Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

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LSD Jellyfish
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Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:50 am

I remember when I first started visiting this site, or Godzilla fansites, way back yonder, good ol 1998 was a big laughingstock and horse that must’ve been beaten into oblivion. And for a long time, rightfully so, it was the big chance to expose the west to Godzilla, in a big budget way, but flopped critically and wasn’t faithful to the franchise.

However, I could’ve sworn this hatred used to be more, and 98 got referenced a lot more in discussions.

Following 98, Toho released the millennium series and while YMMV, a lot of those films like G200, GMK and GFW are well loved by fans. Following that, after a ten year hiatus, G14 came in swinging with a decently critically and commercially successful film. Followed up of course by Shin, which was basically the Big Papa in Japan, and smashed critical and commercial records, before enjoying an actually decent limited run in the United States. And thanks to Netflix, we have a new devisice anime trilogy (which hilariously enough comes up next to the 98 film). KOTM comes out in a few months as well.

Basically I’m asking if 98 is dead. I mean it being what people think of when they think of Godzilla (non fans/GA), as well as it now being completely rendered harmless. I also mean is the anger and hostility gone? People seem to occasionally use it as a buttend of a joke but there’s no more of the same despisement it had. This may sound like a weird thread, but if we all traveled back maybe ten or so years, a lot of people would be screaming how it was the biggest mistake ever and ruined a lot of things.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Maritonic » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:15 am

I mean, dust eventually settles. Especially when there are new things to talk about. I hate bringing this up, but Star Wars had had a similar experience; the prequels were TRASHED when they came out, now that we have a bunch of new material, they seem to be left alone for the most part.

I think if you talk to the average person, they'll still hold the same feelings for the movie. I don't think the reaction is as visceral, though. Because as I said; dust settles. That I think we also have a younger generation, that grew up with it, who love it or like it, that kind of evens out the older people who dislike it. I don't mean this in a generalization: I know there are younger fans who hate it, and older fans who love it. I'm simply talking about growing up with films; I openly admit nostalgia plays a role in my love of certain entries in the franchise. I'm sure it does for most people.

This balance is effecting the weather of the fandom. Not a bad thing, though. I think the same thing will happen with the anime trilogy; eventually we'll have something else to talk about and new fans will discover it and have a completely different reaction to it.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Rhedosaurus » Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:28 am

No, it's relevent, but not in the way people think. You see, the fan outrage over that movie was so bad, that it not only forced the planned sequel to get dropped, but also scared Hollywood so bad that NOBODY would dare make a heretical movie that would defame Godzilla.

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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby SoggyNoodles2016 » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:44 pm

Rhedosaurus wrote:No, it's relevent, but not in the way people think. You see, the fan outrage over that movie was so bad, that it not only forced the planned sequel to get dropped, but also scared Hollywood so bad that NOBODY would dare make a heretical movie that would defame Godzilla.


The sequel got canned because the film bombed with audiences. The fact we got more traditonal Godzilla films iin the Monsterverse is a happy coincidence, not a side-effect of G 98.

Added in 41 seconds:
I think. Was making a better Godzilla film ever a legitimate thing Legendary said?
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Rhedosaurus » Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:32 am

SoggyNoodles2016 wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:No, it's relevent, but not in the way people think. You see, the fan outrage over that movie was so bad, that it not only forced the planned sequel to get dropped, but also scared Hollywood so bad that NOBODY would dare make a heretical movie that would defame Godzilla.


The sequel got canned because the film bombed with audiences. The fact we got more traditonal Godzilla films iin the Monsterverse is a happy coincidence, not a side-effect of G 98.

Added in 41 seconds:
I think. Was making a better Godzilla film ever a legitimate thing Legendary said?


Actually, Zilla '98 did make a small profit, but the fan rage was such that it DID force Sony to drop the sequel. Legendary might not say that the fan rage caused by Zilla '98 forces them to make faithful movies, but let's not pretend that the fear of bringing back that same kind of rage isn't a motivation.

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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby MechaGoji Bro7503 » Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:44 am

I hope so. It's been 20 years fellas, move on, enjoy the other 30+ films.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby eabaker » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:47 am

Completely irrelevant? No. It still exists as part of the property's history, it still merits discussion for its place - however unfortunate - in cinema history. Is it as relevant, to the popular conception of Godzilla, as it was twenty years ago? Not even close.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby HillyHulk » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:06 pm

Now with Legendary Godzilla around, I would say so. We have a real American Godzilla now, so there's no need to remember Zilla (or as I call him because even "Zilla" is too close to the real deal, Gigantis).
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby eabaker » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:08 pm

HillyHulk wrote:Now with Legendary Godzilla around, I would say so. We have a real American Godzilla now, so there's need to remember Zilla (or as I call him because even "Zilla" is too close to the real deal, Gigantis).


