Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Omegazilla » Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:07 pm

I'm not saying the movie WAS MADE to specifically cash in on Indiana Jones films, I meant that the scenes that were similar to Indiana Jones were there just as a cheap way to cash in on the popularity of the series at the time, perhaps lure in some Indiana Jones fans and get their attention so they might think there is more of this type of content in the movie. What I think the movie was specifically made to cash in on though are the titular monsters. Anyways, Toho always seemed to change some of the themes around to adapt to the times they were making the movies in, it just so happens Indiana Jones was popular at the time, so it was IJ's turn.

But even if it was, this series has a long history of borrowing from established box office hits. Just look at the first film, which started as such a ripoff of The Beast from 20,000 Fathoms that its working title was nearly the same.


I agree 100% on this. In fact many movies in a way started off as "ripoffs" but would become something original in of itself. Again I find it funny you mention Alien because that very series did the exact same thing. One of the staff (can't remember if it was writer, director etc) said he basically knocked off a bunch of sci-fi movies like The Thing. He said something like "I didn't steal Alien from anybody, but everybody." Just like Godzilla did with Kong and TBF2F. I am not saying "borrowing" from movies is always bad, but in this case it is as it really serves no point other than to capitalize on the fame of IJ. There are some exceptions where capitalizing on a trend or whatnot CAN ironically create something fresh and interesting, it's just that this movie was not of those exceptions. With all this said while I do stand by that I said this movie is the worst in the Heisei series it is far from the worst in the whole franchise and does have some entertaining scenes that can get you by on a boring day.

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Gothicserpent » Mon Feb 03, 2020 8:21 pm

The more I think about it, the final battle might be one of the best fights in the franchise.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Gigantis » Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:22 pm

I think this movies alright, but it is one of the lesser of the series. The enviromental message is really forced into the cranium and Mothra's fluffy design is honestly kinda distracting. Not to mention Godzilla has literally no reason to even be in this movie!

On the other hand, the effects are nice, the Cosmos are enjoyable and Battra is just edgy all over! But in a good way. :P
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby GojiDog » Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:28 am

The Indiana Jones references aren't a surprise as there is a history of American cinema influencing these films. James Bond clearly had an influence on Godzilla Vs. The Sea Monster, War of the Worlds clearly was an inspiration for The Mysterians, and just the year before this entry, Godzilla Vs. King Ghidorah obviously took inspiration from Terminator.

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Kaiju-King42 » Mon Feb 24, 2020 2:08 pm

GojiDog wrote:The Indiana Jones references aren't a surprise as there is a history of American cinema influencing these films. James Bond clearly had an influence on Godzilla Vs. The Sea Monster, War of the Worlds clearly was an inspiration for The Mysterians, and just the year before this entry, Godzilla Vs. King Ghidorah obviously took inspiration from Terminator.


Not to mention a certain 1953 Ray Harryhausen movie... :angel:
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Terasawa » Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:08 pm

GojiDog wrote:The Indiana Jones references aren't a surprise as there is a history of American cinema influencing these films. James Bond clearly had an influence on Godzilla Vs. The Sea Monster, War of the Worlds clearly was an inspiration for The Mysterians, and just the year before this entry, Godzilla Vs. King Ghidorah obviously took inspiration from Terminator.


I agree with you but I think the difference is that those references became much more overt in the Heisei era.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby GojiDog » Mon Feb 24, 2020 6:54 pm

Terasawa wrote:
GojiDog wrote:The Indiana Jones references aren't a surprise as there is a history of American cinema influencing these films. James Bond clearly had an influence on Godzilla Vs. The Sea Monster, War of the Worlds clearly was an inspiration for The Mysterians, and just the year before this entry, Godzilla Vs. King Ghidorah obviously took inspiration from Terminator.


I agree with you but I think the difference is that those references became much more overt in the Heisei era.


That's true, and the Indy stuff in GVM is alot more obvious than most of the others, probably the most obvious.

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Terasawa » Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:10 pm

GojiDog wrote:
Terasawa wrote:
GojiDog wrote:The Indiana Jones references aren't a surprise as there is a history of American cinema influencing these films. James Bond clearly had an influence on Godzilla Vs. The Sea Monster, War of the Worlds clearly was an inspiration for The Mysterians, and just the year before this entry, Godzilla Vs. King Ghidorah obviously took inspiration from Terminator.


