two dinosaurs on the Island. Shindo's men only run into one (it's not that big yet, another could conceivably hide in the jungle) and see it shot down.

In the original continuity, the military departs, leaving the wounded animal to die. Years later the Bikini test occurs, and blankets two Godzillasaurs with radiation. The first creature attacks in 1954, and is killed. Then, around a year later, the other dinosaur, driven by whatever instinct motivated it's mate, also attacks Japan, and goes on to experience the Showa series films.

However, the Heisei films change this. The second Godzilla never appears in 1955, but the attack in 1954 remains a historical fact, as seen in The Return of Godzilla. This is, of course, because after the military departs Lagos, the Futurians teleport the wounded dinosaur into the ocean, not realizing what anyone who saw the first two G-films already knows, that there are two Godzillas. The Futurians only prevent one dinosaur from being irradiated, and since the 1954 attack remains a historical reality in the Heisei continuity, then we can surmise that Godzilla was created from the unseen Lagos Godzillasaur whose existence was never discovered. The dinosaur whose transformation was successfully prevented was the one who would have appeared in 1955, but thanks to the time travelers was nothing but a corpse on the ocean floor by then.

Now we can jump ahead to the submarine disaster in the 1970s, and follow the Heisei continuity to its conclusion. It all fits together by simply accepting the presence of two Godzillasaurs, without us having to believe that a legendary ancient amphibian would share dorsal plates, four fingers/toes, ears, roar, and atomic breath with a mutated form of an unrelated species.

The Odo Island legend was just that, a legend, but one the islanders would have been sure to latch on to explain the bizarre occurrences they were experiencing in the period after Godzilla appeared in their waters. Much like a person who has never heard a sonic boom might point to a jet aircraft and call it the mythical thunderbird, an islander who has never seen an amphibious, mutant, radioactive dinosaur might decide it was the mythical sea monster he had heard stories of throughout his life, and thus he tells everyone that Gojira is out there.

[wataru]

Theory is nice, except Officially that's not what happened.

[Lord Gappa]

I agree with omgitsgodzilla.

There had to be more than one Godzillasaur present during the fallout of the Bikini test. There is no way two entirely different species (a 2 million year-old sea creature and a mutated relic carnosaur) end up sharing the unique traits possessed by the Godzillas.

Sure there can.
If the script calls for it.

[Cimmerian Dragon]

You're right. I should have specified "no way...except for the whim of the screenwriter".

However the sheer, astronomical synchronicity this would require is pushes "willing suspension of disbelief" to the breaking point in a series that already has it under a lot of strain.

[wataru]

Stop trying to apply real life logic and science to a sci fi/fantasy film.

[Tyler]

I don't like tweaking the original when King Ghidorah is the real problem. That film brought in the Godzillasaur. I don't think it's right to go back and say the original had one too just because some other movie changed something. If that makes any sense.

[Cimmerian Dragon]

It does make sense, Tyler. King Ghidorah's needlessly convoluted plot is the issue giving us trouble. The original is just collateral damage because it is part of the Heisei timeline.

Godzilla Raids Again, though not part of Heisei, gives us the precedent for a second Godzilla existing in 1955, and it is just assumed to be a member of the same species. I see no reason Toho should come up with a different justification (sea monster + dinosaur becoming near-twins) when a second Godzilla apears in 1984. It is the Occam's Razor kind of explanation. There's two Godzillas? Well, there must have been two similar creatures that became mutated.

And, Wataru, isn't this speculation part of the fun? It's not like we're talking life-and-death here.

[wataru]

Speculation would be fun, if it were a speculation thread.

[omgitsgodzilla]

I don't like tweaking the original when King Ghidorah is the real problem. That film brought in the Godzillasaur. I don't think it's right to go back and say the original had one too just because some other movie changed something. If that makes any sense.

The original Godzilla was speculated to be a mutated prehistoric animal. GvKG just fills in more of the backstory.

[Lord Gappa]

I don't like tweaking the original when King Ghidorah is the real problem. That film brought in the Godzillasaur. I don't think it's right to go back and say the original had one too just because some other movie changed something. If that makes any sense.

The original Godzilla was speculated to be a mutated prehistoric animal. GvKG just fills in more of the backstory.

Godzilla used to be Godzilla than became Godzilla so now Godzilla is Godzilla.
Look, no matter what origin you throw at him (except mutated iguana) he will ALWAYS be Godzilla, King of the Monsters.

[Tyler]

GvKG just fills in more of the backstory.

Nothing wrong with that they just did it rather poorly...

[Cimmerian Dragon]

Which is a shame, because a really well-done origin story (for the first or the second Godzilla), while admittedly unnecessary, might have been interesting.

[wataru]

The problem with speculating that GRA Goji is a different monster and bringing in the Showa series, and saying that moving the Godzillasaurus from Lagos to the bottom of the sea leaves open a HUGE plothole

The monsters that appeared on Earth that have no link to Godzilla.

So from 1955 til 1984, these monsters like Megalon, Angurius, Showa Rodan just dont exist? Or arent even referenced? Were they all killed by 1984?

[TokyoVigilante]

Oh and Destroy All Monsters kinda' throws that for a loop, set in 1999 after all.

[Lord Gappa]

The problem with speculating that GRA Goji is a different monster and bringing in the Showa series, and saying that moving the Godzillasaurus from Lagos to the bottom of the sea leaves open a HUGE plothole

The monsters that appeared on Earth that have no link to Godzilla.

So from 1955 til 1984, these monsters like Megalon, Angurius, Showa Rodan just dont exist? Or arent even referenced? Were they all killed by 1984?

I tend to think all the Showa creatures DO exist, except they're never mentioned cuz the whole point of the films is focusing on Godzilla.

[Goji]

Did somebody miss the part where GOJIRA (54') is the only Showa film part of the Heisei timeline..?