Terror of Mechagodzilla Toho Master Collection weirdness?

[SG-17]

What is with the stock footage intro and horrible narration (combining the Xiliens with the Black Hole Aliens for one) at the beginning of the US version of Terror of Mechagodzilla on the Classic Media Toho Master Collection DVD and the added narration during the recap credits?

I've never seen nor heard this before. I have it on Simitar Digitally Remastered VHS and that US version feels much superior to the DVD version.

Why did Classic Media choose to put the one with the narration on the DVD?

[Malchik]

What is with the stock footage intro and horrible narration (combining the Xiliens with the Black Hole Aliens for one) at the beginning of the US version of Terror of Mechagodzilla on the Classic Media Toho Master Collection DVD and the added narration during the recap credits?

I've never seen nor heard this before. I have it on Simitar Digitally Remastered VHS and that US version feels much superior to the DVD version.

Why did Classic Media choose to put the one with the narration on the DVD?

It was a newly created bumper that they tacked onto the TV cut of ToMG back in the seventies. It was made to try and give some exposition for Godzilla to casual audiences.

The clip really didn't belong on the US version, because it serves no purpose and they actually butchered it by cropping off the top and bottom to fit the widescreen format. The clip is a rare treasure, but it really should have been an extra.

I guess if you want to get anal, I'd have prefer the US version to be fullscreen.

[kpa]

What is with the stock footage intro and horrible narration (combining the Xiliens with the Black Hole Aliens for one) at the beginning of the US version of Terror of Mechagodzilla on the Classic Media Toho Master Collection DVD and the added narration during the recap credits?

I've never seen nor heard this before. I have it on Simitar Digitally Remastered VHS and that US version feels much superior to the DVD version.

Why did Classic Media choose to put the one with the narration on the DVD?

SG-17, if you listen to the audio commentary on the TOMG DVD we explain all about the different versions of the film.

In 1977-78, the US rights to TOMG were picked up by Henry Saperstein's company UPA. UPA licensed theatrical rights to a small distributor called Bob Conn Enterprises. Bob Conn showed the movie as a kiddie matinee so he heavily edited the film to get a G rating. Several minutes were cut to remove anything little kids or their parents might object to... this included onscreen deaths, blood, mild cursing, monster and people violence, etc. The editing was sloppy so there are noticeable jumps in the soundtrack, scenes showing the fates of several characters are missing, and so on. This version has long been considered a mess and is loathed by many Godzilla fans (myself included).

Not long after the film started playing in theaters, UPA released TOMG on TV. UPA's TV version added the prologue with scenes from previous Godzilla films... this was done for two main reasons 1) UPA wanted more Godzilla at the start of the film to hook viewers, and 2) they needed the running time of the movie to be closer to 90 minutes so it would fit better in a 2hr time slot. The great thing about the UPA TV version was that it was uncut (with the exception of one brief fake nude shot) so all the stuff missing from the Bob Conn version is there. The funny thing is that people could pay to watch an edited in a theater or stay home and see the uncut version on TV for free.

When UPA licensed TOMG to Paramount in the early 1980s for home video, somebody screwed up and used the edited Bob Conn version rather than the uncut TV version. Saperstein was surprised that happened and said it was a mistake, but the same mistake was repeated when UPA later licensed the video rights to Simitar. Toho and UPA received fan complaints that the uncut TV version wasn't used.

Classic Media bought UPA's film library and reissued the Godzilla films (included the edited TOMG) on DVD in 2002. A few years later they renegotiated the rights with Toho to do the Toho Master Collection DVDs, which would include the Japanese and US versions for each movie. Classic Media found materials for the uncut TV version, which left them with two options...

1. Go with same edited US version that fans had been complaining about for years, and which had already been issued three times on VHS, once on laserdisc, and twice on DVD.
2. Go with the uncut US version which hadn't been seen in over 20 years and had never been released on home video.

All of us who worked on the Classic Media DVDs thought Option 2 was the much better choice. It just made more sense to give fans the long-lost uncut version that many of them had never seen rather than use the edited version that is easy to find on video. Fans were stuck with the butchered version for years, so I was glad the full US version I first saw back in 1979 was finally available on DVD.

