Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

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Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby JVM » Tue Aug 18, 2015 12:01 am

Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

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There's already separate threads to discuss the timeline shenanigans, the Shindo's Death sequence,the Heisei version of King Ghidorah and Mecha-King Ghidorah - so this thread is mostly here to discuss the movie in general.

This was one of my first Godzilla films and I'm always going to have a big soft spot for it. Some of the effects are dated and the movie doesn't explain itself well, but I really do enjoy the monster sequences and I think Shindo is one of the more fascinating human characters to come out of the Heisei series, regardless of Godzilla's feelings towards him. The regeneration of Godzilla is an interesting sequence and briefly plays with the idea of Godzilla's inevitability. It has some goofy moments but I've always personally found it a fun flick.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Mr. Xeno » Tue Aug 18, 2015 4:28 pm

This film is easily my personal favorite film of the franchise. It takes a unique premise and fleshes itself out with some very clever writing, and has some absolutely fantastic music and sequences. The characters aren't anything TOO special, but by Godzilla movie standards, they're quite good, plus they play a huge role in the plot; nearly every single part of the plot hinges on the characters' actions, and yet the monsters never feel like they're being sidelined. It does have some unintentionally funny moments, almost all of which are bits of M11 being a Terminator wannabe, but otherwise, this is an incredibly fun film that's packed with content. I felt like I needed nap after watching it.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Kaijugriffey » Tue Aug 18, 2015 7:14 pm

I like this one, although I am not sure why. I mean it's a time travel story with a ton of plot holes which automatically counts against it. But damn if the Kaiju stuff isn't so good it plasters over much of it's technobabble. Plus hitting the whole WW2 Pacific history head on in such a dark manner is kind of neat. Added bonus, It's like "Godzilla Meets the Terminator!" You don't normally see something that weird outside of Hanna Barbera (and then it would more likely be Godzilla (m)eats the Harlem Globetrotters). And it works. As long as you don't think too hard. (Is it just me, or do all of Emi's solutions to problems in this movie make things 1000x worse? Apparently they still grow em crazy and stupid in the future.) It's a real rollercoaster of totally awesome moments, like after KG is defeated Godzilla brutally turning on Tokyo and directly wasting the old dude, vs head scratchingly contrived plot twists. (Dudes! You have a TIME MACHINE! Just watch any three episodes of Dr. Who and figure out how to solve this without resorting to things like Mecha King Ghidorah! Or creating two Godzilla's. Really most incompetent time travelers Ever!) Overall it's probably the most fun of the Heisei films, with constant plot twists and non stop action from the start that never lets up. Not the best. (I kinda prefer Godzilla vs Destroyah overall) but definitely fun to watch.

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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby eabaker » Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:18 pm

I have always been quick to speak this movie's praises. I love the time travel, and don't care about the bits that don't entirely make sense, because everything that's going on works for the story and the theme. I find the presentation of Godzilla himself particularly impressive, and, thanks in large part to the masterful Shindo death scene (and, of course, to my favorite Ifukube score of the Heisei era), quite emotionally affecting. I also think Omori is probably the best director to have touched the series in the Heisei years, and I think it's a damned pity that he was stuck only on screenplay duty for his later additions to the series.

Of course, I'm a bit of a pinko lefty commie type, so that anti-nationalist/anti-unchecked-capitalism aspects of the flick are a pretty important part of my attachment to it.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Mechagigan » Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:46 pm

I like this one because it's straight up sci-fi fun. It balances on the line between cheesy and creative really well, despite some poor effects here or there, and the story is very enjoyable for taking a step away from the darker tone of '84 and Biollante and heading in a more loose direction.

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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby djkgoji » Tue Sep 01, 2015 9:07 am

I first saw a bootleg of GVKG in early 1993, shortly after seeing GVB for the first time. To be honest, Biollante was such a mixed bag on that first viewing (I loved the effects & the monster designs, but found the overall movie to be very slow-paced & rather bizarre) that I was very, very apprehensive about KingGhidorah going in. To my joy, it turned out to be a blast from beginning to end, an old school Toho monsterfest the likes of which I wasn't sure I'd ever see again. Whatever issues it had with logic, science, acting, and technical execution, it more than made up for with badass monsters, epic destruction scenes, a fantastic score, great battles, and a "go for broke" approach to the material reminiscent of the 60s & 70s films. Though its flaws have become a bit more pronounced with subsequent viewings, I still consider it one of the most enjoyable and entertaining movies in the franchise. When I sit down to watch a Heisei film, it's typically the first one I reach for.

