Godzilla vs. Kong vs. King of the Monsters

[Gigantis]

Alright, this should be interesting to see play out.

I've seen pretty good arguments of both sides saying which film was better. GVK fans say that the film had more heart and better story than KOTM, and managed to balance it out with monster action better. However, people who prefer KOTM more state that while perhaps lacking in heart, it managed to feel more grandiose than GVK and had the monsters feel more godly than it's sequel did, and it's story was still somewhat better and easier to follow. I personally prefer GVK, but i get why KOTM still has it's fans.

[Jermobooka]

I will praise GvK as the second coming of christ and damn KOTM to hell as many times as i get and this is yet another great opportunity to do so

[gridiron_kaiju]

Is this thread necessary? Can’t we just have one where people can compare all 4 films rather than 2 random ones?

[Gojira1604]

KOTM had more heart and a better story than GVK, and managed to balance it out with monster action better.

[Dynomy-DX]

This feels like a recipe for disaster, idk why.

Well. I like KOTM for the mythology and story. I like GvK for the action and pace. Both have good monster content. I like em equally.

[GodzillaFan1990's]

Should throw the other two films into the poll as well.

[Xx_The_Masquerade_xX]

This honestly can't be decided by me, I enjoy both equally but also have my fair share of problems with both.

GvK had much better pacing and overall action, KOTM has more memorable iconic scenes and a much better score.

Nothing in GvK touches Godzilla's arrival in Boston with the military escort or Dr Serizawa's sacrifice and Godzilla rising back to life. Plus both Mothra's and Rodan's awakenings were both beautiful and awesome!

[Jetty_Jags]

Having dwelt on it, I believe that KOTM's greatest tragedy is one of an identity issue birthed from a creative team not experienced enough to execute its admittedly ambitious goals. While I was a lot harsher on KOTM upon its release writing it's problems off as shallow/haphazard misuse of iconography in pursuit of a fan-fiction self pleasing story, I have bought into the argument that there are justifications for the films choices that happen to get muddled in its overall sloppy execution. Part of this change of opinion stems from interactions on this site, as well as videos like Up From the Depths' KOTM thesis video. Now, I can appreciate a lot of great aspirations of the film, but they still ultimately leave me disappointed (which is arguably an improvement from the outright offense I originally took from the film). Obviously things like the score, and monster world building are brilliant, and I truly hope Dougherty sticks around as a creative consultant. Other things, however, like Emma's role in the greater blockbuster villain ecosystem, the thematic interpretation of faith, and the role of man in society are great in concept, but together cannot form a cohesive whole. Part seems to be general inexperience in handling the more thematic elements of the film, as seen in its heavy expositional dialogue, tell rather than show philosophy, and cliched characters. However, I think another issue comes from juggling the desire to be both a thoughtful entry in the series and a fun globe trotting romp. Often times it sacrifices one for the other, either not giving important moments time to breath as too cut back to the action, or cutting from the action back to the "thematic backbone" of the work, and both suffer for this. Furthermore, as I have discussed elsewhere on the sub, I am not horribly impressed with the monster action on its own. I would best describe the action as the shaky cam equivalent to kaiju fights. I have no idea if Dougherty can properly choreograph a fight, but if he can then the chaotic fight editing completely diminishes any skill he possesses. I would have loved for the impressionist art direction to have worked, but the result is sludgy, dull, and grainy, rather than majestic and inspiring. And this is all without touching on my least favorite part of the film, the oxygen destroyer (which I consider to be an aesthetic dissonance with the original), as well as Dougherty's "interesting" interpretation of the Serizawa sacrifice reversal scene.

Now I am completely ready to admit my unwillingness to asses GvK as a narrative work, rather treating it closer to the visual analogue of an amusement ride. While I am entirely aware of the issues regarding characters, narrative themes, and plot consistency, in short I don't care. I understand this is a horribly biased position to take, yet I completely buy into the films assertation that these aspects don't matter, rather they serve as a means to an end, that end being spectacle. Perhaps the best comparison being Pacific Rim, a movie I greatly appreciate for understanding what it is, and arguably more important what it isn't. It is one of the best examples of a movie not deluded by a faux sense of aspiration, but rather one that revels in its own stupidity (or perhaps more accurately absurdity) in order to fully capitalize on being entertaining. Similarly GvK eschews character moments (outside of its titular Kaiju) and overly convoluted plots (although it comes close to overdoing this as well) in order to properly showcase the monster battles. Everything secondary to the action set pieces is presented to be as inoffensive and out of the way possible while maintaining enough presence to guide through major plot points (i.e. Kaiju fights). Speaking of the kaiju fights, I can't help but find them crisp, clear, and overall spectacular. While Edwards' reserved, grounded, and weighted framing is long gone, if any movie deserves to go balls to the wall with its action sequences, it is this one. And boy do these fights pay off. I find them to be exquisitely visually exciting, well thought out, and quite inventive. If anything the film left me exhausted with its endless monster brawl, but I consider this a complement considering how well crafted they were.

