The Future Of The MonsterVerse?

[GodzillaFan1990's]

Plus he already has experience with monkes

Imagine the potential he could do with Kong's character development.

[Jermobooka]

Plus he already has experience with monkes

Imagine the potential he could do with Kong's character development.

Question is...where would Kong go from here? Character (kaiju?) development wise, i mean

On the subject of Kong, i really hope he kept the axe. It’s cool and provides more possibilities for Kong’s fights. I hope it’s a recurring tool he uses throughout the MV

[GodzillaFan1990's]

On the subject of Kong, i really hope he kept the axe. It’s cool and provides more possibilities for Kong’s fights. I hope it’s a recurring tool he uses throughout the MV

Fair point there.

Also I'm fairly certain even if he didn't there's still plenty of them there at that temple.

[Dv-218]

Plus he already has experience with monkes

Imagine the potential he could do with Kong's character development.

Question is...where would Kong go from here? Character (kaiju?) development wise, i mean

On the subject of Kong, i really hope he kept the axe. It’s cool and provides more possibilities for Kong’s fights. I hope it’s a recurring tool he uses throughout the MV

Yeah, would be dumb not to have him keep his axe going forward. It adds a lot to him as a fighter and really showcases the extent of what a capable combatant he is intelligence-wise. Heck, you can even have him upgrade it in some way.

[Moogabunga]

On the topic of this thread: Do you know what the future of the Monsterverse needs, a GREAT or even PHENOMENAL Godzilla movie. A movie that practically everyone can go around saying "I f*ckin love this movie!". Let's be real, the overwhelming majority of people would put every single Godzilla Monsterverse film at a 7/10 at best. Each one has amazing positives, but they each also have significant negatives. I think Godzilla deserves to have a big budget, widely distributed film that has ALL of the ingredients to a great movie - great characters, great story, amazing villain, memorable dialogue, great score, phenomenal effects, great fight choreography/cinematography. I hope he gets it one day.

[DynomikeGojira]

Agreed that's why I think we need new writers

[GodzillaFan1990's]

Agreed that's why I think we need new writers

I'll definitely agree on that, one of the main drawbacks to these films with the exception of the cast from Kong: Skull Island, Serizawa, Jia, her adoptive mother, and Nathan.

[Thatguy4683]

Agreed that's why I think we need new writers

I'll definitely agree on that, one of the main drawbacks to these films with the exception of the cast from Kong: Skull Island, Serizawa, Jia, her adoptive mother, and Nathan.

Me too even though the movie have been great so far, I do love to see a well constructed story

[ernesth100]

I wouldn't say they need a new writer. So much as a consistent director. The same writer has been here for all the MV films and some were better for it due to the director carrying the vision across better.

Let's also not forget films undergo several changes prior to release. So while I'm sure the perfect version of KOTM or KSI exists somewhere in those drafts, we got what we got due to the directors vision being slightly different as per usual.

Here's to hoping we don't get another inexperienced director with no background like they've been doing so far. But if they were to return anyone I'd say Wingard and Jordan have the spark.

[plasmabeam]

I dare anyone to propose a gun-wielding raccoon for the MV. Let’s see what the GA and the fan base think.

I’m sorry, but why should we be beholden to including a bipedal turtle with jet engine (or glowing organ etc) legs with Godzilla-esque heat breath? Seriously? In 2021, we can’t possible think of something cooler than that? *face palm*

You didn't even come up with a good argument. Let me ask again what makes the two I mentioned anymore ridiculous yet popular?

As mentioned if the general audience can accept that or ninjutsu turtles raised by a sensei rat, a flying turtle is no less absurd regardless of the setting. It just has to be done right and well-executed. They can make it work if they put the right mind to it. I definitely can't change your mind dude but the proof is there Gamera fit into the MonsterVerse if he ever gets in.

We need more diversity in the Monsterverse so I say if they can bring Gamera in he's a different character from Godzilla and Kong. I'd love to see James Wan tackle him or another Godzilla film.