For the record, I've long since worked through my initial hang-ups about GVB, too, and have a great fondness for it.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby godzillalives88 » Tue Sep 01, 2015 11:11 am

King Ghidorah's definitely one of those movies where there's a very clear set of pros and cons, but the pros end up winning out for me in the end. I like the inclusion of time travel in the series (despite the oft-cited plot holes), I like the Godzillasaurus origin story, the Shindo subplot, I think King Ghidorah is one of the better Heisei redesigns, Mecha-King Ghidorah's well executed too, and Godzilla is given one of his best portrayals ever in the series. PERIOD. So there's a lot going in its favor despite some admittedly sloppy aspects (the convoluted story, Omori's tendency to rip off Hollywood movies, etc.).

As much as some lament the direction the Heisei series went post-Biollante, this really is a film that takes chances and refuses to settle into a formula.

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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Giga Kaiju » Sun Sep 06, 2015 8:01 pm

Can't deny that the battle scenes are really the highlight of the movie.

Pretty up there with BIOLLANTE's.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby three » Mon Sep 07, 2015 2:36 pm

eabaker wrote:I have always been quick to speak this movie's praises. I love the time travel, and don't care about the bits that don't entirely make sense, because everything that's going on works for the story and the theme. I find the presentation of Godzilla himself particularly impressive, and, thanks in large part to the masterful Shindo death scene (and, of course, to my favorite Ifukube score of the Heisei era), quite emotionally affecting. I also think Omori is probably the best director to have touched the series in the Heisei years, and I think it's a damned pity that he was stuck only on screenplay duty for his later additions to the series.

Of course, I'm a bit of a pinko lefty commie type, so that anti-nationalist/anti-unchecked-capitalism aspects of the flick are a pretty important part of my attachment to it.


so you caught those political undertones as well, hmm? i think i had a discussion with Rodan (back when he posted) and we didn't agree on it. he didn't believe it was necessarily there, and i maintained it was. either way. glad to see that someone else has a sharp eye on things like that.

and with that said, this movie is the only film in the franchise that, for me, offers stiff competition to Biollante as my favorite Godzilla flick. we're talking dead heat, nearly even in my enthusiasm for each film. both are out of the box and very creative. both have good scores (Biollante's runs away with the prize, though). both have really well done props, save for Ghidorah in flight (Biollante wins on that count as well).

this is the one time, the one single time in the franchise, that i felt Ghidorah was living up to the hype behind its name. it was winning the fight until its brain was fried, and even then: it still managed to nearly strangle G to death with its neck. like what? seriously?

the only major flaw of this movie, other than the wonky flying Ghidorah stiff prop, is that it's a two part film. after the Godzillasaurus dies, you're onto part two. everything before that is part one. part one can drag a bit, but it functions on a very emotional level. you have a different window of Godzilla's character now open to you: he's a savior, and a bit of a martyr for japan's cause in WWII. overall, an extremely well done movie. i love it.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Space Hunter M » Mon Sep 07, 2015 3:34 pm

Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah's structure is interesting. The entire movie kinda steadily builds up to this completely action packed last third like Godzilla vs. The Thing.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Giga Kaiju » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:54 pm

The twist going from Godzilla being a saviour to a 'villain' was really amusing but it was great.

Like how James Rolfe in his review said it, "And the good news is, Godzilla is back...! And the bad news is, GODZILLA IS BACK...!" :P
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Tohosaurus » Mon Sep 07, 2015 7:50 pm

My disappointment for this film stems from two key areas listed below. To me the film is an overall creative step down from the prior films, both in story and aesthetics. Still better than BFE and SG though.

1) Story. It's nowhere near as compelling to me as the 80s predecessors. While they were still fairly heavy sci-fi, they presented it all in a more grounded fashion and I would have wanted at least a few more of them done that way before going back to heavier sci-fi. But I could look past that easily if it was just a good story in terms of overall story, characters, etc. Unfortunately it doesn't have that for me.

2) Effects. The two 80s movies have effects that overall still impress me today, especially GvB. Despite the larger budget, KG does a 180. And the suits end up being clunky enough to reduce the enjoyment I get out of the (still enjoyable) battles.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Giga Kaiju » Tue Sep 08, 2015 6:32 pm

Well, those can't be compared to the latter 90's movies as they were very good indeed. Perhaps, VERY much so. So, maybe since they were trying to appeal to a wider audience, that's the why some elements changed?

It could be.
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tymon wrote:Man, it really makes me laugh when I remember that all this drama is centered around a fictional, giant atomic monster. Damn you, Godzilla!

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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Tohosaurus » Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:48 pm

Giga Kaiju wrote:Well, those can't be compared to the latter 90's movies as they were very good indeed. Perhaps, VERY much so. So, maybe since they were trying to appeal to a wider audience, that's the why some elements changed?

