Talkback: King Kong vs. Godzilla (1962)

[Terasawa]

Dang. How does one tell if one has an accurate copy or these made-up versions?

Watch the video above, if your copy has that amino acid nonsense then you've got a copy with the bad bootleg subtitles.

[KaijuCanuck]

I'm glad I looked in this thread, because I'm halfway through the Japanese version right now. It's definitely the bootlegged sub (still a better movie than the American version though). We really need an official DVD/Blue Ray release in the west.

[Maritonic]

I'm glad I looked in this thread, because I'm halfway through the Japanese version right now. It's definitely the bootlegged sub (still a better movie than the American version though). We really need an official DVD/Blue Ray release in the west.

Yeah sadly I have the bootlegged subs, too, but it's still superior in every way to the American version.

[KaijuCanuck]

I'm glad I looked in this thread, because I'm halfway through the Japanese version right now. It's definitely the bootlegged sub (still a better movie than the American version though). We really need an official DVD/Blue Ray release in the west.

Yeah sadly I have the bootlegged subs, too, but it's still superior in every way to the American version.

I've streamed the japanese version before a long time ago (probably the bootleg), but I've seen the American version much more recently. It's insane how bad it is compared to the Japanese. For one thing, the fact that it's a comedy is completely lost.

[MaxRebo320]

I've streamed the japanese version before a long time ago (probably the bootleg), but I've seen the American version much more recently. It's insane how bad it is compared to the Japanese. For one thing, the fact that it's a comedy is completely lost.

COMPLETELY lost? I'm not quite sure about that. A lot of gags are removed (Particularly involving the leads) and the newly filmed UN scenes are really dry and humorless (at least intentionally), but to say it removes all traces of humor just isn't true. Perhaps enough to not regard it as a comedy (Not that I'd completely regard the original as one either), but hardly enough to say it doesn't have a lot of funny moments.

[KaijuCanuck]

I've streamed the japanese version before a long time ago (probably the bootleg), but I've seen the American version much more recently. It's insane how bad it is compared to the Japanese. For one thing, the fact that it's a comedy is completely lost.

COMPLETELY lost? I'm not quite sure about that. A lot of gags are removed (Particularly involving the leads) and the newly filmed UN scenes are really dry and humorless (at least intentionally), but to say it removes all traces of humor just isn't true. Perhaps enough to not regard it as a comedy (Not that I'd completely regard the original as one either), but hardly enough to say it doesn't have a lot of funny moments.

I guess that’s true. The shorter guy in the expedition is still comically scared, and the boss is hilarious no matter what he’s saying. But they take out enough that it just becomes a sci fi movie, to me anyway. The Japanese version is funny pretty consistently.

[GojiraGuy2016]

Yes, our German release by Anolis in their Kaiju Classics line includes the Japanese version of KING KONG VS. GODZILLA.
Since this is probably the only official release in the west of the Japanese version, I guess you guys practise your German.

Of course I support you when a publisher annouces a DVD+BD release for the United States. You should not being left alone.

[Zarm]

Dang. How does one tell if one has an accurate copy or these made-up versions?

Watch the video above, if your copy has that amino acid nonsense then you've got a copy with the bad bootleg subtitles.

Son of a gun. Finally checked. Amino acids aplenty.

Now the question is... is there a source for good subtitles out there, which an enterprising fellow could apply to a rip of his worthless DVD to produce an accurate version? (Actually, if I'm going to be in fan-editing mode, that reminds me... was there a general consensus that editing on one of the scenes- the submarine emergence, I think it was?- was superior in the U.S. version?)

[LegendZilla]

This movie gets a bad rap IMHO. What most people don’t understand is that (at least the original Japanese version) was intended to be a parody of the Kaiju genre, kind of like how Airplane! (1980) was to the disaster genre.

[UltramanGoji]

This movie gets a bad rap IMHO. What most people don’t understand is that (at least the original Japanese version) was intended to be a parody of the Kaiju genre, kind of like how Airplane! (1980) was to the disaster genre.

How can it be a parody of a genre that, at the time of filming, was less than ten years old? It's a satire of Japanese consumerism and part of the salaryman comedy genre that was popular at the time.

Also, it's "rep" dude. Bad rep. As in, reputation.

[Zarm]

A 'bad rap' (or 'bum rap') is also a phrase, originating from a 'rap sheet' for criminal charges- in this case, implying trumped-up charges or false accusations.

[Godzillian]

How anyone could think this film has a bad rep is beyond me, its frequently discusses as one of the greatest films in the franchise by fans and GA

[eabaker]

A 'bad rap' (or 'bum rap') is also a phrase, originating from a 'rap sheet' for criminal charges- in this case, implying trumped-up charges or false accusations.

I think you're being generous in your use of the word "also." "Bad rap" is a phrase; "bad rep" is a corruption of "bad rap."

On the question of whether or not the movie is a parody of the kaiju genre, I'd hasten to point out that the Godzilla thread is played pretty straight.

[UltramanGoji]

On the question of whether or not the movie is a parody of the kaiju genre, I'd hasten to point out that the Godzilla thread is played pretty straight.

Yes, a parody would imply that it takes elements of the kaiju genre and makes fun of/satirizes them. KKVG does not satirize anything about kaiju films themselves.

I think people like to slap the word "parody" on any genre film that's comedic in tone, even when nothing in the film is parodying that genre. KKVG is a comedy, but it isn't a satirical look on anything except Japanese consumerism.

[edgaguirus]

It's all in how you look at it, I suppose. An American audience would likely not notice the satire or statements being made about Japan's rampant commercialism. They'd see the guy always complaining about his corns and the clown of a boss, and assume the comic label.

[Spuro]

God damnit. My version has the amino acids too...

Looking online for the proper version, but still no luck. Anyone have any idea where to look?

[Zarm]

My version has the amino acids too...

Looking online for the proper version, but still no luck. Anyone have any idea where to look?

I got a hold of the subtitles for SpacehunterM. I can share them if you've got a video file to pair them with. As for a version where they've already been applied... Not yet. Waiting for my DVD to arrive in the mail from Germany.

Bear in mind that the 'proper' subtitles are actually fansubs, an English translation of German subtitles that were apparently accurately translated to German from the original Japanese. But considering that there is at least one joke that is dependent on the Japanese language to work, it seems authentic to me...

[Zarm]

I know the Japanese master of the film had some quality issues. Does the 60th Anniversary Blu-ray have the same issues? Or has it been restored?

[Goji]

The Japanese Blu-Ray from 2014 is the only source you should ever be bothering with, at this point. Some of the scenes from the theatrical version, which have existed in bad quality since the '80s, are from a better source here, so it's definitely a huge improvement over the ancient DVD transfer. The transfer itself is mostly solid (I think it's probably one of their better ones, but don't quote me on that), but parts of it are a little overly red, IIRC. Honestly, Space Hunter M or Tamura would know more of the specifics better than I would, so hopefully they'll chime in.

One thing to note is that this is not the recent 4K restoration, which is the one that reinstated the missing trims from a source that wasn't 16mm, for once. That still hasn't had a home video release, and the ball is totally in Toho's court on that one (same goes for the 4K res. of the original film).

[Maritonic]

I have to ask, as I feel like my knowledge of this subject is a dark, unlit room; why, exactly, are the Showa Era releases such a nightmare on home media? It seems like there are just so damn many of them, even in the Japanese market, and they all seem to be missing *something*. Like, there is no *definitive* version of each film.

This is just how it SEEMS, I could VERY well be wrong about this. Can someone explain this to me?