I dunno, I think there's value in revisiting cautionary tales. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it (or have it revisited upon them via a monster possessed by the spirits of the dead, in some cases).
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Kaiju-King42 » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:11 pm

Remember many foreign countries were first introduced to Godzilla via the 1998 film, and hated LPG because it was too different compared to the Godzilla that in their view WAS the original.

So no, it's not irrelevant yet. The damage it's done can still be felt.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby kingkevzilla88 » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:22 pm

I know a few people who like it (I don't understand why)and I did over some people complaining about 2014 being a remake of it. So, yes I say the dam thing is still doing damage.

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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Godzillian » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:28 pm

Rhedosaurus wrote:
SoggyNoodles2016 wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:No, it's relevent, but not in the way people think. You see, the fan outrage over that movie was so bad, that it not only forced the planned sequel to get dropped, but also scared Hollywood so bad that NOBODY would dare make a heretical movie that would defame Godzilla.


The sequel got canned because the film bombed with audiences. The fact we got more traditonal Godzilla films iin the Monsterverse is a happy coincidence, not a side-effect of G 98.

Added in 41 seconds:
I think. Was making a better Godzilla film ever a legitimate thing Legendary said?


Actually, Zilla '98 did make a small profit, but the fan rage was such that it DID force Sony to drop the sequel. Legendary might not say that the fan rage caused by Zilla '98 forces them to make faithful movies, but let's not pretend that the fear of bringing back that same kind of rage isn't a motivation.

He never mentioned box office, it is a fact that the film was so poorly recieved by the GA that it "wasnt worth it" to make a sequel to Sony. The Godzilla fandom is in no way big enough to get major studio attention. As for the 2014 film, I'm sure that Edwards and the crew had it in the back of their mind to not screw it up like 98. Legendary wasnt sitting there going "we cant make the fans mad, they'll ruin us"
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby UltramanGoji » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:36 pm

I think it's important to remember it as a stain on the franchise's legacy that basically soiled its name in any country but Japan for sixteen years. It's the perfect example of how to completely fail at making a Godzilla movie.

Godzillian wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:
SoggyNoodles2016 wrote:
The sequel got canned because the film bombed with audiences. The fact we got more traditonal Godzilla films iin the Monsterverse is a happy coincidence, not a side-effect of G 98.

Added in 41 seconds:
I think. Was making a better Godzilla film ever a legitimate thing Legendary said?


Actually, Zilla '98 did make a small profit, but the fan rage was such that it DID force Sony to drop the sequel. Legendary might not say that the fan rage caused by Zilla '98 forces them to make faithful movies, but let's not pretend that the fear of bringing back that same kind of rage isn't a motivation.

He never mentioned box office, it is a fact that the film was so poorly recieved by the GA that it "wasnt worth it" to make a sequel to Sony. The Godzilla fandom is in no way big enough to get major studio attention. As for the 2014 film, I'm sure that Edwards and the crew had it in the back of their mind to not screw it up like 98. Legendary wasnt sitting there going "we cant make the fans mad, they'll ruin us"


The 98 sequel was in development for at least three years before being canned, so I don't think the fan reaction was entirely the reason for its demise.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Godzillian » Sun Jan 13, 2019 3:03 pm

UltramanGoji wrote:I think it's important to remember it as a stain on the franchise's legacy that basically soiled its name in any country but Japan for sixteen years. It's the perfect example of how to completely fail at making a Godzilla movie.

Godzillian wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:
Actually, Zilla '98 did make a small profit, but the fan rage was such that it DID force Sony to drop the sequel. Legendary might not say that the fan rage caused by Zilla '98 forces them to make faithful movies, but let's not pretend that the fear of bringing back that same kind of rage isn't a motivation.

He never mentioned box office, it is a fact that the film was so poorly recieved by the GA that it "wasnt worth it" to make a sequel to Sony. The Godzilla fandom is in no way big enough to get major studio attention. As for the 2014 film, I'm sure that Edwards and the crew had it in the back of their mind to not screw it up like 98. Legendary wasnt sitting there going "we cant make the fans mad, they'll ruin us"


The 98 sequel was in development for at least three years before being canned, so I don't think the fan reaction was entirely the reason for its demise.