I agree with you but I think the difference is that those references became much more overt in the Heisei era.


That's true, and the Indy stuff in GVM is alot more obvious than most of the others, probably the most obvious.


Probably, yeah. But it's also pretty innocuous. There are two blatant Indiana Jones "homages" in Godzilla vs. Mothra: the opening temple sequence and the suspension bridge's collapse. Both happen relatively early in the film and have very little effect on the narrative. Takuya, as a character, isn't all that much like the Indiana Jones character.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby SuperPawnageGigan » Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:22 am

The made mothra fluffy and cute. I like it but the prop is stiff.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby ReiwaGodzilla » Thu Feb 27, 2020 6:30 am

SuperPawnageGigan wrote:The made mothra fluffy and cute. I like it but the prop is stiff.

Is this Mothra the most popular Mothra design out there? If so, the choices behind the design must have worked pretty well commercially.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Living Corpse » Thu Feb 27, 2020 12:00 pm

Gothicserpent wrote:The more I think about it, the final battle might be one of the best fights in the franchise.


Personally I think the fight between Battra's caterpillar form and Godzilla is one of the best fights. Once we go underwater it's a nice mix of both tooth & claw and energy attacks. Godzilla picking up up Battra by the tail and slamming him into an underwater volcano accidentally causing an eruption where they both get swallowed under the crust is so epic (in both sense of the word) it's burned into my mind.

For all it's faults, this movie had one of the best fights that wasn't purely just a beam spam match.

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ReiwaGodzilla wrote:
SuperPawnageGigan wrote:The made mothra fluffy and cute. I like it but the prop is stiff.

Is this Mothra the most popular Mothra design out there? If so, the choices behind the design must have worked pretty well commercially.


Yeah as a kid I didn't really notice but as an adult, it's kind of embarrassing to realize the Showa versions were so much more life like in their movement, it's like what happened in the 90s? Thank god the Millennium series didn't have this problem, moves life like in those films.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby VoyagerGoji » Sat May 23, 2020 7:01 pm

I just watched the film for the first time in full, and I was surprised it wasn’t garbage like SpaceG. I liked Godzilla in this film and despite being nearly lifeless, Mothra Imago was pretty good too.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Sun May 24, 2020 4:11 am

I coincidentally just watched this too. I like all the destruction scenes for the most part, but damn I think this is when the Heisei series shits the bed and gets bad. The film wants to be too many things, and has no idea how to balance it, little of it ties together and makes sense. If protecting the earth is an issue, why is the catalyst an outside source like a meteor? Why does Battra randomly not like and seek out to kill Godzilla? How does Godzilla tie in to or relate to Mt. Fuji? Mothra and Battra start out strong but both their secondary forms get quickly rushed and have little development. The fight is boring, minus the final part where Mothra and Battra begin to spam Godzilla and lift him up.

I like some of the things with the cast, including the divorced parents, and the company relations, but damn, does all of that get forgotten and thrown out the window the instant Godzilla comes from out of Mt. Fuji. The other films give good to great reasons for Godzilla being there, but damn...

-In Godzilla vs. Biollante, Biollante is a clone of Godzilla, and half the film is about Godzilla's return and preparing for it. The Super X2 and ANEB also tie directly into Godzilla
-In Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah, the aliens have a strong connection to Godzilla as tricking the humans is a way to gain power, trust and make a new weapon, plus Terasawa and Shindo have deep personal ties to Godzilla.
-In GVMG2, there's baby Godzilla, and MG is a machine designed to get rid of Godzilla.
-SG has SG, a clone
-Destroyah is a bit clunky, but a good chunk of the film revolves around Godzilla melting down, prepping for it, using Destroyah to kill Godzilla and Godzilla Junior.

In this, Godzilla feels horribly out of place in his own movie.

The final fight is excessive. Sure the fights in the previous fights may be shorter, but they have a lot more going on, and motivation between Godzilla and the monster they are fighting.
Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Sun May 24, 2020 4:14 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby HedorahIsBestGirl » Mon May 25, 2020 4:13 am

LSD Jellyfish wrote:I coincidentally just watched this too.

I think this is the Godzilla film I've gone the longest without watching; it's between this and Raids Again. I need to rewatch them both...