I would prefer Guillermo del Toro or Matt Reeves.

Honestly, I’m not trying to construct an argument. It’s an opinion based on my personal taste. I hope I don’t come across as slamming anyone’s love for the turtle, even if I don’t feel it’s a good idea for the MV. Certainly, *a* certain audience has accepted Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, but that doesn’t mean that works in every movie universe.

Also, sometimes universes work in parallel ways but not crossover. Just because something is possible elsewhere doesn’t guarantee it is here. I guess the Stay-Puffed man is a kaiju, as well.

I totally agree with you that Guillermo would be a great director for a MV movie.

Added in 4 minutes 48 seconds:

I would definitely be open to see Reeves direct a film in the MV, especially a Kong one. His writing and directing skills can certinialy elevate the overall quality quite a bit.

Plus he already has experience with monkes

Good point.

Added in 5 minutes 5 seconds:

On the topic of this thread: Do you know what the future of the Monsterverse needs, a GREAT or even PHENOMENAL Godzilla movie. A movie that practically everyone can go around saying "I f*ckin love this movie!". Let's be real, the overwhelming majority of people would put every single Godzilla Monsterverse film at a 7/10 at best. Each one has amazing positives, but they each also have significant negatives. I think Godzilla deserves to have a big budget, widely distributed film that has ALL of the ingredients to a great movie - great characters, great story, amazing villain, memorable dialogue, great score, phenomenal effects, great fight choreography/cinematography. I hope he gets it one day.

100%.

Godzilla now needs audiences to love him as opposed to the general view that he just stomps cities. I think he needs a heroic role that really makes the stakes clear — that Godzilla directly saves the planet. It’s normally less of a direct theme. He has to kill monsters that, oh, would be bad for us if they weren’t defeated. There just has to be a rapturous victory moments for humans thanks to Godzilla, not just relegated to Godzilla.

[_JNavs_]

General Audience as soon as they see a giant Atlantean fire-breathing nuclear snapping turtle

" "

[Moth]

They WOULD have had it obvious that Godzilla saved the planet if they didn't say that awful "good thing he's on our side... for now )))" line at the end of KOTM.

[ernesth100]

What would you say to Michael Bay directing an MV film? I feel like I need to see what he would do action wise.

[Breakdown]

What would you say to Michael Bay directing an MV film? I feel like I need to see what he would do action wise.

Dear god no. The movie would be full of racist sterotypes, cringe-inducing toilet humor, senseless plot, retconning of previous events to fit the new garbage story, unbearable and obnoxious characters, cluttered fights where you can't see what's going on, and probably god-awful and pointless redesigns. Keep Bay as far away from the MV as possible if you want any hope of it surviving.

[_JNavs_]

What would you say to Michael Bay directing an MV film? I feel like I need to see what he would do action wise.

Nah, he doesn't care about the source material in any of his films unless it's his own.

And that's coming from someone who enjoyed TF1-3.

[Hokmuto]

I dare anyone to propose a gun-wielding raccoon for the MV. Let’s see what the GA and the fan base think.

They'll think it's bonkers and will enjoy it. After all, that is basically how the GA summed up GvK which has so many plot holes, the beyond absurd Hollow Earth concept, anti gravity vehicles, a massive biodome surrounding a giant monkey that learned sign language secretly despite being in insane supervision, Godzilla blasting a hole through the hollow earth, stupid psionic links, Mechagodzilla, a mech made using Ghidorah's skull which is a beyond irrational move, telepathic explanations, a hyperloop that was secretly built from Pensacola to HK etc. A giant bipedal turtle flying is the least of our worries. Plus I love Gamera and the Gamera trilogy definitely shows that imo

That’s funny, because I find a lot of those things you list as absurd to be extremely cool. Hollow Earth (not really even an MV concept), really cool and a goldmine for the future. MG, really cool. Most of the tech, really cool, albeit often obviously impossible. Absurd plot points aren’t as fatal as absurd characters.

