Where should he stand? (Hero or Villain)
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- Showa Gyaos
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Where should he stand? (Hero or Villain)
Godzilla has been an enemy of Japan in most of his movies. Should Legendary Pictures bring a new air to the King of the Monsters, or keep him in his old roots (despising mankind)?
Last edited by Showa Gyaos on Sat Sep 25, 2010 3:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- TokyoVigilante
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Re: Where should he stand?
He should be a chaotic neutral. An uncontrollable force with a will of its own, with a spark of personality.
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- xenotactics
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Re: Where should he stand?
Anti hero is the most appropriate response for me as I want him to pose both an apocalyptic threat and the sole hope to stop even more dangerous forces from destroying humanity.
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- Keizer
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Re: Where should he stand?
Anti-hero. He's a threat to the world, but necessary to defend it from even greater threats.
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Re: Where should he stand?
Anti-hero honestly works best.
SuperSaiyan4Godzilla wrote: And Godzilla isn't Pixar. The latter deals with children. The former deals with adults who behave like children.
- KaijuSapian
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Re: Where should he stand?
Anti-Hero... He can be both a potential ally and a menacing threat at the same time.
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- GodzillaDude
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Re: Where should he stand?
Anti-Hero by far. Like the Heisei Godzilla he should be a extreme threat to the world himself but will defend the Earth if nessessary.
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- HeiseiGodzilla117
- Xilien Halfling
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Re: Where should he stand?
He should start off bad, destroy everything, fight his opponent, CRUSH said opponent, then continue destroying everything. I don't want him to be 'good' in any sense.
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- Keizer
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Re: Where should he stand?
I honestly don't see how they could change him without totally loosing realism. A heroic Godzilla worked in the 70's, but I don't see it going far today. The only way I see a non-anti-hero Godzilla working in the new movie is if they somehow have the military save Godzilla and establish that Godzilla is grateful. Maybe they could launch a big assault on the enemy monster just as it prepares to kill the big guy, distracting it and giving Godzilla time to destroy said enemy. Then, as the heroes prepare to be killed by Godzilla, he simply turns and leaves.
There's a reason Godzilla's been the same for so long: it works.
There's a reason Godzilla's been the same for so long: it works.
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- Xilien Halfling
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Re: Where should he stand?
Slightly to the left, but moderate. Don't want to piss off too many Republicans.
I used to be a lot more optimistic and outgoing, believe it or not. I used to actually be passionate about this stuff.
- Hotrod93
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Re: Where should he stand?
Sorta anti Hero but more on the lines of, Humans want him dead but they need him to destroy other monsters.
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- Arrow
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Re: Where should he stand?
I really wish people would get away from this "realism" thing. No matter how hard you try to validate him, Godzilla isn't realistic and trying too hard to make him so merely kills the fun of the movies. I'd rather not go through another chore of a movie that tries to take itself so seriously that it ends up just being laughable *cough*Heisei Era*cough*.HayesAJones wrote:I honestly don't see how they could change him without totally loosing realism.
While I don't object to the very idea of another anti-hero Godzilla, he'll have to be pulled off in a far less conventional way than Return of Godzilla onwards. I'd rather not see the same Godzilla I saw in 1984-2004 (with a few exceptions here and there).
A heroic Godzilla worked in the 70's, but I don't see it going far today.
No one says he has to be a Godzilla who preforms handshakes, boxes, flies, and slides on his tail. There are other ways to introduce a heroic Godzilla than a complete and utter '70s throwback.
That's debatable. I'd say bringing in the standard Godzilla characteristics hurt the Millennium films in terms of quality more than they helped it.There's a reason Godzilla's been the same for so long: it works.
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- Keizer
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Re: Where should he stand?
I adore movies that don't take themselves too seriously, but I'd really like to see a Godzilla that's a real force to be reckoned with, a beast that sides with no one, man or monster. I'd want this Godzilla to be taken seriously, by both the character and the audience. Of course Godzilla's very existence isn't realistic, but that doesn't mean he shouldn't be handled realistically. The Dark Knight and the Heisei Gamera trilogy both dealt with similarly unrealistic characters, but they were handled seriously. And all four of those movie are just top-notch.Arrow wrote:I really wish people would get away from this "realism" thing. No matter how hard you try to validate him, Godzilla isn't realistic and trying too hard to make him so merely kills the fun of the movies. I'd rather not go through another chore of a movie that tries to take itself so seriously that it ends up just being laughable *cough*Heisei Era*cough*.HayesAJones wrote:I honestly don't see how they could change him without totally loosing realism.
While I don't object to the very idea of another anti-hero Godzilla, he'll have to be pulled off in a far less conventional way than Return of Godzilla onwards. I'd rather not see the same Godzilla I saw in 1984-2004 (with a few exceptions here and there).
But besides that era, Godzilla's been either a villain or an anti-hero. From Gojira to Mothra vs. Godzilla he was a villain. From Ghidorah, the Three-Headed Monster to All Monster Attack he was more heroic, but still a dangerous force. And then from Return of Godzilla all the way to Godzilla: Final Wars he shifted between villain and anti-hero. With it really comes down to it, Godzilla is a very anti anti-hero.A heroic Godzilla worked in the 70's, but I don't see it going far today.
No one says he has to be a Godzilla who preforms handshakes, boxes, flies, and slides on his tail. There are other ways to introduce a heroic Godzilla than a complete and utter '70s throwback.
- Arrow
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Re: Where should he stand?