LSD Jellyfish wrote:Why does Battra randomly not like and seek out to kill Godzilla?

I think because Battra is the protector of the Earth and Godzilla, being a living source of radioactive waste, is a threat to the planet just like humanity is.

LSD Jellyfish wrote:The fight is boring, minus the final part where Mothra and Battra begin to spam Godzilla and lift him up.

Battra decking Godzilla with the ferris wheel is cool though. :g2k: :D

LSD Jellyfish wrote:In this, Godzilla feels horribly out of place in his own movie.

Let's be honest, this is a Mothra movie with Godzilla co-starring to sell tickets. Pretty sure she gets twice as much screentime. Hell, even Battra probably gets more.

LSD Jellyfish wrote:The final fight is excessive. Sure the fights in the previous fights may be shorter, but they have a lot more going on, and motivation between Godzilla and the monster they are fighting.

Meh, the first fight in Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah is pretty weak in my opinion. The MKG and Biollante fights are better, though.
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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby LSD Jellyfish » Mon May 25, 2020 4:32 am

^I did like the Ferris wheel drop.

I don't think the film makes enough of a connection to connect Godzilla to atomic waste as a way to make parallels to Battra. At the same time, Godzilla emerges from Mt. Fuji, which can begin to erupt at any time (that's not something I don't fear constantly considering I can see it from my apartment...) And yeah, the film is better if viewed as a Mothra movie. I would say it's better than pretty much all of the Rebirth of Mothra films.

One thing that's interesting is the "Twelve Machines". The cosmos mention that there were "twelve machines" that humanity used, either to control nature, or something else. It's part of the reason why Battra showed up. I wonder if it was just throwaway dialogue or if that was meant to hint at something. Pretty cool.

Also, I normally don't like doing this, but the comic adaptation does something better. I'll post this at some other time, but some minor differences is how Battra evolves. In the manga, there's a car chase scene to rescue the Cosmos, and it leads to the discovery of Battra's corpse. Turns out Battra's adult form burst out of the back of the larva like a cicada. I really do think the way Battra transformed so suddenly was super lazy in the movie.
Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Mon May 25, 2020 4:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
_JNavs_ wrote:The MV is like cheap imitation crabmeat, it tastes good, but it isn't real, while Shin is kino peak Japanese performance.

Rodan95 wrote:The Shobijin are sat on by a fatass explorer and killed. Mothra is pissed and destroys Japan.

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Re: Talkback Thread #19: Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

Postby Terasawa » Mon May 25, 2020 7:33 am

HedorahIsBestGirl wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:The final fight is excessive. Sure the fights in the previous fights may be shorter, but they have a lot more going on, and motivation between Godzilla and the monster they are fighting.

Meh, the first fight in Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah is pretty weak in my opinion. The MKG and Biollante fights are better, though.


This really isn’t the thread for this discussion but... really? IMO the title match in GvKG is terrific and superior to the “two monsters stand on opposite sides of the same set and exchange lasers” MKG fight. In that same regard it’s superior to the two Biollante fights, although those are great anyway. Godzilla starts screen right, later attacks from screen left, and then finishes the fight from screen right again. It’s simple, but it aids the impression that Godzilla covers a lot of ground in the battle. The countryside location is also one of Kawakita’s best such natural sets; for example, compare it to his later MGII set, which looks far less expansive.

His crew also gives us some fantastic money shots, beginning with Ghidorah approaching Godzilla, as seen from behind the latter, and ending with Godzilla’s decapitation of Ghidorah. And while both monsters exchange their rays (which had never looked better at this point), they also exchange a lot of body blows. Godzilla lifting and slamming KG into the ground by his tail isn’t particularly realistic but it’s a nice callback to the ‘70s, when it was one of Godzilla’s signature fighting moves.

There’s also a lot going on in the story at the same time, making the requisite breaks in monster action all the more significant. The movie doesn’t stall during these scenes because the action is still fast paced and engaging. The battles in GvB and later in this film, against MKG, are instead intercut with reaction shots from the cast.

The one element of the MKG fight that’s arguably better, IMO, is the huge Shinjuku set. But I don’t think the filmmakers really take advantage of it: as tall as the buildings are, the monsters never advance or retreat, so all the action takes place within the same few city blocks.
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