Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby eabaker » Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:52 am

KaijuCanuck wrote:Who would you guys say wins the final fight? Emiko succeeds in pulling Godzilla out to sea, but not in permanently ending the threat and thus restoring the future timeline. Godzilla gets pulled from Tokyo against his will, but strikes a killing blow against his attacker and survives to fight another day.


Although Emi doesn't permanently end the threat of Godzilla, the future is altered so that Godzilla will no longer completely destroy Japan in the 21st Century, so I'd count that as a win overall.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby LockBite » Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:46 pm

Easily the most overrated Godzilla film. A nonsensical plot and terrible lapses in special effects (does everyone just forget about the jet pack scene?) make this a significant downgrade from Biollante. That being said, it’s still a good G-film, with solid action sequences and the best Heisei suit.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby kamilleblu » Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:09 am

LockBite wrote:Easily the most overrated Godzilla film. A nonsensical plot and terrible lapses in special effects (does everyone just forget about the jet pack scene?) make this a significant downgrade from Biollante. That being said, it’s still a good G-film, with solid action sequences and the best Heisei suit.

It also holds the dishonor of having the worst Western actors and English dialogue in the series.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby KaijuCanuck » Wed Mar 21, 2018 7:42 am

LockBite wrote:Easily the most overrated Godzilla film. A nonsensical plot and terrible lapses in special effects (does everyone just forget about the jet pack scene?) make this a significant downgrade from Biollante. That being said, it’s still a good G-film, with solid action sequences and the best Heisei suit.


I feel like it is one the most inconsistent Godzilla films. There are parts that are excellent, and then there are parts that are just god awful. The jet pack is one, the running scene is another. And I’ve always been really bored with the Futurians as villains, they don’t hold a candle to any of the Shōwa aliens.

But, the parallel theme with Japan’s real world economic downtown is cool and holds a real emotionality with me. Gojira was a film
about where Japan was in 1954, and every once in a while a Godzilla film comes along that kind of checks in again, and this is one of them. Also there is something really triumphant and awesome about Godzilla’s resurrection and subsequent rampage.

So yeah, very inconsistent for me, probably a little overrated. I actually prefer all of the later heisei films over this one, except for maybe Godzilla vs Mothra. But there is some legitimately great stuff in there.
Last edited by KaijuCanuck on Wed Mar 21, 2018 7:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby eabaker » Wed Mar 21, 2018 9:59 am

KaijuCanuck wrote:But, the parallel theme with Japan’s real world economic downtown is cool and holds a real emotionality with me. Gojira was a film about where Japan was in 1954, and every once in a while a Godzilla film comes along that kind of checks in again, and this is one of them. Also there is something really triumphant and awesome about Godzilla’s resurrection and subsequent rampage.


This stuff is key to why it's in my top 5 Godzilla movies, especially thanks to how it parallels Godzilla to Japan's economy through the character of Shindo, who is the reflection of one element and the avatar of the other.

It's also the last Heisei Godzilla movie to opt for any particularly interesting or dynamic visual storytelling in its human scenes. Again I must mention Shindo; his introductory shot is both thematically resonant and technically neat-o.

One can nit-pick about the time travel plotting (though it does exactly what it needs to do to propel story and theme) and special effects inconsistencies, but ultimately, for me, the movies highs are just too high to be significantly damaged by those kinds of easily ignored problems.

kamilleblu wrote:It also holds the dishonor of having the worst Western actors and English dialogue in the series.


I'll grant that the two American naval officers are pretty awful, but I don't know that they're any worse than Leo Meneghetti in Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla II, and he has a strong contender the single worst-written line of English-language dialogue in the whole series.

And then there's the god-awful Don Frye in GFW, who is not only terrible and obnoxious, but also really prominent in the movie.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Terasawa » Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:26 pm

There is no way the foreign actors in this are as bad as those in Godzilla vs. Biollante or the two flicks eabaker mentioned.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Ivo-goji » Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:06 pm

Terasawa wrote:There is no way the foreign actors in this are as bad as those in Godzilla vs. Biollante or the two flicks eabaker mentioned.

Biollante's non-Japanese characters are so bad in this respect as to make the dubbed version of the film merciful in comparison.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby KaijuCanuck » Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:16 pm

Hey guys, let’s not fight - ALL the non-Japanese actors in Godzilla films are terrible. ;)

(I am over-generalizing for comedic effect btw - but they are mostly terrible)
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby UltimateDitto » Mon Jun 11, 2018 8:08 am


Behind the scenes looks provided by film toaster!
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby edgaguirus » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:27 pm

I could never be a suit actor. All those pyrotechnics going off around me.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby eabaker » Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:28 pm

I was thinking about this movie in the shower this morning (because of course I was), and I had a realization.

This has been among my favorite G flicks ever since I first saw it, which was probably in early 1994. But I've also never been blind to its flaws. One thing that I always identified as a flaw is that, while Teresawa is a basically likable enough lead, a good point of view characterm but he doesn't really have a story of his own. His romantic relationship with Chiaki always felt tacked-on, and the "you're my ancestor" bit with Emi seemed kind of pointless.

And then, this morning, it all tied together in my head.

Initially, Teresawa's want is established as: become a more respected/credible journalist. We don't really know if he gets that or not, but that's not the end of the world, because a protagonist's want is a starting point; if it's the whole point of a story, than you have a two-dimensional story.

But a good protagonist has a want and a need that differ from each other (though ideally they are meaningfully related), and it is the need that should be paid off in the end. So, what is Teresawa's need?

The realization that I had is that Teresawa does have a need, and that it ties in to both his desire for credibility as a journalist, his relationship with Chiaki, and the revelation about his relationship to Emi.

