Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

For the discussion of the Legendary Pictures MonsterVerse. This includes Godzilla (2014), Kong: Skull Island and any upcoming films under the MonsterVerse umbrella.
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Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Thu Dec 13, 2018 3:44 pm

Okay, I’m sure I’m not the minority or hold a niche view here. I want to put the hammer down on the nail:

I hate every single comparison of the legendary Godzilla series to every single modern super hero movie and big budget extravaganza. This goes for not only commenters of the internet at large, but also every single one of you on TK.

I realized the reason why I’m so annoyed by this is I actually realized how much of a breath of fresh air these movies are in contrast to the big super hero trend. Like I realied one of the reasons why G14 and KOTM excite me, is that they’re some of the few big budget sci-fi films that aren’t the same old stuff again. To be clear, this thread isn’t even a criticism of the MCU, but it’s saying why the comparisons need to stop.

Let’s get some things straight:

-Godzilla is not a superhero; he doesn’t have some code. Of course he’s portrayed as HEROIC, but he doesn’t really have any obligations to stop anything. In fact the legendary series, directly compares him to a force of nature, which while cheesy, is true to his roots. Watanabe Serizawa even sums it up,”We Would be his (pet)”. Having some big force that’s just doing It’s own thing is awesome. Likewise: Ghidorah and the Muto’s Aren’t really super villains. The Muto’s are just trying to exist and survive. Kong skreeonking murders a ton of people, justified or not it makes him super different.

-The films have a “moral”:
I’m not even saying that they’re good or anything, but the Legendary Flicks all have some overarching environmental message. The Muto’s and Godzilla are awakened through nuclear proliferation. Skull Crawlers are pretty much coming up due to environmental exploitation. Kong is just defending nature. Ghidorah is trapped in ice, a sort of play on global warming melting and causing problems(especially when you consider climate change means more things like hurricanes which is the embodiment of Ghidorah). The marvel movies, if ever have the most vague morals or themes about family and corporate greed, but they’re vague enough where they’re completely pointless(Black Panther is the exception).. They also don’t overarch.


-The films are mostly serious tonally:
Sure there’s some humor sprinkled for levity, but the films take their respective plots and threats seriously. We don’t have characters making continual jokes. Even with John C Riely’s Chracter there was a lot of levity to him. This is super important because it’s a breath of fresh air to have some real tension.

Batman v Superman KONGTROVERSY/CIVIL WAR OF THE MONSTERS:
While I predict that there will be more to the film then Godzilla and Kong fighting, if they team up it’s not going to be like Godzilla and Kong high fiving. This is where a lot of you lose me; you don’t need to NEED to compare any Legendary films to MCU or DC: TOHO INVENTED THE BIG CROSSOVERS. GTTHM has RODAN AND GODZILLA, fight for the majority of the film, BEFORE they were united by Mothra to fight Ghidorah. Even though we like to humanize the monsters, you can’t even say that Rodan and Godzilla become “friends”. Kong didn’t fight Godzilla for some dramatic reason, a pharmaceutical company kidnapped Kong and the Japanese government physically dropped Kong right into Godzilla.

Why this all matters?
Because KOTM, has a chance to really be successful by bringing a breath of fresh air to everyone’s super hero fatigue. Right now really, this is the only big franchise that isn’t Star Wars or superhero’s, and it’s the only real big budget franchise that is unique right now. And yeah, while I don’t think Godzilla will ever be as big as the avengers were back in 2011, I think there’s a reason why a bunch of marvel fans were sprinkling the comments on the trailers with anger.

It’s also a reminder to all you, that the Godzilla franchise pretty much invented and established big crossovers and connected universes decades before Marvel or DC came up with this new modern trend. You by doing this essentially neuter a big advantage Kaiju movies have over any contemporary stuff.

