Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

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Which of the monsters do you think will win in Godzilla vs Kong?

Godzilla
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70%
Kong
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby scottzilla » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:05 am

I think Kong will win this one. In real life, he wouldn't, but they'll forge this movie to make him win. He's the underdog and Hollywood is all about that. I think he'll lose the first battle but win the second by catching Godzilla by surprise and using weapons and his intelligence in general to pull out a victory.

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Thunderbird » Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:02 am

scottzilla wrote:I think Kong will win this one. In real life, he wouldn't, but they'll forge this movie to make him win. He's the underdog and Hollywood is all about that. I think he'll lose the first battle but win the second by catching Godzilla by surprise and using weapons and his intelligence in general to pull out a victory.


Maybe if GvK was Just Another Kong Movie, you'd be right. But this movie is specifically Godzilla's vehicle, and a Godzilla win over Kong would be something audiences have never seen before. It's the only card left to play that would make this movie stand out from the rest.

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Maritonic » Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:03 am

Man, I really hope Kong wins purely out of spite.
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Shin Gabara » Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:06 am

Neither will 'win', but Kong will survive.
. . .

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Maritonic » Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:11 am

Shin Gabara wrote:Neither will 'win', but Kong will survive.


....alright, so enlighten me on this line of thinking. Because it comes up here and there and it never makes sense to me.

Freddy vs. Jason: Freddy's still alive at the end, but Jason very clearly won the fight of the film.
Alien vs. Predator: the singular Predator clearly wiped out the Alien Queen and her hive, even if he died at the end. He still won.
Batman vs. Superman: Yeah, ended in a bullshit teamup yadda yadda but Batman had a weapon that VERY easily would have killed Superman, to his throat, and called off. He won their fight.

The only vs. movie I would argue is legitimately murky is Frankenstein Meets the Wolf-Man because they both are going at each other's throat before the castle explodes without a trace of either of them.

Kong surviving has literally nothing to do with winning or losing. I'm going to sig this: Death and Defeat do not go hand in hand. You can be defeated and not die. You can die, and be victorious! Godzilla was the victor of Godzilla vs. Destoryah was he not? Dude still died.

Kong can absolutely survive this film and still be the victor of the fight between the two, team up or not.
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby jayson » Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:14 pm

Gotta go with Godzila based on size, weight, strength, offensive capability, defensive capability and durability.

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Shin Gabara » Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:54 pm

Maritonic wrote:
Shin Gabara wrote:Neither will 'win', but Kong will survive.


....alright, so enlighten me on this line of thinking. Because it comes up here and there and it never makes sense to me.


Time will surely prove me wrong, but I've been expecting there to be a variation on a riff on GvDestoroyah, with Junior's part being heavily modulated for Kong's character.

I haven't a clue how the make the key change from the two as brawling adversaries to loosly mapping the ending beats of GvD, but I think that's what'll happen.
. . .

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Thunderbird » Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:59 pm

Maritonic wrote:Man, I really hope Kong wins purely out of spite.


Well, good thing Toho didn't give you a license to Godzilla's character.

G'54 and Raids Again were huge at the Japanese box-office on Godzilla's name alone. Toho's big mistake was letting their IP get defeated by an American character. As soon as Godzilla lost to Kong, G's box office clout took a hit it never recovered from. GvsMothra '64 made half of what KKvG did and the returns diminished as the 60's went on.

Toho's second big mistake was letting Eiji Tsuburaya use Godzilla's likeness in his Ultraman show. It was the equivalent of lending Spiderman's likeness to Todd MacFarlane for the sole purpose of getting killed off by Spawn. Kaiju films took a nosedive when the Ultra series became popular, and the Showa series sputtered out accordingly. Toho didn't protect their icon, so it lost value.

Toho's third big mistake was letting Centropolis neuter Godzilla into a fragile coward that was easily killed off by the military. The only reason the Millennium series even exists was due to Toho's attempts at damage control to restore the character's value.