Teresawa is disappointed to learn that his book wasn't a best seller. This not only calls into question the viability of his want, but also clues us into his need, which - appropriately enough, in a movie about the past shaping the present and the present shaping the future - is a legacy.

In the end, he won't get that legacy through his journalism. He'll get it through Chiaki (okay, that's a little dehumanizing, isn't it), in the form of their descendants, including Emi.

So, yay, possibly my biggest problem with this movie is no longer a problem.
Last edited by eabaker on Wed Jun 27, 2018 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Grievous » Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:16 am

Oh Boy...

So I can't stand this one.

The film is well made with some interesting ideas & characters
but two things greatly weigh it down for me.

1). Time travel:
I honestly can't stand time travel or altered timelines as the
basis for any film plot...and that includes kaiju films.

While I have read article after article by many Godzilla fans
explaining how it makes perfect sense...I just don't like it.

&

2). King Ghidorah:
So I'm just going to say it. King Ghidorah has ALWAYS been
an awkward mess on screen & I've never really considered
him a threat because he is always defeated in one way or
another.

And while this Ghidorah (& his Mecha form) look great...
he's still awkward & unruly on screen & his new Dorat
origin is dumb as hell.

I'm actually looking forward to KotM mainly because the
King of Terror will finally be a powerful threat...and not
just an awkward suit/puppet show.

So yeah...this is one that I rarely watch...and I can't see
my opinion changing on it.
Last edited by Grievous on Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Jaqua92 » Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:56 pm

Watched this with my gf the other day.

What a god awefully hilarious movie. The whole thing made no sense. Cheap lazy plot, with solutions being pulled out of the air, and explained like a childrens book. It almost felt like a satirical movie.

Also, the robot running scene was downright hilarious.

Its been a while, but are all the toho movies this poorly executed and written? I remember them being better.

But by all technicalities, this was a god aweful movie.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby PopInPicsPresents » Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:08 am

Jaqua92 wrote:But by all technicalities, this was a god aweful movie.


Have you ever even seen a "god awful" movie? I'm guessing not if you think Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah of all things is :lol:
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Maritonic » Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:36 am

I dunno, it kind of sounds like you aren't too familiar with the standard level of special effects and story telling that goes with a Godzilla film. That's just the vibe I get from the criticisms you have. Not saying Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah is perfect by any means, and there are definitely criticisms to be made, but still.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Dr. Professor » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:26 pm

It's no secret that this film doesn't make much sense, but I rewatched it today for the first time in years, and man it's even worse than I remembered. It. Just. Makes. No. skreeonkin. Sense. Oh well, still my favorite Heisei film though.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby MechaGoji Bro7503 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 9:21 am

Man, Kazuki Omori is so brilliant. His ideas, execution, and direction are like no other.
You see, he understood that space monsters are just an absolutely silly idea, and only little kids like them. He made a brilliant compromise by having King Ghidorah be made of genetically engineered pets from the far future, that were placed back in time to be nuked and mutated into the three headed menace, and would wait three decades before he begins his rampage.

Okay, how you gonna present that idea, Omori? Huh? Honestly he made things much harder than they should of been, and his writing showed how much of a plot hole he dug himself into.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Dr. Professor » Tue Jan 22, 2019 9:48 am

MechaGoji Bro7503 wrote:Man, Kazuki Omori is so brilliant. His ideas, execution, and direction are like no other.
You see, he understood that space monsters are just an absolutely silly idea, and only little kids like them. He made a brilliant compromise by having King Ghidorah be made of genetically engineered pets from the far future, that were placed back in time to be nuked and mutated into the three headed menace, and would wait three decades before he begins his rampage.

Okay, how you gonna present that idea, Omori? Huh? Honestly he made things much harder than they should of been, and his writing showed how much of a plot hole he dug himself into.

In my opinion the worst skreeonking thing about this film is that Emmy was the one who replaced the Godzillasaurus with the Dorats, and then when they get back to the present, she's shocked and angry to hear that King Ghidorah's attacking. Well what the skreeonk did you think you were doing back there, Emmy? THIS FILM MAKES NO skreeonkin SENSE.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby MechaGoji Bro7503 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 9:54 am

Dr. Professor wrote:
MechaGoji Bro7503 wrote:Man, Kazuki Omori is so brilliant. His ideas, execution, and direction are like no other.
You see, he understood that space monsters are just an absolutely silly idea, and only little kids like them. He made a brilliant compromise by having King Ghidorah be made of genetically engineered pets from the far future, that were placed back in time to be nuked and mutated into the three headed menace, and would wait three decades before he begins his rampage.

Okay, how you gonna present that idea, Omori? Huh? Honestly he made things much harder than they should of been, and his writing showed how much of a plot hole he dug himself into.

In my opinion the worst skreeonking thing about this film is that Emmy was the one who replaced the Godzillasaurus with the Dorats, and then when they get back to the present, she's shocked and angry to hear that King Ghidorah's attacking. Well what the skreeonk did you think you were doing back there, Emmy? THIS FILM MAKES NO skreeonkin SENSE.

Even as a kid I had a hard time getting to flow with this film's story. I like how Emmy just tells that one guy she's his great great (great?) grandchild, and just time travels the skreeonk outa there.
Wikizilla's article and video about the whole time travel debacle was what helped me finally understand it.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Kaiju-King42 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:28 pm

KaijuCanuck wrote:Hey guys, let’s not fight - ALL the non-Japanese actors in Godzilla films are terrible. ;)

(I am over-generalizing for comedic effect btw - but they are mostly terrible)


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