[SG-17]

It just came in the mail today, I haven't had time to watch it with commentary yet.
I didn't realize that the VHS version was edited so badly. I thought that the main difference was the opening montage/added narration. I take it because of licensing/quality issues they couldn't just take the un-narrated opening from the Bob Conn version and splice it into/over the uncut post narration UPA version.

[Legion1979]

Isn't the "American version" on the DVD just the Japanese version with an English audio overlay?

[Malchik]

Isn't the "American version" on the DVD just the Japanese version with an English audio overlay?

Yup, with American credits mind you. I don't know if those were also cropped.

[RyanClark]

Personally I was extremely pleased with the way Classic Media presented Terror of Mechagodzilla, and the choices for the US version. I'm glad effort was put into providing the US dub alongside the widescreen video, the edited version we've had for years can disappear forever for all I care. I never knew how badly the editing harmed the end of the film until I saw the uncut Japanese version at G-FEST some years ago.

As for the prologue, I like it, despite never having seen it until several years ago. Also I'm not sure, but wasn't the widescreen cropping of it done by MonstersHD for their broadcast? Likewise isn't this what happen to Godzilla vs. The Thing, they cropped it and ultimately that version was the only one available to Classic Media? (With the option of the previous more washed out version Simitar used being available, but the MonstersHD one had better color.)

[kpa]

It just came in the mail today, I haven't had time to watch it with commentary yet.
I didn't realize that the VHS version was edited so badly. I thought that the main difference was the opening montage/added narration.

The older VHS/DVD version runs 5-6 minutes less than the Japanese version. The UPA TV version has everything from the Japanese version (minus the fake breasts shot, which only lasts for seconds) plus the prologue so it's the longest of the three.

I take it because of licensing/quality issues they couldn't just take the un-narrated opening from the Bob Conn version and splice it into/over the uncut post narration UPA version.

Classic Media owns rights to the edited version but chose not to use it because a more complete version was available. There was never any thought given to using the titles from edited version because Toho and Classic Media wanted to show how the films were presented in Japan and the US, and the prologue was created by TOMG's US distributor for the American market. Since this long-lost US prologue was available it would have been a mistake not to include it with the US version on the DVD.

Isn't the "American version" on the DVD just the Japanese version with an English audio overlay?

Mike, this has been discussed many times before. Since TOMG was shot in widescreen, Classic Media felt viewers would not want to watch the entire movie cropped. So the image from the Japanese version was used after the opening titles, except for the fake nude shot. It gave American fans the opportunity to see the film dubbed and in widescreen for the first time on US home video.

Personally I was extremely pleased with the way Classic Media presented Terror of Mechagodzilla, and the choices for the US version. I'm glad effort was put into providing the US dub alongside the widescreen video, the edited version we've had for years can disappear forever for all I care. I never knew how badly the editing harmed the end of the film until I saw the uncut Japanese version at G-FEST some years ago.

I know what you mean. The first time I saw TOMG was on TV in 1979, and it was the UPA TV version. Years later I rented the Paramount VHS and was annoyed that key moments of the film were missing/

As for the prologue, I like it, despite never having seen it until several years ago. Also I'm not sure, but wasn't the widescreen cropping of it done by MonstersHD for their broadcast? Likewise isn't this what happen to Godzilla vs. The Thing, they cropped it and ultimately that version was the only one available to Classic Media? (With the option of the previous more washed out version Simitar used being available, but the MonstersHD one had better color.)

Classic Media used the film elements that were available. Since they were not the original producer/distributor of the US versions, for those versions they had to rely on what materials still existed in the film libraries they had purchased or what Toho could provide.... and Toho often had very limited except fullscreen video masters (and they didn't have the UPA TV version of TOMG). So some of the American versions had to be recreated (like with GHIDORAH) or were a combination of US audio matched to Japanese widescreen video (like with TOMG). The end results were hit and miss, but generally pretty good considering that original US versions generally weren't well preserved.

[RyanClark]

So some of the American versions had to be recreated (like with GHIDORAH)

That said, what was the origin of the Ghidorah opening credits? Did Toho have a widescreen copy of the US version, but the rest was of inferior quality compared to the Japanese one? I'm really glad they went to the trouble to restore the US version of that movie.

