Criterion streaming Godzilla films + Criterion Showa Box Set

[o.supreme]

There's actually not a drop in quality from previous releases ( except perhaps when compared to the 3 films released by Kraken on BRD). They are in deed the best they've ever looked in NA. However the issue is that compared with other films released in HD formats they don't look that great. The crtisism comes mostly from Toho's "cheap" film preservation process and their unwillingness to cooperate with entities who would be willing to put forth more effort and use more advanced technology make the films look better because in their eyes they would then look foolish.

[HajimeKudo]

I was wondering if the streamed classic G films have the same problems as the BDs, namely that most movies starting with Mothra vs Godzilla have differently colored lines near the bottom end of the frame each time one shot or scene switches to another one. See here:
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/screensh ... position=9

Has anybody noticed anything like this?

[mikelcho]

There's actually not a drop in quality from previous releases ( except perhaps when compared to the 3 films released by Kraken on BRD). They are in deed the best they've ever looked in NA. However the issue is that compared with other films released in HD formats they don't look that great. The crtisism comes mostly from Toho's "cheap" film preservation process and their unwillingness to cooperate with entities who would be willing to put forth more effort and use more advanced technology make the films look better because in their eyes they would then look foolish.

And IIRC, if there's one thing an Asian does not want to do, it's lose face.

[tbeasley]

And IIRC, if there's one thing an Asian does not want to do, it's lose face.

[mikelcho]

And IIRC, if there's one thing an Asian does not want to do, it's lose face.

Wait a minute - I always thought when an Asian was disgraced or embarrassed, it was said that he lost face.

Please tell me where I'm wrong here. Is this term not used anymore? If it's not, I'm sorry.

[MaxRebo320]

Wait a minute - I always thought when an Asian was disgraced or embarrassed, it was said that he lost face.

They don't lose face. They literally lose their face.

[LegendZilla]

Wait a minute - I always thought when an Asian was disgraced or embarrassed, it was said that he lost face.

They don't lose face. They literally lose their face.

What show is that a clip from?

[Crazy Jim Films]

I was wondering if the streamed classic G films have the same problems as the BDs, namely that most movies starting with Mothra vs Godzilla have differently colored lines near the bottom end of the frame each time one shot or scene switches to another one. See here:
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/screensh ... position=9

Has anybody noticed anything like this?

Yes, I first noticed this with the Media Blasters release of Megalon on DVD. I recall a great number of the ones that showed on cable right after Criterion acquired the rights did have this problem and I would assume they used the same materials/transfers.

[Terasawa]

Technically speaking it's not a problem. You're seeing the part of the frame where two shots were glued together in the negative during the editing process. It's a feature of the assembled film. And although it's likely they were never meant to be seen, they may or may not have been any time the film was loaded into the projector, depending on how the projectionist masked the image.

I don't know what the standards were at Toho or even in Japan, but the standards for anamorphic film projection in the U.S. are pretty well-documented. Consider exhibit #1 here:

The film displays the recommended aperture dimension with the checkerboard pattern... Outside the checkerboard pattern we see the full camera aperture with its rounded corners. The area between the camera aperture and the extremities of the projector aperture is not intended for important information. Nothing in that area will be seen. The sides of the camera aperture will be covered with magnetic stripes. The top and bottom of the aperture are protected because negative splices would be visible if the full height of the camera aperture was to be used. The fine checkerboard pattern identifies the MAXIMUM amount of image that can be used on a motion picture screen.

Although the image and description depict a frame of 70mm alignment film, the same principal is basically true for 35mm anamorphic film (the format in which every Godzilla movie from 1962 to 1975 was shot). In short, an individual frame on a print, negative, or physical film element will show more image than is meant to be seen through a projector. Filmmakers knew this and took advantage of it, too: as noted, negative splices were hidden below the projected area. And although I'm not sure of any specific examples, something like a boom mike that floats into the top of a shot could have been masked out as long as it didn't venture into the projection area.

Generally speaking, any 35mm print of the anamorphic Godzillas will have visible splices at the bottom of the last frame of every edit point. This is simply the nature of 35mm film. Some home video and TV transfers and telecines obscure or crop the splices out by recording less image than the full aperture 35mm frame. Where Toho's HiVision transfers are concerned, the splices are visible because the telecine machine was evidently set up to record every millimeter of film possible. Other telecines have had the splices in frame while others have not. It's not anything new: check out these two consecutive frames from a 16mm print of Godzilla vs the Thing (source: Siren Visual DVD, 2003).



