Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

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Do you consider Awakening Canon or not

Yes
29
30%
No
36
38%
Part of it
21
22%
It is part of canon, but I would prefer if it was not
5
5%
No, but I like it anyway
5
5%
 
Total votes: 96

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Godzillian » Sat Nov 03, 2018 6:59 pm

It doesnt really matter if its canon. The comics will never have any real impact on the movies or even be referenced in them. The screenwriters dont even have to read them or know about them when they write. They're just cash in fluff, which is fine.
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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby BlacktimusPrime » Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:59 pm

Back when the poll was open, I said "no". Now I'm of the mindset, "it is part of canon, but I would prefer if it was not".

There. Case (probably) closed for me.
Coobzilla03 wrote:
goji89 wrote:Godzilla in general sucks. Just awful. I mean a man in a suit knocking down papercraft buildings?

Turn me into a twix and give me a break.

Mutated animals that are huge that fight each other.


Here goji, have a Snickers. You're not you when you're hungry.

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Cookson » Thu May 16, 2019 1:31 pm

Ivo-goji wrote:
PitchBlackProgress wrote:For starters, in Awakening, the Shinomura was the one who made contact with the nuke before it went off, while in the film, Godzilla was the one who triggered its detonation.

Nothing in the film implies Shinomura wasn't there.
Also, the lack of any Shinomura knowledge

That's your problem right there: in Awakening, Monarch never believed Serizawa when he said Godzilla was chasing Shinomura. Monarch's official version of events is that Godzilla emerged after the Nautilus expedition, killed Shinomura on Moansta in what appeared to be a one off encounter, then headed for Bikini on his own.
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Which is a plot point of G14- Godzilla goes after other kaiju, and does not attack human vessels himself, but no one in Monarch except the two Serizawas believe this.
Godzillian wrote:-the film depicts and mentions Godzilla destroying ships in the opening credits. Godzilla does none of that in the comic.

Not quite.
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Serizawa the elder chased similar sightings of Godzilla for years, collecting evidence to prove his case; this is the stuff we see in the opening montage.
-The film shows Godzilla being nuked coming out of the sea. The comic shows him being nuked while battling the other kaiju

The opening sequence shows Godzilla rising out of the sea, then a detonation; the comic has a panel of Godzilla above water, followed by a panel of the explosion.
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There's no battling nor is there a real difference in how the explosion was timed.
-whenever Godzillas past history is brought up no one mentions him battling the kaiju

Serizawa the younger clearly believes Godzilla fights other kaiju; the comic explains why. The movie doesn't exposit on this because the viewer is expected to buy the comic and find out there.
-Serizawas age

And as we know, Serizawa was older in the original script of the film prior to Watanabe's casting. The real world intruding on the movie isn't a big deal.
-The comic shows only the one nuke being used on Godzilla while the film says multiple were used in Godzilla

The comic just has Serizawa tell his son "they thought they killed him"; he didn't actually say the attempts stopped at Castel Bravo.

All these "inconsistencies" stem from misremembering the comic or Law of Conservation of Detail.


Your post needs to be liked a million times. I read Awakening again today before I read the new one, Aftershock.

There’s actually nothing in Awakening that contradicts anything. I feel people are trying to hard to look through it when there’s nothing actually there to contradict it.

Added in 7 minutes 37 seconds:
You guys do know that OUR Serizawa never actually saw the Shinomura right? His dad just told him the events that actually occurred before he died. What the official report is what’s said in the movie itself. SERIZAWA knows the truth but they have no OFFICIAL reports on the Shinomura..
"We knew the world would not be the same. Few people laughed, few people cried, most people were silent."~Robert Oppenheimer

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Dv-218 » Thu May 16, 2019 2:04 pm

Tbh now that I think about it and after I read "Aftershock" too, Awakening is not that bad consistency wise. Granted, the comic itself is pretty meh imo, and the artstyle could have been helluva lot better- but in general, there are no glaring things here that contradict the established canon. In fact, it now has even stronger support thanks to the info in Serizawa's profile in the "Monarch Sciences" site.