The plot holes are not really comparable as they are writing deficiencies as opposed to thematic absurdities. I’d hope no movie is riddled with plot holes. On top of being silly absurd, Gamera could also be full of plot holes.

When I speak of absurdities, I’m really talking about the characters themselves. The heart of the movies. It’s already difficult enough to get the GA into Godzilla most of the time. I can’t see them getting into bipedal jet turtle with Godzilla breath. But hey, I could be wrong. It could be so bonkers that it embraces insanely campy territory and I’d a huge hit.

Also, I would love if someone could change my mind on this.

That's fair. But for me the absurd isn't necessarily characters but rather the concepts that propel the movie's plot. Like how certain mechanics work, or how the characters end up in a certain scenario, or concepts etc. I would be like "how is that ____ happens when they could've just ___". That's what I define as absurd. Or "how come ____ happened earlier but now ____". Or "how does it make any sense that the reason ____ occurred is because ___". And your idea of absurdity is just as valid. But as someone pointed out, Groot and Rocket are pretty insane concepts for what were more grounded beginnings (Iron Man 1). Plus we're talking about giant monsters here. I would say the GA about to watching giant monster movie automatically knows to shut your brain off, enjoy the ride and that any insane thing goes. That's honestly what helps it from say Fast and Furious where it's literally people racing in cars but now they add insane concepts like genetically engineered super soldiers and missile launches and submarine chases etc.

The Hollow Earth concept is indeed not from the Monsterverse but for me it's such an archaic, insanely dumb concept, but since it's a giant monster movie, I let it pass and I think most of the GA thinks that way

[Zasraniec]

Was GvK absurd? Of course. That is why is was awesome! Sure the plot holes might have been even larger than KoTM but it was a fun movie and in the end that is what counts!

[plasmabeam]

They'll think it's bonkers and will enjoy it. After all, that is basically how the GA summed up GvK which has so many plot holes, the beyond absurd Hollow Earth concept, anti gravity vehicles, a massive biodome surrounding a giant monkey that learned sign language secretly despite being in insane supervision, Godzilla blasting a hole through the hollow earth, stupid psionic links, Mechagodzilla, a mech made using Ghidorah's skull which is a beyond irrational move, telepathic explanations, a hyperloop that was secretly built from Pensacola to HK etc. A giant bipedal turtle flying is the least of our worries. Plus I love Gamera and the Gamera trilogy definitely shows that imo

That’s funny, because I find a lot of those things you list as absurd to be extremely cool. Hollow Earth (not really even an MV concept), really cool and a goldmine for the future. MG, really cool. Most of the tech, really cool, albeit often obviously impossible. Absurd plot points aren’t as fatal as absurd characters.

The plot holes are not really comparable as they are writing deficiencies as opposed to thematic absurdities. I’d hope no movie is riddled with plot holes. On top of being silly absurd, Gamera could also be full of plot holes.

When I speak of absurdities, I’m really talking about the characters themselves. The heart of the movies. It’s already difficult enough to get the GA into Godzilla most of the time. I can’t see them getting into bipedal jet turtle with Godzilla breath. But hey, I could be wrong. It could be so bonkers that it embraces insanely campy territory and I’d a huge hit.

Also, I would love if someone could change my mind on this.

That's fair. But for me the absurd isn't necessarily characters but rather the concepts that propel the movie's plot. Like how certain mechanics work, or how the characters end up in a certain scenario, or concepts etc. I would be like "how is that ____ happens when they could've just ___". That's what I define as absurd. Or "how come ____ happened earlier but now ____". Or "how does it make any sense that the reason ____ occurred is because ___". And your idea of absurdity is just as valid. But as someone pointed out, Groot and Rocket are pretty insane concepts for what were more grounded beginnings (Iron Man 1). Plus we're talking about giant monsters here. I would say the GA about to watching giant monster movie automatically knows to shut your brain off, enjoy the ride and that any insane thing goes. That's honestly what helps it from say Fast and Furious where it's literally people racing in cars but now they add insane concepts like genetically engineered super soldiers and missile launches and submarine chases etc.