Haven't we seen this version of Godzilla constantly since '84? I personally think it's time for a Godzilla that doesn't need to play the exact same role he's been playing for twelve of his last thirteen movies (not counting GINO). I'm not rejecting the very possibility for an anti-hero Godzilla, but should they go this route I'd hope they introduce some sort of change for his character. A one-dimensional, mindless monster who's role is to do nothing but move the plot forward got stale a long time ago.HayesAJones wrote:I adore movies that don't take themselves too seriously, but I'd really like to see a Godzilla that's a real force to be reckoned with, a beast that sides with no one, man or monster.
That's the thing. He has been taken seriously. And I think the argument can be made that the movies and the character suffered quality-wise simply because the movies focus so much on trying to make Godzilla "realistic" (I personally think "believable" is a better term to use) that they forget to be entertaining. In order to succeed, the movie doesn't need to be "realistic" it needs to be entertaining.I'd want this Godzilla to be taken seriously, by both the character and the audience. Of course Godzilla's very existence isn't realistic, but that doesn't mean he shouldn't be handled realistically.
I'd say those four movies are top-notch because of the writing and talent of the people working on them, not because of how they treated the central character in question. Gamera is still a giant turtle. Gamera: Guardian of the Universe isn't so focused on making the movie "realistic" as it is on making it entertaining. Gamera 3 introduces mythical monster who bonds with a schoolgirl. In the first two movies, Gamera is linked to Asagi via a magical stone. There's tons of unbelievable stuff in all three movies, but they all manage to be entertaining despite that. Personally I think the LP Godzilla should take a page from the Gamera movies - focus on the entertainment, not trying to validate an unrealistic concept.The Dark Knight and the Heisei Gamera trilogy both dealt with similarly unrealistic characters, but they were handled seriously. And all four of those movie are just top-notch.
Which is exactly why I wouldn't object to a more heroic Godzilla. It'd be a fresh concept for an all new reboot that wipes the slate clean.But besides that era, Godzilla's been either a villain or an anti-hero.
See above.From Gojira to Mothra vs. Godzilla he was a villain. From Ghidorah, the Three-Headed Monster to All Monster Attack he was more heroic, but still a dangerous force. And then from Return of Godzilla all the way to Godzilla: Final Wars he shifted between villain and anti-hero. With it really comes down to it, Godzilla is a very anti anti-hero.
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- Keizer
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Re: Where should he stand?
I think Godzilla being two-dimensional is more due to the films he was in, not his status as an anti-hero. Anti-hero is a very broad term, meaning Godzilla's character can be expanded upon within that status. He could first appear to be a mindless monster, but as the movie/series continues he's shown to have great intelligence and deep emotion. Something like that, showing that he's moving closer to being a legit hero, but always reminding us that he's still a potentially dangerous force. Kinda like Zilla Jr. in Godzilla: the Series. He's obviously an protagonist, but many episodes show he's still destructive and a potential threat.
In fact, a move from villain to anti-hero seems like a really good chance to characterize Godzilla.
In fact, a move from villain to anti-hero seems like a really good chance to characterize Godzilla.
- Arrow
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Re: Where should he stand?
I agree he can be expanded on. I've said this in many of my posts in this subject. But I also don't think an interesting movie can be made by putting him on the heroic side. Again, not a complete '70s throwback with him coming to human aid heralded by blaring horns, but in another, more unconventional manner. Honestly as long as the writing is good and the character has a personality, I don't necessarily care. But I disagree that Godzilla must be anti-hero, especially when the standard characterization for the anti-hero Godzilla - in the majority of the Heisei and Millennium movies, the Marc Cerasini novels, and GINO - has been played out by this point. GMK gets props for re-introducing the completely antagonistic Godzilla used in 1954 and shaking the formula up a bit, but the Kiryu films demonstrate just how tired Plot-Device-Zilla is as a concept.HayesAJones wrote:I think Godzilla being two-dimensional is more due to the films he was in, not his status as an anti-hero. Anti-hero is a very broad term, meaning Godzilla's character can be expanded upon within that status. He could first appear to be a mindless monster, but as the movie/series continues he's shown to have great intelligence and deep emotion. Something like that, showing that he's moving closer to being a legit hero, but always reminding us that he's still a potentially dangerous force. Kinda like Zilla Jr. in Godzilla: the Series. He's obviously an protagonist, but many episodes show he's still destructive and a potential threat.
It's been done in both the Showa and Heisei series.In fact, a move from villain to anti-hero seems like a really good chance to characterize Godzilla.
With some good writing, anyone can give a fresh spin on it, however. I'm more interested in a more heroic (or just not plain antagonistic) Godzilla, however.
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- Xilien Halfling
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Re: Where should he stand?
As for realism, I'd like to point something out.
Realism was one of the driving forces between Godzilla (98)'s behavior. You know, the same behavior this fandom hates with a passion and blames for the movie sucking? The laying eggs? The being afraid of the military? The eating fish?
Realism was one of the driving forces between Godzilla (98)'s behavior. You know, the same behavior this fandom hates with a passion and blames for the movie sucking? The laying eggs? The being afraid of the military? The eating fish?
I used to be a lot more optimistic and outgoing, believe it or not. I used to actually be passionate about this stuff.
- miguelnuva
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Re: Where should he stand?
Godzilla could work better as an anti-villian as he would protect the earth and not the people and some would see him as a threat and some would like him
Mothra vs Godzilla> Gojira
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- Blackout286
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Re: Where should he stand?
Personally for me, I'd like a Godzilla that's much like the Godzilla from Gojira, destructive and a heartless void, but with a nice amount of personality and animalistic behavior. A powerful prehistoric force of nature and the hellish product of nuclear warfare.
- Lionblaze
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Re: Where should he stand?
This, I totally agreeTokyoVigilante wrote:He should be a chaotic neutral. An uncontrollable force with a will of its own, with a spark of personality.
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