But I will never accept the Permian sailboats, skreeonk those :lol:

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby gottatalktothefake » Thu May 16, 2019 2:47 pm

Lol @ the poll result
Smuggers wrote:How could Dougherty do this to us bros... he's defiling our beloved monsters right before our eyes, charging $15 a pop and getting millions in the process... I thought he was a trufan? I guess this was all some sick joke orchestrated by Thomas Tull for almost a decade...

Oh well. Guess I won't see the movie for myself and form my own opinion, I've basically already seen it in my mind from what I've read online and I know a lame duck when I see one. Time to whip out the 'ol 12 gauge

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Desghidorah » Thu May 16, 2019 7:11 pm

I consider it "loose canon" in the sense that something like the events of the story had been and there was a Shinomura monster at some point (after all why waste a good kaiju?), but some of the events and characters might've been different. The comic might have been written with the intent of being fully canon, but perhaps they were working off an earlier script and that's why somethings deferred. One way or another though it's not bad.
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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby G2000 » Thu May 16, 2019 7:17 pm

Dv-218 wrote:But I will never accept the Permian sailboats, skreeonk those :lol:


Dimetredons had sails, who’s to say they didn’t take a pleasure cruise now and again

SAAAAAAAAAAAAILING
TAKES ME AWAAAAAAY
TO WHERE I’VE ALWAYS HEARD IT COULD BE
JUST A DREAM AND THE WIND TO CARRY ME
AND SOON I WILL BE FREE
gerdzerl wrote:DONT STOP G2000 YOU SEXY BEAST

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Olzh26 » Thu May 16, 2019 7:25 pm

on the bluray edition of Godzilla 2014, it is said that it was not Godzilla who was first discovered, but some kind of muta that attacked ships in the 40s. This is definitely a shinamuro since he also attacked ships in the 40s

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Dv-218 » Thu May 16, 2019 9:13 pm

G2000 wrote:
Dv-218 wrote:But I will never accept the Permian sailboats, skreeonk those :lol:


Dimetredons had sails, who’s to say they didn’t take a pleasure cruise now and again

SAAAAAAAAAAAAILING
TAKES ME AWAAAAAAY
TO WHERE I’VE ALWAYS HEARD IT COULD BE
JUST A DREAM AND THE WIND TO CARRY ME
AND SOON I WILL BE FREE


"And if we look around the area, we could see a peculiar, once in a year activity- the local Dimetrodon population gathers around for the annual sailing competition cup. Each participant gives off his best sailing manuevours, which are preformed through a combined use of primitive tool-making and the specie's natural back sail mechanism- all in hope of winning the golden cup, which comes with a year long Edaphosaurus supply. They are so soaked into the adrenaline inducing fun of the activity, they completely ignore the giant skreeonking reptile that shoots blue lasers fighting a black flying swarm-worm, and the asteroid that comes right towards them. Truly, fascinating creatures."
Last edited by Dv-218 on Thu May 16, 2019 9:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Olzh26 » Sun May 19, 2019 11:03 pm

Did Godzilla destroy ships on the "Happy Dragon" expedition, or was it shinamuro?

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Gawdziller1954 » Sun May 19, 2019 11:47 pm

Olzh26 wrote:on the bluray edition of Godzilla 2014, it is said that it was not Godzilla who was first discovered, but some kind of muta that attacked ships in the 40s. This is definitely a shinamuro since he also attacked ships in the 40s

The Blu-Ray featurette "Operation Lucky Dragon" states that Godzilla was the creature attacking ships: "After confirming the Russians were not behind these attacks, we began tracking the entity responsible: a previously unknown species photographed here." The photographs clearly show Godzilla. The creature in the photograph has a long, reptilian tail and massive dorsal plates exactly like those of G2014.

Added in 7 minutes 8 seconds:
Olzh26 wrote:Did Godzilla destroy ships on the "Happy Dragon" expedition, or was it shinamuro?

