Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

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Missingno.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Missingno. » Sun Mar 15, 2015 4:46 pm

three wrote:nah, sarcasm and being a jerk aside i don't understand how you figure he died. would you mind explaining?


Mechagodzilla 2 did kill Godzilla. After he blew out the second brain, Godzilla was still moving until MG started using all of his weapons on him at once. Then it showed Godzilla not moving at all, meaning that he died. Not that it lasted though, because Rodan revived him about 10 seconds later.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby three » Sun Mar 15, 2015 4:52 pm

i personally always saw it as Godzilla near death, but Rodan's sacrifice pulls him back from the brink. destroying one brain responsible for locomotion (presumably, because that's what the bad science that suggested a brain was there said it was for) and stopping a creature from moving a bunch doesn't necessarily indicate death. Godzilla's eyes remained open, which is one major indicator that he was still alive. that's not universal, but it leaves little doubt. he was on the precipice imho.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Godzelda » Sun Mar 15, 2015 4:59 pm

I think that destroying the second brain, in addition to paralyzing him, overtaxed his regenerative powers (since, from what I understand, grey matter is a lot more complex than the rest of the body's tissues), allowing a big barrage from MG2's beams to finish him off. I'm pretty sure one of the characters says that he's dead Jim.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Missingno. » Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:01 pm

three wrote:Godzilla's eyes remained open, which is one major indicator that he was still alive.


Your eyes don't have to be closed to be dead. I can get shot and killed without warning right now and because I wasn't aware of it, my eyes would still be open.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby three » Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:08 pm

Missingno. wrote:
three wrote:Godzilla's eyes remained open, which is one major indicator that he was still alive.


Your eyes don't have to be closed to be dead. I can get shot and killed without warning right now and because I wasn't aware of it, my eyes would still be open.



hey, be fair: i continued to say open eyes aren't a universal indicator of survival, just one that can indicate it. a good example in my defense is the death of Godzilla jr, who is not "dead" until his eyes close, which enrages Godzilla. we also know he was revived in a similar way. i think that if Toho wanted to indicate Godzilla had died, they wouldn't leave it ambiguous.
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axnyslie wrote:I read that too quickly I though you said land MINES. Yes they are still out there so step lightly!


Well, I've read through that handbook for the recently deceased. It says: 'live people ignore the strange and unusual. I, myself, am strange and unusual. ~ Lydia Deetz

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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Godzillian » Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:40 pm

three wrote:
Missingno. wrote:
three wrote:Godzilla's eyes remained open, which is one major indicator that he was still alive.


Your eyes don't have to be closed to be dead. I can get shot and killed without warning right now and because I wasn't aware of it, my eyes would still be open.



hey, be fair: i continued to say open eyes aren't a universal indicator of survival, just one that can indicate it. a good example in my defense is the death of Godzilla jr, who is not "dead" until his eyes close, which enrages Godzilla. we also know he was revived in a similar way. i think that if Toho wanted to indicate Godzilla had died, they wouldn't leave it ambiguous.

If you watch the scene Godzilla Jr is still moving as Godzilla revives him. Godzilla wasn't moving at all. It's not like him dying was a big deal considering it lasted a few min if that since Rodan revives him almost instantly. Throughout development Godzilla dying at the end of this film was pretty much consistent through the various scripts the film had.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby three » Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:50 pm

is he? fyi, i'm not holding out on this because i want godzilla to have lived; i legit believe he did. i'm just trying to figure out why other people don't feel the same way...so far, it's understandable, but i don't see a reason to try really hard to convince anybody.

i will say that i think it's interesting that you feel the polar opposite i do on both issues.
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axnyslie wrote:I read that too quickly I though you said land MINES. Yes they are still out there so step lightly!


Well, I've read through that handbook for the recently deceased. It says: 'live people ignore the strange and unusual. I, myself, am strange and unusual. ~ Lydia Deetz

sir isaac newton is the deadliest son - of - a - skreeonk in space.

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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Godzillian » Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:53 pm

three wrote:is he? fyi, i'm not holding out on this because i want godzilla to have lived; i legit believe he did. i'm just trying to figure out why other people don't feel the same way...so far, it's understandable, but i don't see a reason to try really hard to convince anybody.

i will say that i think it's interesting that you feel the polar opposite i do on both issues.

Agreed it's an enjoyable debate. If you go too 0:28 on this vid you can see jr moving. I apologize for the piss porr quality ahead of time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNY-F326JXE
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby three » Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:58 pm

Godzillian wrote:
three wrote:is he? fyi, i'm not holding out on this because i want godzilla to have lived; i legit believe he did. i'm just trying to figure out why other people don't feel the same way...so far, it's understandable, but i don't see a reason to try really hard to convince anybody.

i will say that i think it's interesting that you feel the polar opposite i do on both issues.

Agreed it's an enjoyable debate. If you go too 0:28 on this vid you can see jr moving. I apologize for the piss porr quality ahead of time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNY-F326JXE



won't play on my iphone but i'll take your word for now. very cool that we can reach an eye to eye resolution and not fight to the death. ^_^
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axnyslie wrote:I read that too quickly I though you said land MINES. Yes they are still out there so step lightly!


Well, I've read through that handbook for the recently deceased. It says: 'live people ignore the strange and unusual. I, myself, am strange and unusual. ~ Lydia Deetz

sir isaac newton is the deadliest son - of - a - skreeonk in space.