It could be.

I'm sure that's a possibility, but like I said that basic concept was something I could easily look past if the actual movie was good. And that IMO it was not. The simple aspect of writing for each of the 90s movies was inferior, and effects work is just not there.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Giga Kaiju » Tue Sep 08, 2015 11:46 pm

Tohosaurus wrote: I'm sure that's a possibility, but like I said that basic concept was something I could easily look past if the actual movie was good. And that IMO it was not. The simple aspect of writing for each of the 90s movies was inferior, and effects work is just not there.


Ha. I think I know what you mean. Is the same deal with some Tv shows, other movies, etc. When you first begin watching them at their 'earliest points' to later, you'll notice that something has 'changed'. Oneself cannot pinpoint (at least, not as normally) but you "feel" like something's off.

Same deal most likely here with GHIDORAH. For some examples:

1.- The cinematography changed.

2.- The picture turn to be more clearer (something that in the previous two were more, 'murky' and 'dark'. Not saying that is bad as I think that's in some level appealing to those two flicks, but it is noticeable).

3.- Effects are a little bit more 'outstanding and eye-catching', and if you add the last point even more so.

4.- The suits of the monsters go hand-hand with the last point adding the light. But at the same time, you notice some blemishes in them unlike in BIOLLANTE that it was so obscure that you
didn't pay attention to that as much.

5.- Like you said, the writting of the movies took another turn. Resorting for a more Sci-Fi/Fantasy feel (not saying that the last two didn't have those elements but, you know what I mean) unlike a
more grounded one of some others.

6.- Decisions of the directors that weren't as similar before.

Just to name a few. Not an expert in this kind of 'going deep' into these points like other members myself, but I feel like that's in a way, the gist of it. ;)
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tymon wrote:Man, it really makes me laugh when I remember that all this drama is centered around a fictional, giant atomic monster. Damn you, Godzilla!

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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Bubbazilla » Thu Sep 10, 2015 9:07 pm

See it, it's more than worth your time. The reinvention of King Ghidorah as as futuristic invader is awesome and results in the darkest portrayal of his power since 'Godzilla vs. Gigan'. A 9 out of ten.

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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby g2vd » Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:10 am

I find the destruction scenes with Ghidorah to be terrible, it's not all bad there are actually some really cool shots and I like the Ghidorah shadow they added in. it's just he's so hilariously slow the fact some scenes just have explosion effects photoshopped over them and sparks pop up everywhere as he's slowly flying through, rather than blowing apart from the wind generated by him flying past like Showa, the worst part is the bridge where the hell did those explosions come from they are terrible how would it explode like that and why is he so slow compared to his Showa counterpart.
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Re: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Giga Kaiju » Fri Sep 11, 2015 6:18 pm

Yeah. Moments like that weren't exactly the best. Looking all weird and wonky on a movie that is supposed to be having more budget put into it that the previous two installments.
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tymon wrote:Man, it really makes me laugh when I remember that all this drama is centered around a fictional, giant atomic monster. Damn you, Godzilla!

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Arbok » Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:26 pm

I thought this was the weakest of the Heisei films when I first saw it back in 1995. A lot of that stemmed from the really uneven special effects (some are good, some are awful) and the really out there plot that just didn't feel logical or that it was taking itself fully seriously. In retrospect, most of that was on account of this one following Godzilla vs. Biollante, my favorite in the franchise. Even though the same director did both, this is a huge departure from the former in tone. I was sad that the series took such a U turn following the two stellar 1980's entries which, in contrast to time travel and everything felt relatively more grounded and did take themselves more seriously for sure.

As the years have gone on, I have enjoyed it more and more as the original reasons for my disappointment have started to dissipate with more titles in the series. I still don't particularly love the film, but admire the risks they took with the King Ghidorah character, especially Mecha-King Ghidorah which felt slightly controversial at the time to literally hack the character up like that but has become such a popular concept now.

And yeah... seems that the old talkback thread, for whatever reason, is lost... so hijacked the topic title to make it match the new format.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)

Postby Giga Kaiju » Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:40 pm

The surprise of seeing MKG was surely a thing. When I first saw the movie, I didn't expect Ghidorah to change like that considering that in the movie itself, the characters they were just mentioning of 'reviving' or 'bringing him back' instead of 'Mecha-ing' him.
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tymon wrote:Man, it really makes me laugh when I remember that all this drama is centered around a fictional, giant atomic monster. Damn you, Godzilla!

Gawdziller wrote:Doesn't matter what's moot or not. We'll just move onto the next thing to skreeonk about, then tangent onto something unrelated and skreeonk about that, and get trollbaited back on topic so we can skreeonk some more. It's the circle of life.


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