My opinion of the Heisei Series has changed quite a bit over time...

[tbeasley]

I think the most ridiculous example of this is after Godzilla fights MG the first time and beats him, they send in tanks and masers soon after.

"We've got to use this stuff on something!"

[Dv-218]

Gotta feel sorry for the goverment and the JSDF in the Heisei era, the sheer cost of all of the pointlessly destroyed tanks and masers is terrifying to imagine

[mikelcho]

Gotta feel sorry for the goverment and the JSDF in the Heisei era, the sheer cost of all of the pointlessly destroyed tanks and masers is terrifying to imagine

And also think of this: the insurance adjusters in Japan are obviously very busy people in any era of the films.

I remember reading a story by Neil Reabe in G-Fan #15-17 (I think it was his first one published in the magazine) called "The Attack of the Super-Allosaurus". In the story, Godzilla gets reduced to six feet tall by the villain. While wandering through the Japanese countryside in this state, a little girl (I think) meets up with him and God bless her, without missing a beat, walks up to him and asks "Are you Godzilla? Daddy says you raise the cost of living!" I'll never forget that moment! It was so funny! Fortunately, her father came along and got her out of there.

[BlankAccount]

Gotta feel sorry for the goverment and the JSDF in the Heisei era, the sheer cost of all of the pointlessly destroyed tanks and masers is terrifying to imagine

Eh, they managed to gain a few wins, including against Godzilla at times. So they justified their G-Force division. It's not they suck at their jobs, it's that giant monsters are really hard to beat.

[SoggyNoodles2016]

Gotta feel sorry for the goverment and the JSDF in the Heisei era, the sheer cost of all of the pointlessly destroyed tanks and masers is terrifying to imagine

My favorite cut idea from the Heisei era isn't Bagan or the 90s Godzilla vs King Kong or anything else, it's the subplot for Vs Destroyah where the goverment is shutting down G-Force for wasting money. The most realistic part of the whole series.

[HedorahIsBestGirl]

My favorite cut idea from the Heisei era isn't Bagan or the 90s Godzilla vs King Kong or anything else, it's the subplot for Vs Destroyah where the goverment is shutting down G-Force for wasting money. The most realistic part of the whole series.

Why the fuck did they cut that out? You see, if Destoroyah had more good shit like this going on, it would still be one of my favorite Godzilla movies. As it stands, it feels like a movie that wants to be great but doesn't put in the effort.

[tbeasley]

Really though - I had a big franchise re-watch before KOTM and it's occurring to me when I haven't watched them in a while, I think I don't like the 90s Heisei films, but as I'm watching them, I'm able to enjoy them in the moment. Maybe I'm mellowing out.

[Terasawa]

All of the early Heisei era movies but Gunhed are fresh in my mind after having watched them very recently so I guess it's time to rank them.

• Godzilla vs Biollante
  ---
• Godzilla vs King Ghidorah
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• Godzilla vs Mothra
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• Godzilla vs Mechagodzilla II
• Rebirth of Mothra 3
• Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla
• Godzilla vs Destoroyah (These four are all pretty much even.)
  ---
• Orochi, the Eight-Headed Dragon
  ---
• Rebirth of Mothra / ROM 2 (Tie, but maybe a very slight edge to the second film.)

I'm waiting for a specific copy of the movie before I watch Gunhed again, but I expect it to slot in between GvD and Orochi. Despite some critical flaws in nearly all of these movies, almost all of them are pretty entertaining. Orochi and the first two ROM films might not be, but even they have some things going for them.

(Edit, long after the fact, to bump GvB into its own tier.)

[HedorahIsBestGirl]

All of the early Heisei era movies but Gunhed are fresh in my mind after having watched them very recently so I guess it's time to rank them.

I think you forgot The Return of Godzilla.

I'd rank the Heisei movies:
1) Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla
2) Godzilla vs. Biollante
3) Return of Godzilla
4) Godzilla vs. Destoroyah
5) Godzilla vs. Mothra
6) Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah
7) Rebirth of Mothra 3
8) Rebirth of Mothra
9) Orochi the Eight-Headed Dragon
10) Godzilla vs. Space Godzilla
11) Rebirth of Mothra 2

Never seen Gunhed, heard it's terrible. The first and third Rebirth of Mothra movies are pretty even for me. Mediocre, but not unwatchable. ROM2 is actually painful to watch. I think it's my least favorite Toho kaiju movie, rivaled only by City on the Edge of Battle.

EDIT: Post #666. Nice.

[Terasawa]

I chose not to rank ROG because it was made during the Showa era by different people than those who worked on the Heisei and Millennium films. It feels very distant from most of the movies that came before or after it.