[kpa]

So some of the American versions had to be recreated (like with GHIDORAH)

That said, what was the origin of the Ghidorah opening credits? Did Toho have a widescreen copy of the US version, but the rest was of inferior quality compared to the Japanese one? I'm really glad they went to the trouble to restore the US version of that movie.

I'm not sure. Classic Media got GHIDORAH when they bought the Golden Books film library and then they later renewed the rights with Toho. As far as I know, Golden Books just had a fullscreen video of the film; identical to what had been shown on TV and released on VHS in the past. Toho had the fullscreen video master plus one 35mm print, but that print had burned in Spanish subtitles. I had seen that print years before when it was screened at the Egyptian Theatre in Hollywood and recalled (but wasn't positive) that the subs didn't start until after the credits. When we were doing early prep work on the DVDs I contacted the GM of Toho's LA office and asked if they could provide the print to Classic Media. He said he would talk with CM about it, but I don't know if the print was used or some other source for the credits turned up.

[Showa Gyaos]

People hate this intro? It gave me goosebumps, and it was meant to inform people about the events that occurred before ToMG.

[SG-17]

Well the intro was completely baseless. I mean Godzilla stopped being a destructive force after Ghidorah and the Xiliens didn't build Mechagodzilla.

[Tyler]

I thought it was interesting to see.

[Goji]

The prologue is pretty silly, yeah, but I am glad it was included. It's unfortunate the International version/credits have still never been seen on a U.S. release, but I think the guys over at Classic Media (kpa included) made the right decision in choosing to preserve the Henry G. Saperstien version, which most fans who grew up in the VCR era never got a chance to see.

I know that Legion79 once mentioned that he saw a bizarre TV airing of TOMG once that featured the prologue, but ended up being the Bob Cohn version once the actual film began. I wonder when the last time the uncut Saperstienn version was even aired on television? Early 80's maybe?

[Tamura]

So some of the American versions had to be recreated (like with GHIDORAH)

That said, what was the origin of the Ghidorah opening credits? Did Toho have a widescreen copy of the US version, but the rest was of inferior quality compared to the Japanese one? I'm really glad they went to the trouble to restore the US version of that movie.

I'm not sure. Classic Media got GHIDORAH when they bought the Golden Books film library and then they later renewed the rights with Toho. As far as I know, Golden Books just had a fullscreen video of the film; identical to what had been shown on TV and released on VHS in the past. Toho had the fullscreen video master plus one 35mm print, but that print had burned in Spanish subtitles. I had seen that print years before when it was screened at the Egyptian Theatre in Hollywood and recalled (but wasn't positive) that the subs didn't start until after the credits. When we were doing early prep work on the DVDs I contacted the GM of Toho's LA office and asked if they could provide the print to Classic Media. He said he would talk with CM about it, but I don't know if the print was used or some other source for the credits turned up.

Those credits are probably from the video master stretched out to 2.50:1 or what ever aspect ratio the Region 2 transfer was.

[omgitsgodzilla]

My biggest issue was that the opening montage was shown in a) very low quality and b) a presentation that was first cropped on the sides to fit a TV screen and then on the top and bottom for a widescreen aspect ratio, which left us with a horribly cropped presentation. Both of these problems could have been solved by taking scenes from Astro-Monster and All Monsters Attack (both of which were owned by Classic Media and issued in great quality) and splicing them together in the correct fashion to match what was in the original source. Then we'd have had most of the TV intro reconstructed in better quality, a la Ghidorah the Three Headed Monster. Did this never occur to anyone at CM?

[Legion1979]

Maybe they felt that the people who grew up with the opening (like me) would like to see it closer to what they remember on TV and not a reconstructed version using pristine Toho elements.

[kpa]

There would still be an issue with the opening titles, which were unique for UPA TV version.

Also, the schedules and budget for these DVDs were pretty tight, so I'm sure CM was only willing to take things so far.

[Legion1979]

There would still be an issue with the opening titles, which were unique for UPA TV version.

"Titles by Freeze Frame"

You can't make that stuff up!

[hewylewis]

I'm tired of people complaining about the tacked on opening credits!! I enjoyed them, and I liked that it was the uncut version rather than the edited version that we got during the 90's.