So overall, I clearly enjoy the self aware presentation of GvK that maximizes its strengths and minimizes its weaknesses, over the thoroughly uneven yet more ambitious KOTM. However, I have been conflicted with this conclusion for the past few days. Is this how I should be thinking about films? Should I be as condemning of KOTM for its ambition solely because I find its execution heavily flawed? Should I be as tolerant of GvK's flotsam jetsam approach to characters and narrative? Perhaps it doesn't have to be a binary? Maybe I can hope for more thought-provoking plotlines in future MV films while also hoping they are restrained enough to know what to keep and what to cut? Whatever the answer be, I am excited for what this franchise has to offer next.

[goji89]

Damn, I can't decide because they both sucked on some level. But I'm gonna go with .......

[Troyal1]

GVK hands down.

GVK

*Better cgi
*better fights and much longer fights
* jokes weren’t as awful
*feels well paced

Cons
-human stuff still doesn’t land as well as it could
-it doesn’t really feel as connected to the other films as it could.

I think the only Pro I can give KOTM is did try world building. I thought most of it was not in line with 2014 and skull island but it attempted to show Titans all over the world and set up for stuff going forward. GVK abandoned that almost completely.

[The Zilla in Manila]

On an objective level: GvK.

It has better pacing, the fights are easier to see and its edited better (though I still can make out the fights very well in KOTM). The human story is cut to ribbons but that was necessary to have constant momentum in the film. If this film is 20 minutes longer it's worse off.

On a subjective level: KOTM, which I voted for.

I just love this movie and I blame the conditioning the Heisei era did to me. Why I think it should be given some slack by Godzilla fans is that Dougherty homaged that era so well that it's unmistakable this is a love letter. The music is fantastic, the stakes feel strong, and it has a wacky implausible human story much like many of the Heisei films, particularly Biollante. It's for me a great Godzilla film considering the overall film franchise.

[Jermobooka]

-snip-

Christ, Jags. Got a whole ass essay here that put my exact thoughts in words better than i ever could. Like, “flotsam jetsam”? I haven’t heard that expression used in forever lol

[Jetty_Jags]

Christ, Jags. Got a whole ass essay here that put my exact thoughts in words better than i ever could. Like, “flotsam jetsam”? I haven’t heard that expression used in forever lol

I appreciate it! I wasn't planning on writing a phonebook as a response, but once I started, I couldn't stop.

[Your Boy Leroy]

Makes me wonder. If the fights in GvK were shot/choreographed/edited like how they were in KOTM (in other words, not very good at all), would the film be getting as much praise as it is? I doubt it. Everyone says the human element doesn’t matter in movies like these, and GvK is the epitome of that. The monster scenes are literally the only reason to watch this.

So yeah, I voted KOTM. Lesser of two evils.

[Zasraniec]

Well I love both movies. Both have their flaws but I would say GvK is overall superior. KotM biggest flaw is the human drama. The same for GvK, but GvK handled the human drama better. The fights were also consistent and rarely cut away in addition to being very visible instead of rainy or at night time. Yes the Hong Kong fight was at night but the neon backdrop allowed you to see everything that was going on. While I am a fan of Kong I am not ashamed to admit I am a bigger fan of Godzilla. So KotM actually had more of a focus on Godzilla which is a plus for me. However in the grand scheme of things I feel that GvK just gets much more right than KotM. The human drama isn't really strong but it flows better and makes more sense. Plus I would say the acting overall is better by our main characters. I don't think KotM deserves all the hate because if the team behind KotM could just refine their technique a bit they can definitely release an awesome movie.