Speaking of Mothra vs. Godzilla, I believe the Toho Blu-ray features a modified transfer of the film where the transfer was reframed to remove the splices or they were digitally painted out. The version that Criterion released is apparently the original, undoctored telecine.

In my opinion, the HiVision transfers show too much of the frame, although without documentation on how to project Tohoscope films it's arguably up to interpretation as to what is "too much".

[canofhumdingers]

From what I understand, the splices were digitally painted out on some of the Toho BDs (such as Mothra vs Godzilla). I agree that it looks like they scanned the whole image (which is a good thing) but then failed to bother suitably matting/cropping the image for proper presentation. Another obvious example is how you can see the top of the background matte painting and part of the studio ceiling in some shots of Son of Godzilla. The improper matting of the image is just one more thing to add to the massive list of lazy flaws inherent in the Hi-vision transfers that criterion was hamstrung with.

[Tamura]

While these transfers probably show too much image, they don't show the "whole" image in its strictest definition, i.e. the entire camera aperture. You virtually never see the entire camera aperture on video. Even this area can vary within the same film if multiple cameras with different apertures were used - Tsuburaya, Arikawa and Nakano's units obviously had their own cameras chosen specifically to meet the needs and demands of special effects photography. So the shape and size of the image area on the negative likely varies by a minuscule amount throughout each film (nothing we were supposed to see when the whole film is properly masked and projected with the same scale throughout), but there's no way to see this even in Toho's overly generous framings.

[Godsteigman]

I hope a Kaiju set with the non-Godzilla films comes sooner than later. There hasnt been any news about it as far as I can tell. Im looking forward to it whenever it happens

[Lecontinentperdu]

^^This. To be honest, I would have preferred some "toho tokusatsu" box-sets by decades. Big G is great, but there is no "showa godzilla serie" to me. in my mind, Rodan, Varan, Mothra, Atragon, even Matango, are all on the same (stylised) boat.

[Major sssspielberg!]

^^This. To be honest, I would have preferred some "toho tokusatsu" box-sets by decades. Big G is great, but there is no "showa godzilla serie" to me. in my mind, Rodan, Varan, Mothra, Atragon, even Matango, are all on the same (stylised) boat.

At least Rodan and Gargantuas, which they got the rights to if I'm not mistaken.
I wonder if they're gonna get an Eclipse release like the Shochiku horror set.

[Chrispy_G]

I certainly would have liked the idea of, in lieu of a Box Set with such time/money/content/presentation limitations....if the catalog were handled a bit more piecemeal. 2 Disc/2 Film sets, covering every Godzilla and Kaiju Showa film Criterion had at the time, released monthly or bi-monthly or something....all with their own accompanying essays, commentary, etc....as many cases of 'Multiple version/Dub options' included as possible...as consistent of a presentation across all of the films as possible.

Godzilla and Raids Again as a black&white double feature
Rodan and Mothra(assuming Criterion could get it)
King Kong vs Godzilla and Mothra vs Godzilla as a double feature of the 'Other monster names come first' movies
Ghidorah and Astro-Monster double feature
Ebirah and Son as the sort of 'island adventure'
Maybe Destroy All Monsters is a stand-alone or included as a triple feature with 2 of the other entries
All Monsters Attack and Hedorah as the sort of 'oddball entries'
Gigan and Megalon as the 'Gigan Double Feature'
MechaG and TOM as the obvious double-feature they are

I don't know....could have been really fun to spread it all across 8-9 volumes

They could even "share" the Spine 1000 title....it would be a way for Criterion to make that Spine really special, some sort of "multi release event". What we ended up with feels a bit more like a publicity stunt where the #1000 hype was combined with overall Godzilla hype to sort of overshadow and prop up a not-so-amazing release.

Ugh....I'll just keep crossing my fingers that Criterion pushed out the current version of the set under the hope/ambition that a few years down the road they will be able to revisit and 'upgrade' it significantly with a future release. 70th anniversary, 70th anniversary....

[tbeasley]

Barnes & Noble is having its 50% off Criterion summer sale, so pick up the set if you haven't already -
https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/dvd-cr ... 5515236416

[Bardo117]

Any plans of releasing a Heisei Box set of similar construction and competence ?

[goji1986]

Any plans of releasing a Heisei Box set of similar construction and competence ?

No.

[UltramanGoji]

Any plans of releasing a Heisei Box set of similar construction and competence ?

Not a snowball’s chance in hell.

[Angilasman]

A Heisei set seems like something that could happen from some distributor once all of Sony's rights expire. Haven't King Ghidorah and Mothra gone out of print?