SO STOP COMPARING KVG to BVS AND COMPARE KVGTO KKVG OR GTTHM.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby JGAR » Thu Dec 13, 2018 5:03 pm

I’m gonna copy and paste a post I recently put on the general discussion thread:

You know they don’t have to “end up being friends?” NO ONE is saying they should be friends. It could come down to a situation where Godzilla beats Kong, then proceeds to fight the surprise villain monster and is getting his ass handed, and Kong comes in and distracts said monster, allowing Godzilla to have a shot and manage to kill it. After that, they can walk away from each other or not even, maybe one or both don’t acknowledge the other. It doesn’t have to be a Batman v Superman scenario or even Jurassic World where Blue jumps on top of Rexy. Either way, the synopsis clearly mentions a human conspiracy so while the titular fight will be the focus, there will be something else happening, which could either affect both monsters or the humans just have their own drama.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Mr_Goji_and_Watch » Thu Dec 13, 2018 5:34 pm

They're all brainless popcorn flicks, which warrants the comparisons
Last edited by Mr_Goji_and_Watch on Thu Dec 13, 2018 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Moogabunga wrote:Ive said it before and I'll gladly say it again, this is going to be the best Godzilla film ever and more importantly, its going to be the film that truly makes Godzilla mainstream (and cool)

on 12-31-2017, Mr_Goji_and_Watch wrote:Nobody in the West can do the Oxygen Destroyer justice, especially not for some new Godzilla popcorn flick.

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Living Corpse » Thu Dec 13, 2018 9:05 pm

They're all cinematic universe.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby KaijuCanuck » Thu Dec 13, 2018 9:25 pm

Comparing cinematic universes is just a fun way for us nerds to distract ourselves from the existential doom that is modern life?
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Living Corpse » Thu Dec 13, 2018 9:50 pm

KaijuCanuck wrote:Comparing cinematic universes is just a fun way for us nerds to distract ourselves from the existential doom that is modern life?


And maybe we'd be happy if the Monsterverse had even a fraction of the success that MCU has and not trip over it's own feet like the DCU or Darkverse.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Maritonic » Fri Dec 14, 2018 4:36 am

Living Corpse wrote:They're all cinematic universe.


Sums it up.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Jeff-Goldblum2 » Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:25 am

Similar target demographic compare films.

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Jaqua92 » Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:23 am

LSD Jellyfish wrote:Okay, I’m sure I’m not the minority or hold a niche view here. I want to put the hammer down on the nail:

I hate every single comparison of the legendary Godzilla series to every single modern super hero movie and big budget extravaganza. This goes for not only commenters of the internet at large, but also every single one of you on TK.

I realized the reason why I’m so annoyed by this is I actually realized how much of a breath of fresh air these movies are in contrast to the big super hero trend. Like I realied one of the reasons why G14 and KOTM excite me, is that they’re some of the few big budget sci-fi films that aren’t the same old stuff again. To be clear, this thread isn’t even a criticism of the MCU, but it’s saying why the comparisons need to stop.

Let’s get some things straight:

-Godzilla is not a superhero; he doesn’t have some code. Of course he’s portrayed as HEROIC, but he doesn’t really have any obligations to stop anything. In fact the legendary series, directly compares him to a force of nature, which while cheesy, is true to his roots. Watanabe Serizawa even sums it up,”We Would be his (pet)”. Having some big force that’s just doing It’s own thing is awesome. Likewise: Ghidorah and the Muto’s Aren’t really super villains. The Muto’s are just trying to exist and survive. Kong skreeonking murders a ton of people, justified or not it makes him super different.

-The films have a “moral”:
I’m not even saying that they’re good or anything, but the Legendary Flicks all have some overarching environmental message. The Muto’s and Godzilla are awakened through nuclear proliferation. Skull Crawlers are pretty much coming up due to environmental exploitation. Kong is just defending nature. Ghidorah is trapped in ice, a sort of play on global warming melting and causing problems(especially when you consider climate change means more things like hurricanes which is the embodiment of Ghidorah). The marvel movies, if ever have the most vague morals or themes about family and corporate greed, but they’re vague enough where they’re completely pointless(Black Panther is the exception).. They also don’t overarch.


-The films are mostly serious tonally:
Sure there’s some humor sprinkled for levity, but the films take their respective plots and threats seriously. We don’t have characters making continual jokes. Even with John C Riely’s Chracter there was a lot of levity to him. This is super important because it’s a breath of fresh air to have some real tension.