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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Mothralover1997 » Sat May 16, 2015 8:15 am

Food for thought: Heisei MG is the [i]only[i] military weapon in the entire Tohoverse to have killed/completely immobilized Godzilla. Even if it was only a brief moment.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby MDK » Sat May 16, 2015 10:38 am

Mothralover1997 wrote:Food for thought: Heisei MG is the [i]only[i] military weapon in the entire Tohoverse to have killed/completely immobilized Godzilla. Even if it was only a brief moment.


Super X and Super X 3 immobilized Godzilla for a bit.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Mr. Xeno » Sat May 16, 2015 2:25 pm

MDK wrote:
Mothralover1997 wrote:Food for thought: Heisei MG is the [i]only[i] military weapon in the entire Tohoverse to have killed/completely immobilized Godzilla. Even if it was only a brief moment.


Super X and Super X 3 immobilized Godzilla for a bit.

Yes they did, but not completely. SuperMechaGodzilla basically straight up killed Godzilla, although that's already a very well known aspect of the film and I'm not entirely sure why it was pointed out again.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby NSZ » Sun May 17, 2015 10:31 am

Mr. Xeno wrote:
Mothralover1997 wrote:Food for thought: Heisei MG is the only military weapon in the entire Tohoverse to have killed/completely immobilized Godzilla. Even if it was only a brief moment.


Super X and Super X 3 immobilized Godzilla for a bit.

Yes they did, but not completely. SuperMechaGodzilla basically straight up killed Godzilla, although that's already a very well known aspect of the film and I'm not entirely sure why it was pointed out again.


You can't praise SMG if you're gonna deny that Super X achieved the same thing. I am sorry, but you absolutely cannot.

Super X wrecked Godzilla. Trounced him. Set him up to meet his maker. If it weren't for those pesky Soviets, the Heisei series would be several movies shorter. It had him dead to rights.

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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Goji » Sun May 17, 2015 11:34 am

Yeah, the first Super X most definitely "completely" immobilized Godzilla. The lighting was the deus ex machina that got him out of that situation.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Mr. Xeno » Sun May 17, 2015 1:36 pm

NSZ wrote:You can't praise SMG if you're gonna deny that Super X achieved the same thing. I am sorry, but you absolutely cannot.

Super X wrecked Godzilla. Trounced him. Set him up to meet his maker. If it weren't for those pesky Soviets, the Heisei series would be several movies shorter. It had him dead to rights.

God, I'm starting to understand what the hell LC was talking about.

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And what was LC talking about? That we're all mindless sheep who downplay the power of the Super X?
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby EmperorGhidorah » Mon May 18, 2015 1:00 pm

Missingno. wrote:Mechagodzilla 2 did kill Godzilla. After he blew out the second brain, Godzilla was still moving until MG started using all of his weapons on him at once. Then it showed Godzilla not moving at all, meaning that he died. Not that it lasted though, because Rodan revived him about 10 seconds later.


Having your brain destroyed doesn't automatically turn off your durability and regeneration. Godzilla did not die. You even provided the evidence as to why. Rodan was able to revive him. You can't revive a dead body. Plus, he had taken MG's beams just fine before. It wouldn't have made any sense for them to suddenly kill him.

And Godzilla not moving? So are you saying that he died when he wasn't moving on the ocean floor? Or when Battra dropped that Ferris wheel on him?
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby three » Mon May 18, 2015 8:20 pm

all i want to say is...

...if you have a second brain, then the purpose of destroying one to kill you is defeated from the beginning. thus, despite destroying the brain, it does appear Godzilla lived.

or were those additional shots after Godzilla was incapacitated just the crew's way of being certain it was dead?
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axnyslie wrote:I read that too quickly I though you said land MINES. Yes they are still out there so step lightly!


Well, I've read through that handbook for the recently deceased. It says: 'live people ignore the strange and unusual. I, myself, am strange and unusual. ~ Lydia Deetz

sir isaac newton is the deadliest son - of - a - skreeonk in space.

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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Toxic Toast » Tue May 19, 2015 6:37 am

three wrote:if you have a second brain, then the purpose of destroying one to kill you is defeated from the beginning.


The second brain isn't a redundancy. As described in the movie, both brains are vital to Godzilla.

It's similar to human vertebrae. You don't have just two, but 24... yet destroying one is pretty damn devastating.
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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby Infinity » Tue May 19, 2015 4:44 pm

SMG did kill Godzilla. Its written in the story's plot and is visibly shown in the movie. Godzilla looked pretty dead to me.

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Re: Monster Discussion #49: MechaGodzilla (Heisei)

Postby three » Tue May 19, 2015 6:56 pm

Infinity wrote:SMG did kill Godzilla. Its written in the story's plot and is visibly shown in the movie. Godzilla looked pretty dead to me.


so dead that they had to keep shooting him, and he moved.

one of the many times the films contradict the writing. i would not travel with you in the event of a zombie apocalypse, if that's your idea of "dead". kind of still relatively alive enough to shoot it some more...yea...
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axnyslie wrote:I read that too quickly I though you said land MINES. Yes they are still out there so step lightly!


Well, I've read through that handbook for the recently deceased. It says: 'live people ignore the strange and unusual. I, myself, am strange and unusual. ~ Lydia Deetz

sir isaac newton is the deadliest son - of - a - skreeonk in space.


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