"Lucky Dragon" was the codename of the effort to kill Godzilla with a nuclear bomb. Godzilla was the one attacking the ships.
OH NO, IT'S GAWDZILLER!! :D

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Olzh26 » Mon May 20, 2019 12:21 am

Gawdziller1954 wrote:
Olzh26 wrote:on the bluray edition of Godzilla 2014, it is said that it was not Godzilla who was first discovered, but some kind of muta that attacked ships in the 40s. This is definitely a shinamuro since he also attacked ships in the 40s

The Blu-Ray featurette "Operation Lucky Dragon" states that Godzilla was the creature attacking ships: "After confirming the Russians were not behind these attacks, we began tracking the entity responsible: a previously unknown species photographed here." The photographs clearly show Godzilla. The creature in the photograph has a long, reptilian tail and massive dorsal plates exactly like those of G2014.

Added in 7 minutes 8 seconds:
Olzh26 wrote:Did Godzilla destroy ships on the "Happy Dragon" expedition, or was it shinamuro?

"Lucky Dragon" was the codename of the effort to kill Godzilla with a nuclear bomb. Godzilla was the one attacking the ships.

Awakening" contradicts this?

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Dv-218 » Mon May 20, 2019 12:31 am

Olzh26 wrote:
Gawdziller1954 wrote:
Olzh26 wrote:on the bluray edition of Godzilla 2014, it is said that it was not Godzilla who was first discovered, but some kind of muta that attacked ships in the 40s. This is definitely a shinamuro since he also attacked ships in the 40s

The Blu-Ray featurette "Operation Lucky Dragon" states that Godzilla was the creature attacking ships: "After confirming the Russians were not behind these attacks, we began tracking the entity responsible: a previously unknown species photographed here." The photographs clearly show Godzilla. The creature in the photograph has a long, reptilian tail and massive dorsal plates exactly like those of G2014.

Added in 7 minutes 8 seconds:
Olzh26 wrote:Did Godzilla destroy ships on the "Happy Dragon" expedition, or was it shinamuro?

"Lucky Dragon" was the codename of the effort to kill Godzilla with a nuclear bomb. Godzilla was the one attacking the ships.

Awakening" contradicts this?


No, it doesn't. It simply says the Shinomura was responsible for ship attacks too- both were. Godzilla's attack specifically was the main cause that launched operation "Lucky Dragon".

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Vandarker » Mon May 20, 2019 12:50 am

The mention of Shimonura and the events of Awakening in the KOTM novelization ends this debate I guess.

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Olzh26 » Mon May 20, 2019 1:34 am

Dv-218 wrote:
Olzh26 wrote:
Gawdziller1954 wrote:The Blu-Ray featurette "Operation Lucky Dragon" states that Godzilla was the creature attacking ships: "After confirming the Russians were not behind these attacks, we began tracking the entity responsible: a previously unknown species photographed here." The photographs clearly show Godzilla. The creature in the photograph has a long, reptilian tail and massive dorsal plates exactly like those of G2014.

Added in 7 minutes 8 seconds:

"Lucky Dragon" was the codename of the effort to kill Godzilla with a nuclear bomb. Godzilla was the one attacking the ships.

Awakening" contradicts this?


No, it doesn't. It simply says the Shinomura was responsible for ship attacks too- both were. Godzilla's attack specifically was the main cause that launched operation "Lucky Dragon".

let's see: at the beginning, shinamuro woke up in 1945 and Godzilla began to hunt him. shinamuro was opened first. then in 1954 Godzilla was alarmed by the submarine "Nautilus" and began to destroy the Russian and American ships. after that the shinamuro hunt resumed. And in March, both were attracted to a nuclear bomb and detonated both. So?
Last edited by Olzh26 on Mon May 20, 2019 3:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Gawdziller1954 » Mon May 20, 2019 8:22 am

Olzh26 wrote:
Gawdziller1954 wrote:
Olzh26 wrote:on the bluray edition of Godzilla 2014, it is said that it was not Godzilla who was first discovered, but some kind of muta that attacked ships in the 40s. This is definitely a shinamuro since he also attacked ships in the 40s

The Blu-Ray featurette "Operation Lucky Dragon" states that Godzilla was the creature attacking ships: "After confirming the Russians were not behind these attacks, we began tracking the entity responsible: a previously unknown species photographed here." The photographs clearly show Godzilla. The creature in the photograph has a long, reptilian tail and massive dorsal plates exactly like those of G2014.