Now that Godzilla has been given the makeover of a lifetime with a critically and commercially successful CGI reboot TWICE over (with Legendary G and Shin G) I seriously doubt that Toho is willing to sacrifice the Godzilla brand all over again. I doubt that they want their new G series to suffer the same mediocre box office of the Mire series or the outright failure of the 70's Showa era.

If a Godzilla win over Kong ends the Monsterverse, Toho will enjoy a major international spotlight on whatever happens next with Godzilla.

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:07 am

Thunderbird wrote:
Maritonic wrote:Man, I really hope Kong wins purely out of spite.


Well, good thing Toho didn't give you a license to Godzilla's character.

G'54 and Raids Again were huge at the Japanese box-office on Godzilla's name alone. Toho's big mistake was letting their IP get defeated by an American character. As soon as Godzilla lost to Kong, G's box office clout took a hit it never recovered from. GvsMothra '64 made half of what KKvG did and the returns diminished as the 60's went on.

Toho's second big mistake was letting Eiji Tsuburaya use Godzilla's likeness in his Ultraman show. It was the equivalent of lending Spiderman's likeness to Todd MacFarlane for the sole purpose of getting killed off by Spawn. Kaiju films took a nosedive when the Ultra series became popular, and the Showa series sputtered out accordingly. Toho didn't protect their icon, so it lost value.

Toho's third big mistake was letting Centropolis neuter Godzilla into a fragile coward that was easily killed off by the military. The only reason the Millennium series even exists was due to Toho's attempts at damage control to restore the character's value.

Now that Godzilla has been given the makeover of a lifetime with a critically and commercially successful CGI reboot TWICE over (with Legendary G and Shin G) I seriously doubt that Toho is willing to sacrifice the Godzilla brand all over again. I doubt that they want their new G series to suffer the same mediocre box office of the Mire series or the outright failure of the 70's Showa era.

If a Godzilla win over Kong ends the Monsterverse, Toho will enjoy a major international spotlight on whatever happens next with Godzilla.


Excuse me...but what? Who are you to dictate each and everyone of Toho’s Mistakes? And how can you show a correlation that somehow Godzilla losing to an “American monster”=future films having less profit? Are you forgetting there’s dozens of successful Godzilla films that have Godzilla losing. Have you ever thought that KKVG was successful because it was in color and featured an iconic monster? Of course the following film couldn’t live up to that.

The Ultraman boost in popularity has nothing to do with the Godzilla suit being used, it had to do with color televisions being more accessible in Japan at the time. It’s insidous to also somehow come to the conclusion that the Godzilla and Ultraman series are competitors, when thematically and characteristically they’re completely different.
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Maritonic » Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:39 am

Oh MAN that was so worth it
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Dr. Professor » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:10 am

Thunderbird wrote:G'54 and Raids Again were huge at the Japanese box-office on Godzilla's name alone. Toho's big mistake was letting their IP get defeated by an American character. As soon as Godzilla lost to Kong, G's box office clout took a hit it never recovered from. GvsMothra '64 made half of what KKvG did and the returns diminished as the 60's went on.

Toho's second big mistake was letting Eiji Tsuburaya use Godzilla's likeness in his Ultraman show. It was the equivalent of lending Spiderman's likeness to Todd MacFarlane for the sole purpose of getting killed off by Spawn. Kaiju films took a nosedive when the Ultra series became popular, and the Showa series sputtered out accordingly. Toho didn't protect their icon, so it lost value.

Toho's third big mistake was letting Centropolis neuter Godzilla into a fragile coward that was easily killed off by the military. The only reason the Millennium series even exists was due to Toho's attempts at damage control to restore the character's value.

Now that Godzilla has been given the makeover of a lifetime with a critically and commercially successful CGI reboot TWICE over (with Legendary G and Shin G) I seriously doubt that Toho is willing to sacrifice the Godzilla brand all over again. I doubt that they want their new G series to suffer the same mediocre box office of the Mire series or the outright failure of the 70's Showa era.