The Hollow Earth concept is indeed not from the Monsterverse but for me it's such an archaic, insanely dumb concept, but since it's a giant monster movie, I let it pass and I think most of the GA thinks that way

Mr. Garbage Monster courteously took the time to send me some Gamera clips from the better Heisei era and I indeed enjoyed them. Particularly the spinning/Tojo blade weapon in flight that he turns his body into. It's bonkers but fun. A lot better than the clips I was seeing recently. Now I remember why I liked Gamera as a kid.

I'd definitely be interested in seeing new standalone Gamera movies. My concerns would be this:
- Gamera's jet propulsion would need to be made organic.
- Gamera couldn't share the same breath weapon as Godzilla. It would be strange to have the same weapon or a stronger version than Godzilla, because that's one of the things that makes Godzilla unique. In fact, it *is* the #1 trait Godzilla is known for.
- Gamera being an Earth protector also kind of steps on Godzilla's toes. That's what we are trying hard to establish Godzilla as. The two would clash? Or become allies? It would be odd if two Earth protectors were to become enemies.

One thing I do love is the turtle aspect as I love turtles. And a very special symbolic element is the fact that the Indigenous populations of North America believed that the continent was basically a giant turtle. North America is called Turtle Island by a vast majority of Indigenous in Canada and the US, so Gamera being an eco-hero works. I don't know if he fits in the MV due to this stuff but I do find it interesting for future Gamera movies. After the success of the MV, I'm sure whoever owns Gamera is in full-on excitement mode to bring that back as well, regardless.

Anyway, thanks for helping me re-calibrate on this character.

And btw, you know how much I cringe at the idea of Hollow Earth being in the core, so I get your stance. While I absolutely love the concept and think it will secure a great future for our MV universe, I still think they should revise it and make it massive, cavernous pockets just under the crust. It will make things a lot easier and more believable moving forward.

[Thegarbagemonster]

I just thought of how to fit Gamera in alongside Godzilla in a crossover film. Gamera was engineered by ancient civilizations, just make it so that an ancient rival to Godzilla's Atlantis fan club tried to do what Apex did with Mechagodzilla by making Gyaos, Gamera etc. And Godzilla is p'ed off at Gamera because of the fact he was created by man, not understanding that Gamera isn't inherently evil like MG or Gyaos. (Well, Gyaos aren't evil, they're driven by insane hunger, but still, you get what I mean......)

[GojiSquid]

For what it's worth, I think that the biggest thing that held these first MV films back (with the exception of 2014, which had it's own problems) was time. Specifically, running against the time they had in the movie. K:SI, G:KOTM, and GvK all introduced new huge casts each movie on top of the titular monsters, which means that each film had to dedicate large amounts of time to introducing and providing distinguishing character traits and dynamics for each character, while also balancing time with the monsters (who even when interacting with human characters, take up all the narrative attention, meaning that human characters often need separate scenes), character arcs, and advancing the plot. When one factors in pacing and runtime (often around 2 hours, as people get kinda bored the longer the movie is), all of this becomes a nightmare. (personally, I think GvK handled this best in that it spent enough time with the human characters to keep them entertaining, while also trimming the movie into a very enjoyable pace as compared to K:SI and KOTM. Also, the dialogue was probably the best of these films imo, which helped a lot.)

GvK sets up a way around this problem at the end for future films, by establishing a 3-person Team Kong and a 4-person team Godzilla. If the next Kong film limits it's main cast to Team Kong, and the next Godzilla film limits it's main cast to Team Godzilla, then these films don't have to spend much time introducing these characters or new characters*, using the time that would otherwise require for deeper character arcs and dynamics with eachother and the titular titans.

*obviously this isn't an absolute rule, as one can reasonably introduce 1 or 2 new main cast members and some supporting cast without wrecking a movie, but I'd rather not deal with introducing 7-10 new characters.