Added in 7 minutes 8 seconds:
Olzh26 wrote:Did Godzilla destroy ships on the "Happy Dragon" expedition, or was it shinamuro?

"Lucky Dragon" was the codename of the effort to kill Godzilla with a nuclear bomb. Godzilla was the one attacking the ships.

Awakening" contradicts this?

Yeah. Awakening holds Godzilla as a creature who cares not for mankind's folly and ingores us. The instigator of the attempt to kill Godzilla with a nuke is his appearance and then submergence on Moansta island, not his raids on ships.
OH NO, IT'S GAWDZILLER!! :D

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Olzh26 » Mon May 20, 2019 8:38 am

Gawdziller1954 wrote:
Olzh26 wrote:on the bluray edition of Godzilla 2014, it is said that it was not Godzilla who was first discovered, but some kind of muta that attacked ships in the 40s. This is definitely a shinamuro since he also attacked ships in the 40s

The Blu-Ray featurette "Operation Lucky Dragon" states that Godzilla was the creature attacking ships: "After confirming the Russians were not behind these attacks, we began tracking the entity responsible: a previously unknown species photographed here." The photographs clearly show Godzilla. The creature in the photograph has a long, reptilian tail and massive dorsal plates exactly like those of G2014.

Added in 7 minutes 8 seconds:
Olzh26 wrote:Did Godzilla destroy ships on the "Happy Dragon" expedition, or was it shinamuro?

"Lucky Dragon" was the codename of the effort to kill Godzilla with a nuclear bomb. Godzilla was the one attacking the ships.

there is still mentioned the creature that was discovered first. it attacked ships in the 40s. it was definitely about shinamuro

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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Gawdziller1954 » Mon May 20, 2019 11:10 am

Olzh26 wrote:
Gawdziller1954 wrote:
Olzh26 wrote:on the bluray edition of Godzilla 2014, it is said that it was not Godzilla who was first discovered, but some kind of muta that attacked ships in the 40s. This is definitely a shinamuro since he also attacked ships in the 40s

The Blu-Ray featurette "Operation Lucky Dragon" states that Godzilla was the creature attacking ships: "After confirming the Russians were not behind these attacks, we began tracking the entity responsible: a previously unknown species photographed here." The photographs clearly show Godzilla. The creature in the photograph has a long, reptilian tail and massive dorsal plates exactly like those of G2014.

Added in 7 minutes 8 seconds:
Olzh26 wrote:Did Godzilla destroy ships on the "Happy Dragon" expedition, or was it shinamuro?

"Lucky Dragon" was the codename of the effort to kill Godzilla with a nuclear bomb. Godzilla was the one attacking the ships.

there is still mentioned the creature that was discovered first. it attacked ships in the 40s. it was definitely about shinamuro

No, there isn't. It refers to a creature singularly when talking about the sunken vessels. afterwards, it shows pictures of Godzilla and states that he was responsible. The entire script is as such:

"Gentlemen, our operation in the pacific is concluded, and by our measure was a success. As you are well aware, over the past months we've lost several vessels in the pacific region. After confirming the russians were not behind these attacks, we began tracking the entity responsible: a previously unknown species photographed here. (This is accompanied by images of Godzilla.)Sightings of this creature have been on the rise since our nuclear fleet discovered its existence in t eh extreme ocean deaths. unfortunately our efforts to locate it proved unsuccessful. This is why under the advisement of the joint chiefs a multi-national coalition was assembled to track down and study the organism dubbed :Monarch Unit. This team of specialist scoured the pacific region, establishing contact with the natives, and gathering intelligence on a creature of of mythical proportion, a legend known as Gojira. The MONARCH team surmised that the nuclear signature of our atomic submarines stirred this gojira from slumber. utilizing this tactical information, we were able to set a trap for the creature, luring it with our nuclear weaponry. 6 days ago, the target was spotted on an intercept course with the bikini atoll, part of our pacific proving grounds,and a site of a top secret operation called lucky dragon. detonation protocol was quickly amended to a new zero. A string of antennas relayed televised signals, giving command a second-by second account of wast was happening at ground zero. on march 1 1954, at exactly 8:50, Operation lucky dragon commenced, the atomic device was deployed at drop point A341, and the creature swam straight into our trap. We've had no sightings of target following detonation, as the reentry team was unable to confirm eradication the fleet will continue to monitor the perimeter for any signs of activity. in the meantime, it is our determination that the public be kept unaware of the creature's existence. We are working to ensure that the strike is acknowledged as atomic testing. I would add that the MONARCH program has been invaluable in locating and tracking this organism, and it is in our national interest to keep funding for the initiative. We will keep you informed as the situation develops. "