If a Godzilla win over Kong ends the Monsterverse, Toho will enjoy a major international spotlight on whatever happens next with Godzilla.

My dude, I want you to know three things.
1. Yes, GRA was a financial success, but it was a critical failure and put the series on hiatus for seven years until what film came out? King Kong vs. Godzilla, which was the film that allowed there to be a new Godzilla movie almost every year for thirteen years.
2. King Kong was more popular than Godzilla at the time, even in Japan. Of course he'd win, and like LSD Jellyfish said, his presence was part of what made that film a monumental success.
3. The entirety of the Japanese film industry began to suffer by the late 60s, not just Godzilla. TV got so huge over there that movies didn't stand a chance. By 1973, Godzilla was the last kaiju film franchise standing. Godzilla suits being used in Ultraman had nothing to do with the downfall of the franchise.
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:36 am

Actually if it wasn’t for KKVG there’s a good chance Godzilla would’ve remained the classic film and it’s bad sequel.

And wouldn’t you consider 98 forcing the millennium series a good thing? Sure, some films like GFW were devicise, but a lot of films like G2000, GMK and GXM are beloved by fans.
Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby UltramanGoji » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:48 am

I always forget that people post honest-to-god posts like that on this forum.

I can’t tell if I should be worried or amused.
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Thunderbird » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:58 am

UltramanGoji wrote:I always forget that people post honest-to-god posts like that on this forum.

I can’t tell if I should be worried or amused.


Whatever works.

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby TyrantGojira » Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:48 am

I gotta say that Kong will win. In these kind of movies it’s usually the underdog who wins like in Batman vs. Superman and Civil War.
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Thunderbird » Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:18 am

TyrantGojira wrote:I gotta say that Kong will win. In these kind of movies it’s usually the underdog who wins like in Batman vs. Superman and Civil War.


Since Kong already defeated Godzilla in 1962, it's what audiences are geared to expect in 2020, which makes Godzilla the de facto underdog.

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Maritonic » Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:19 am

Thunderbird wrote:
TyrantGojira wrote:I gotta say that Kong will win. In these kind of movies it’s usually the underdog who wins like in Batman vs. Superman and Civil War.


Since Kong already defeated Godzilla in 1962, it's what audiences are geared to expect in 2020, which makes Godzilla the de facto underdog.


You realize the average movie goer probably isn't even aware that the '62 film exists, right?
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby UltramanGoji » Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:56 am

Thunderbird wrote:
TyrantGojira wrote:I gotta say that Kong will win. In these kind of movies it’s usually the underdog who wins like in Batman vs. Superman and Civil War.


Since Kong already defeated Godzilla in 1962, it's what audiences are geared to expect in 2020, which makes Godzilla the de facto underdog.


Bold of you to assume the general audience has seen a 60-year old movie.
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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Thunderbird » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:37 am

Maritronic and Ultramangoji, how did Kong become a household name if general audiences are unaware of his films?

Millennials and Z Gen audiences access footage of Kong and Godzilla's battles on Youtube rather easily.

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Re: Which of the monsters do you think will win in 2020? Godzilla or Kong?

Postby Maritonic » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:40 am

Thunderbird wrote:Maritronic and Ultramangoji, how did Kong become a household name if general audiences are unaware of his films?

Millennials and Z Gen audiences access footage of Kong and Godzilla's battles on Youtube rather easily.


Because he's a pop culture icon. Primarily due to his first film, sequels and remakes. Then appearances and spoofs in syndicated television. Everyone knows who Kong is.

But if you were to go to the average movie theater on a busy weekend and ask every single person you met, I genuinely believe most people would not know Godzilla and Kong fought before. Would they necessarily be surprised? Probably not. Hell, there are still plenty of people that I encounter that don't even know this movie is happening. Let alone a Japanese monster movie from the 60's.

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Keep in mind, Ultra and I are referring to the average movie goer. We're not talking about "fans", nerds, comic geeks, fandom inclined people. (I use all those terms with love, of course).
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