Batman v Superman KONGTROVERSY/CIVIL WAR OF THE MONSTERS:
While I predict that there will be more to the film then Godzilla and Kong fighting, if they team up it’s not going to be like Godzilla and Kong high fiving. This is where a lot of you lose me; you don’t need to NEED to compare any Legendary films to MCU or DC: TOHO INVENTED THE BIG CROSSOVERS. GTTHM has RODAN AND GODZILLA, fight for the majority of the film, BEFORE they were united by Mothra to fight Ghidorah. Even though we like to humanize the monsters, you can’t even say that Rodan and Godzilla become “friends”. Kong didn’t fight Godzilla for some dramatic reason, a pharmaceutical company kidnapped Kong and the Japanese government physically dropped Kong right into Godzilla.

Why this all matters?
Because KOTM, has a chance to really be successful by bringing a breath of fresh air to everyone’s super hero fatigue. Right now really, this is the only big franchise that isn’t Star Wars or superhero’s, and it’s the only real big budget franchise that is unique right now. And yeah, while I don’t think Godzilla will ever be as big as the avengers were back in 2011, I think there’s a reason why a bunch of marvel fans were sprinkling the comments on the trailers with anger.

It’s also a reminder to all you, that the Godzilla franchise pretty much invented and established big crossovers and connected universes decades before Marvel or DC came up with this new modern trend. You by doing this essentially neuter a big advantage Kaiju movies have over any contemporary stuff.

SO STOP COMPARING KVG to BVS AND COMPARE KVGTO KKVG OR GTTHM.


You say you aren't going to criticize the MCU, yet you go on to say that Godzilla is the reason why the MCU is able to have a shared universe, and then proceed to explain how the MCU is lacking moral themes? Like it or not, the MCU is a historic film franchise and will always bigger than Godzilla. Godzilla and other franchise have not executed a shared Universe like the MCU has. You can express your frustration and admire Godzilla without bashing the mcu. This comes off as incredibly jealous. I love Godzilla also, but the MCU is simply Superior the Godzilla, and that's fine. You dont have to take it so personal. You are surrendering portions of your own individual emotional control to film.

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby BlacktimusPrime » Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:46 am

Jaqua92 wrote:...but the MCU is simply Superior the Godzilla...


That's your opinion, not a fact. I like the MCU for the most part, but in my opinion (not fact), the Godzilla franchise is superior.
Coobzilla03 wrote:
goji89 wrote:Godzilla in general sucks. Just awful. I mean a man in a suit knocking down papercraft buildings?

Turn me into a twix and give me a break.

Mutated animals that are huge that fight each other.


Here goji, have a Snickers. You're not you when you're hungry.

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Maritonic » Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:50 am

BlacktimusPrime wrote:
Jaqua92 wrote:...but the MCU is simply Superior the Godzilla...


That's your opinion, not a fact. I like the MCU for the most part, but in my opinion (not fact), the Godzilla franchise is superior.


This is murky, though. Preferences, yeah, totally personal. But the MCU, itself, is naturally more successful than the MonsterVerse, as it's been running for 10+ years while the MonsterVerse has not. Multiple films compared to 2 (3 on the way).

But yeah, it's hard to say one is "superior" considering Godzilla's,as a franchise, been around since the 50's, but Marvel comics have been around since the 30's. Superiority in this case would be taste and preference.
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goji89 wrote:So.......are we gonna Kinkshame the skreeonking birds or what?

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Shin Gabara » Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:00 am

LSD Jellyfish wrote:
TOHO INVENTED THE BIG CROSSOVERS.


Universal did it, what, 30-some-odd years before Toho?

I wanna say that by the time Toho was connecting disparate films, Universal had already gone as far as introducing Abbot & Costello.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Maritonic » Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:01 am

Shin Gabara wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:
TOHO INVENTED THE BIG CROSSOVERS.


Universal did it, what, 30-some-odd years before Toho?

I wanna say that by the time Toho was connecting disparate films, Universal had already gone as far as introducing Abbot & Costello.


People, for some reason, don't give Universal their due credit for everything they did with their monster universe. Sure it wasn't as detailed and intricate as the MCU is, but damned if it wasn't a built universe.
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goji89 wrote:So.......are we gonna Kinkshame the skreeonking birds or what?

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Living Corpse » Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:15 am

Maritonic wrote:
Shin Gabara wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:
TOHO INVENTED THE BIG CROSSOVERS.