[GodzillaXGomoraFight]

This is a question that I have been considering since first watching Godzilla vs. Kong (GvK) last Friday. While I have finally determined that objectively the best MonsterVerse movie is Kong: Skull Island, the prize of favorite MonsterVerse movie remained between KOTM and GvK. Objectively for different reasons I would rank both films around a 6/10 and after some thought, I have decided that my favorite film of the two is KOTM. I think while GvK has the best fights of the MonsterVerse so far, I feel that my major gripe with the movie is that it plays everything fairly safe. GvK has a predictable outcome as to not upset either Godzilla or Kong fans, it has a very generic human plot of little intrigue and of as little offense as possible, and comes off as being a very shallow film. KOTM took risks to build a mythos for the MonsterVerse, generally has more humor in the human plot, and has depth in its themes and fan service. From what I have gauged from the forum over the past two years, reception of the new interpretations of Toho kaiju in KOTM has been very warm, which I think alone gives this movie a lot more intrigue for a Godzilla fan. By no means does this mean that KOTM is overly superior: it has a frustrating arc with Emma Russell and my biggest critique back in 2019 was that the filmmakers seemed afraid to let the audience just see the monsters fight it out (a criticism that GvK addressed fairly well).

Another thing that impacts my opinion were my expectations over each film. When KOTM came out, I tried incredibly hard to have as low of expectations for the film as possible; I was rewarded for doing that by not being all that disappointed by how the film came out. Was it the GOAT Godzilla monster mash movie? Probably not, but it presents a new and big budget take on Showa/Heisei Godzilla films. For GvK, my expectations were naturally higher given my belief that GvK, with all of its delays, could only improve on KOTM. When I first saw GvK, I was disappointed that the movie was not as good as I hoped. I was devastated that Kong continued to be given such favoritism over Godzilla by filmmakers and I literally predicted the outcome of the fight before watching the film (I told my friend that likely Godzilla will literally bring Kong down and take the win. Afterwards, Mechagodzilla would pop up, clown Godzilla, and Kong would possibly get the redeeming final blow on the robot). I felt offended that the film would play so safely when the other MonsterVerse movies took greater risks. Thankfully, my hot takes cooled a bit after a second viewing, but my gripes remain the same. I will give GvK another watch or two before it leaves HBO Max, so maybe my opinion will change.

[CosmicComet]

King of the monsters for me easy.

I'm convinced GvK is better reviewed only because people missed big blockbusters over the past year.

Kotm had way more action and monsters and even more human drama.

It had some shit jokes but that's it

[GodzillaFan1990's]

I thoroughly enjoyed Godzilla vs. Kong more.

The characters were somewhat better but only on Kong's side of the story with Jia, her adoptive mother, and Nathan which I got out of. Everyone else though not so much.

The fights were also better, and I especially liked how the hollow earth look though I was expecting it to look more hellish, dark as in cave-like, and bioluminescence. The jokes were also better aside from the whole bleach thing which I found rather cringey.

Its fast-pace, and monster action makes up for all the films problems IMO.

[Spuro]

I'm unsure, to be honest. Right now, gun to my head, I'd vote for Godzilla vs Kong, but it's also a brand new movie. And it's a movie I have a lot of emotional baggage attached to, both positive and negative, due to outside circumstances. Will I really feel it's better than KotM down the line? Or will my appreciation for GvK diminish? I think only time will tell.

At least both of them are better than Kong: Skull Island. That much I'm certain of.

[Relair]

GvsK was a 'better' and more palatable movie for general audiences, and its success shows that. KotM was a movie made by a fan, for fans, and I adored every minute of it. I loved them both, but KotM gave the monsters so much more weight and treated them with such reverence and awe, it's still my favorite Monsterverse film to date.

Added in 11 minutes 29 seconds:

.
.
.
.
.
So overall, I clearly enjoy the self aware presentation of GvK that maximizes its strengths and minimizes its weaknesses, over the thoroughly uneven yet more ambitious KOTM. However, I have been conflicted with this conclusion for the past few days. Is this how I should be thinking about films? Should I be as condemning of KOTM for its ambition solely because I find its execution heavily flawed? Should I be as tolerant of GvK's flotsam jetsam approach to characters and narrative? Perhaps it doesn't have to be a binary? Maybe I can hope for more thought-provoking plotlines in future MV films while also hoping they are restrained enough to know what to keep and what to cut? Whatever the answer be, I am excited for what this franchise has to offer next.

As much as I appreciated that long thoughtful take on the subject, it does seem a bit unfair to dump on and deconstruct every nitpick of KotM because it isn't Citizen Kane, while GvsK gets a pass for many of the same flaws because 'don't care, expected mindless fun, got mindless fun.' While I would love every Monsterverse entry to be a flawless cinematic masterpiece as well as an awesome monster battle royale, like most things in life you often can't really have your cake and eat it too.