The images shown with the description of the creature attacking ships is Godzilla. They were referring to Godzilla and Godzilla only in this featurette, no question.
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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby Living Corpse » Tue May 21, 2019 12:10 pm

BlacktimusPrime wrote:Back when the poll was open, I said "no". Now I'm of the mindset, "it is part of canon, but I would prefer if it was not".

There. Case (probably) closed for me.


Same except I consider it partly canon and wish it was. Sort of. The concept is cool, but the execution is kind of clunky.

I feel with a rewrite it could fit better. You can have it be that both Godzilla and the Shinamura attacked ships, Godzilla still hits the U.S.S. Lawton, intentional or accidantly. I don't mind that Monarch was able to cover up the fights on land, as they were in isolated villages on coasts, islands or factories or power plants in the middle of no where, they probably told witnesses to keep silent (and who would believe them?) maybe even got some of them to join Monarch, destroyed or took away evidence like photos, filling up footprints, labeling any destruction as an accidental fire or explosion. I'm not even bothered by the fact Ishiro should look much, much older, some people just don't age.

What bugs me is

1. No Shinamura in the opening credits of G2014.

Look I know the comics and movies are done by different teams, but whoever decides what is and isn't canon needs to better communicate with both teams. Don't tell me the comic is cannon when the comic shows Godzilla chasing the Shinamura into the blast zone of the Castle Bravo nuke and movie just shows Godzilla peacefully swimming into the same nuclear ambush. You could have just put a black, bat shaped silhouette in the opening, doesn't need to be a detailed model.

2. No mention of the Shinamura.

Doesn't even have to be by name, just have Dr. Graham mention Godzilla fought another creature before the U.S. military deemed him a threat and nuked both. It would actually help Dr. Serizawa's character in the movie by explaining why he thinks Godzilla is there to restore balance instead of seeming to be a crazy guy, because there would have been precedent for it before.

3. The authorities are dumb.

That they don't believe the witnesses who saw Godzilla. Look I know witnesses who went through a traumatic event and mass hysteria can lead to unreliable recollection, but A. if you can accept one giant monster as reality you should probably be more open to the possibility there's more than one and B. there's skreeonking footprints everywhere! What did the witnesses make those giant footprints in their panic? This bothers me the most. It bothers me less in K:SI because it's been decades between Godzilla's last sighting and Kong's first, and in those years between they probably only found unusual things like tigers with horns but nothing building sized.

And even then I think it'd dumb Monarch was losing funding till Skull Island because the backers privy to knowing Godzilla exists assumed it was a one time freak incident leaving Randa and Brooks to try and get funding from a politician not authorized to know the existence of monsters and who thought they were nuts. Heck even Brooks thought Randa was nuts and probably just though the photos were fake. Though he was a lower end employee at the time and probably never met someone like the president face to face and have tell him it's real and keep your mouth shut.

I know dumb people get in positions of power all the time but...good god.
Last edited by Living Corpse on Tue May 21, 2019 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Godzilla : Awakening - Do you consider it canon or not?

Postby TheInfiniteAeon » Tue May 21, 2019 3:06 pm

I just thought that Monarch was losing funding because the government were funneling more money into 'Nam rather than an organization that hasn't turned up anything big since 1954.
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