Exactly, let's not forget that the merch for the film was a total failure as well
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Tyrant_Lizard_King » Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:57 pm

G98 was actually a pretty good sized hit. It didn't quite meet expectations but it wasn't an outright failure either. Merchandising played a large part in its downfall if you ask me. The failure of G98's merchandise killed Trendmasters for example. It also made a lot of companies weary of stocking Godzilla because of all the leftover G98 merchandise that sat on their shelfs. A lot of inventory went unsold.

I personally enjoy G98 but I do feel its overall legacy caused everyone attached to G14 to hold back way too much. The studio and the filmmakers seemed too afraid to spend too much money on it or do anything different with the franchise do to how G98 was received critically. I also believe its why very few companies picked up the licence.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Rhedosaurus » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:17 pm

Godzillian wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:
SoggyNoodles2016 wrote:
The sequel got canned because the film bombed with audiences. The fact we got more traditonal Godzilla films iin the Monsterverse is a happy coincidence, not a side-effect of G 98.

Added in 41 seconds:
I think. Was making a better Godzilla film ever a legitimate thing Legendary said?


Actually, Zilla '98 did make a small profit, but the fan rage was such that it DID force Sony to drop the sequel. Legendary might not say that the fan rage caused by Zilla '98 forces them to make faithful movies, but let's not pretend that the fear of bringing back that same kind of rage isn't a motivation.

He never mentioned box office, it is a fact that the film was so poorly recieved by the GA that it "wasnt worth it" to make a sequel to Sony. The Godzilla fandom is in no way big enough to get major studio attention. As for the 2014 film, I'm sure that Edwards and the crew had it in the back of their mind to not screw it up like 98. Legendary wasnt sitting there going "we cant make the fans mad, they'll ruin us"


But Godzilla himself is more then large and famous enough for even the GA to take notice when a major Hollywood studio screws it up majorly. At the end of the Heisei era, he'd more then overtaken most of the old Universal monsters-Dracula being the one exception via Dracula '92-in fame.

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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby SoggyNoodles2016 » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:34 pm

Rhedosaurus wrote:
Godzillian wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:
Actually, Zilla '98 did make a small profit, but the fan rage was such that it DID force Sony to drop the sequel. Legendary might not say that the fan rage caused by Zilla '98 forces them to make faithful movies, but let's not pretend that the fear of bringing back that same kind of rage isn't a motivation.

He never mentioned box office, it is a fact that the film was so poorly recieved by the GA that it "wasnt worth it" to make a sequel to Sony. The Godzilla fandom is in no way big enough to get major studio attention. As for the 2014 film, I'm sure that Edwards and the crew had it in the back of their mind to not screw it up like 98. Legendary wasnt sitting there going "we cant make the fans mad, they'll ruin us"


But Godzilla himself is more then large and famous enough for even the GA to take notice when a major Hollywood studio screws it up majorly. At the end of the Heisei era, he'd more then overtaken most of the old Universal monsters-Dracula being the one exception via Dracula '92-in fame.


How?

Nobody could see the Heisei films in America.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Zarm » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:39 pm

They'd made it over on VHS by then.
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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby Rhedosaurus » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:45 pm

SoggyNoodles2016 wrote:
Rhedosaurus wrote:
Godzillian wrote:He never mentioned box office, it is a fact that the film was so poorly recieved by the GA that it "wasnt worth it" to make a sequel to Sony. The Godzilla fandom is in no way big enough to get major studio attention. As for the 2014 film, I'm sure that Edwards and the crew had it in the back of their mind to not screw it up like 98. Legendary wasnt sitting there going "we cant make the fans mad, they'll ruin us"


But Godzilla himself is more then large and famous enough for even the GA to take notice when a major Hollywood studio screws it up majorly. At the end of the Heisei era, he'd more then overtaken most of the old Universal monsters-Dracula being the one exception via Dracula '92-in fame.


How?

Nobody could see the Heisei films in America.


Because of the gap in between the Hammer movies and the recent movies that haven't really done well. Godzilla has had at least one 2 movies per decade.

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Re: Has 98 been made completely irrelevant?

Postby LockBite » Mon Jan 14, 2019 5:55 pm

Godzilla ‘98 was a throwaway movie, forgotten by most as quickly as any other Roland Emmerich turd. The only people who held a lasting memory of the film were children of ‘99 who liked the toys and tv series, and Godzilla fans who were pissed enough to remember the film. What I’m trying to say is, Godzilla ‘98 is hardly any more irrelevant today than it was in 2002.


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