[eabaker]

All of the early Heisei era movies but Gunhed are fresh in my mind after having watched them very recently so I guess it's time to rank them.

• Godzilla vs Biollante
• Godzilla vs King Ghidorah
  ---
• Godzilla vs Mothra
  ---
• Godzilla vs Mechagodzilla II
• Rebirth of Mothra 3
• Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla
• Godzilla vs Destoroyah (These four are all pretty much even.)
  ---
• Orochi, the Eight-Headed Dragon
  ---
• Rebirth of Mothra / ROM 2 (Tie, but maybe a very slight edge to the second film.)

GET OUT OF MY BRAIN!!!

[Terasawa]

GET OUT OF MY BRAIN!!!

[Voyager]

I guess Imma rank all the Heisei films too.

Godzilla vs King Ghidorah
Godzilla vs Mechagodzilla
Godzilla vs Biollante
Godzilla vs Destoroyah
Return of Godzilla
Rebirth of Mothra 3
Godzilla vs Mothra
Rebirth of Mothra
Orochi, the Eight Headed Dragon
Rebirth of Mothra 2
Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla

[Tyrant_Lizard_King]

Honestly outside of RoG and Biollante (King Ghidorah to a lesser extent) I feel the Heisei films seem to have aged far worse than the Showa films. Hell in a lot of ways the later Heisei films felt dated even at the time of their release.

[Terasawa]

Honestly outside of RoG and Biollante (King Ghidorah to a lesser extent) I feel the Heisei films seem to have aged far worse than the Showa films. Hell in a lot of ways the later Heisei films felt dated even at the time of their release.

I agree, to an extent, but I think it's because the special effects fell so far behind the Hollywood standard during this era. Even in the 1980s, Kawakita's unit was producing near-Hollywood level FX with films like Bye-Bye Jupiter and Gunhed, although not on the same scale or budget. The gulf between Toho's and Hollywood's SFX capabilities widened a lot during the 1990s, moreso than it ever had.

[Spydrmanjr]

I think one aspect of the Heisei series that I dislike from the latter half is how the backgrounds just feel absent and empty. There’s often a lot buildings and miniatures in the foreground to distract us from that fact. This was especially apparent during the climax of vs SpaceGodzilla.

[szmigiel]

Then you look at the effects in the Heisei Gamera trilogy, which were done with a smaller budget but had a longer production time, and the output of the last half of the Godzilla Heisei series looks even more lackluster.

[Spydrmanjr]

Yup. I have a hard time putting myself through the final four films unless they are on the background while I am doing something else.

[Chrispy_G]

Honestly outside of RoG and Biollante (King Ghidorah to a lesser extent) I feel the Heisei films seem to have aged far worse than the Showa films. Hell in a lot of ways the later Heisei films felt dated even at the time of their release.

Yeah, I know it gets often repeated, but I feel like Biollante is the last time you could take a Godzilla film, and put it against a comparable Hollywood film from the same time, and they could be ROUGHLY equivalent.

Like....does Biollante come off as dramatically cheaper feeling/looking than something like Batman or Tremors in terms of the effects wizardry or cinematography? Maybe there is a gap in favor of the US films....but does it feel THAT vast?

Then compare Terminator 2 to Godzilla vs King Ghidorah, any latter Heisei film to Jurassic Park or Independence Day....and it just feels like they aren't even on the same planet in terms of production value.

The advent of CGI and the sort of super-booming budgets/resources of Hollywood films immediately created a huge gap....and I think combined with a lack of resources/time/creativity/drive on the part of Toho/The Godzilla filmmakers.

A lot comes from sheer cinematography. Certain angles are simply more cinematic and dynamic, certain lighting tricks and techniques are simply more cinematic. You would be surprised how man top-dollar sets and miniatures look incredibly fake without the proper camera angles, lighting, and color grading.

It isn't raw dollars, that obviously helps, but time and effort must be there too. I felt like 90s Toho Godzilla wasn't really trying until Godzilla 2000....

Interesting enough, the US version of Godzilla 2000 feels incredibly cinematic in a lot of ways, and the biggest difference in that version of the movie is the completely overhauled sound design. Sound design and foley alone give that film such a loaded soundscape, that it just FEELS a bit more big-budget. Even the right SOUND effect can help sell something onscreen as feeling more 'real' and thus more 'convincing' on a cinematic level.

[Tyrant_Lizard_King]

The opening sequence on Godzilla 2000 is quite possibly one of the most cinematic and atmospheric sequences ever created for a Godzilla film. Unfortunately the rest of the production doesn't quite measure up.