Universal did it, what, 30-some-odd years before Toho?

I wanna say that by the time Toho was connecting disparate films, Universal had already gone as far as introducing Abbot & Costello.


People, for some reason, don't give Universal their due credit for everything they did with their monster universe. Sure it wasn't as detailed and intricate as the MCU is, but damned if it wasn't a built universe.


It's part of the reason I'm sad they can't get the Darkverse off the ground.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Maritonic » Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:20 am

Living Corpse wrote:
Maritonic wrote:
Shin Gabara wrote:
Universal did it, what, 30-some-odd years before Toho?

I wanna say that by the time Toho was connecting disparate films, Universal had already gone as far as introducing Abbot & Costello.


People, for some reason, don't give Universal their due credit for everything they did with their monster universe. Sure it wasn't as detailed and intricate as the MCU is, but damned if it wasn't a built universe.


It's part of the reason I'm sad they can't get the Darkverse off the ground.


Yup, agreed. I look back on that Wolf Man remake with Benicio Del Toro and I'm always sad they didn't go that gothic horror route, as opposed to the basic action route they did with Dracula Untold and The Mummy.
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goji89 wrote:So.......are we gonna Kinkshame the skreeonking birds or what?

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Mr_Goji_and_Watch » Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:45 am

Jaqua92 wrote:I love Godzilla also, but the MCU is simply Superior


I don't even consider most Godzilla movies good (especially the Monsterverse so far), but nah this ain't it. There's like one Marvel movie (Black Panther) that is a good film without any qualifiers like "for a Marvel/superhero movie." And even that has a weak, painfully rushed third act. Godzilla 2014 alone has more inspired set pieces and story beats than the entire MCU, and that's a pretty mediocre film as a whole.
Moogabunga wrote:Ive said it before and I'll gladly say it again, this is going to be the best Godzilla film ever and more importantly, its going to be the film that truly makes Godzilla mainstream (and cool)

on 12-31-2017, Mr_Goji_and_Watch wrote:Nobody in the West can do the Oxygen Destroyer justice, especially not for some new Godzilla popcorn flick.

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Shin Gabara » Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:47 am

A little over a year ago the other message board I'm a member of did a casting draft (like fantasy football but with actors in a movie) for a revamped Universal universe. I started mine with a loose remake of American Werewolf with Miles Teller as David and Michael Shannon as his brother Jack. David doesn't die (no silver in those bullets), and in the second film Jack's body is stolen by Dr. Frankenstein (Aiden Turner) and turned into the titular monster. David and Jack's connection leads our werewolf and Van Helsing (I can't remember who I cast) to the Dr.'s lair while an inspector (Iwan Rheon) is on what he believes is David's trail of bodies leading to the inspectors encounter with Jekyle and Hyde (Eddie Redmayne) in the third film, and causing our inspector to become the invisible man. Both J&H and Dr. Frankenstein are found to be working for the undead Count Dracula (Cirian Hinds) in Frankenstein v Dracula (in which our heroic inspector succumbs and dies from the effects of invisibility) . The count's defeat breaks the curse on Imhotep (Rami Malik), who threatens the world in the final film, The Mummy.

It was a bit more fleshed out, but right now I'm on the clock.

Nice progression from wild animal, grave robber, psychotic, vampire, and ending with the threat of an undead world conquerer/enslaver with David as our everyman/ersatz Ironman.
Last edited by Shin Gabara on Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:54 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby BARAGONBREH » Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:08 am

LSD Jellyfish wrote:
I hate every single comparison of the legendary Godzilla series to every single modern super hero movie and big budget extravaganza.


I'm not gonna read the whole book you've written here, but I'm dropping in to say yes, I agree.
Shadowfyre wrote:Everything you say sucks all the time.


gottatalktothefake wrote:I’m kinda disappointed, I just expected to LOVE it. I just thought it was an alright 6/10.

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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby Shin Gabara » Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:21 am

If they wanna do it right, they'll end the MonsterVerse with Key & Peele Destroy All Monsters.
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Re: Rant: MCU/DCU/JW Comparisons

Postby KaijuCanuck » Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:35 am

Awwww look at us all, making MCU and DCU comparisons, having a great time. ;)
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