Aspect Ratio of Toho Films - More Complicated Than It Looks

[Qaenos]

I have the official Japanese Blu-rays of War of the Gargantuas and Ghidorah The Three Headed Monster. I measured the aspect ratio of the pictures myself and they are pretty much exactly 2.35 to 1, which was the Cinemascope standard at the time. So far, so good.

In the late 1960s and 1970s, however, standards started to get weird. According to Wikipedia, Panavision became popular in the late 1960s and sometime around 1970, the "standard" theatrical aspect ratio went from 2.35 to 2.39 for various reasons that you can read about on Wikipedia if you're interested. There were other aspect ratios as well, (such as the 1.85 ratio that was popular in the 1980s and 1990s) but most of these weren't around or popular in America (or Japan) in the late 1960s and 1970s.

Originally I assumed that the Toho films of the 1970s were all filmed in Panavision, at an aspect ratio of 2.39. I grabbed a screenshot of the Sony Godzilla vs Mechagodzilla (1974) DVD Region 1 release from the review on this site (Toho Kingdom). I then compared it to the screenshot I took of my Australian Madman Region 4 release of the same film. Below are both images, resized to the same height, and placed one on top of another, for easier comparison. The Australian R4 release is on top, the Sony on the bottom.



Ignore the differences in clarity and color for now and focus on the aspect ratio. As can be clearly seen, the Madman release shows more "picture" than the Sony version. The Sony version looks like it was cropped a bit on both the right and left of the film. In addition to "cropping", I'm also wondering about image distortion. What I mean by that, is the Sony could have taken a 2.XX original image and not only cropped it, but distorted it as well. Or, the Australia company could have distorted their image, or both. It's difficult to get an exact resolution, but the Sony version appears to be about a 2.33 ratio, while the Madman release is about a 2.58. It looks like the GvMG DVD is (or was) supposed to be 2.35, but errors in the mastering, the image taken for the review, my cutting and pasting etc could have altered it to 2.33 instead. The 2.58 of the Australian is just too wide to be Cinemascope / Panavision, even when all of these little errors are considered.

I've also taken a look at some other Region 2 and Region 4 DVDs that I have of Toho films from the 1970s, and a lot of them seem to be significantly wider than 2.35/2.39 ratio I was expecting. At first, I thought they were mastered wrong or image at the top and bottom was cropped to give the wider ratio, but now I am starting to wonder.

So here's the first part of my analysis. Let's examine Godzilla vs Megalon and compare the recently released Region 1 with the Madman Region 4.


Madman Region 4 Godzilla vs Megalon PAL

Media Blaster's Region 1 Godzilla vs Megalon NTSC

From these two screenshots, we can see the following:

1) The aspect ratio of the R1 release is 2.34 : 1 whereas the aspect ratio of the R4 release is 2.52 : 1.

2) The R1 release shows more information than the R4.

From this, it seems obvious that the R4 is cropped in vertical resolution which explains for both points 1) and 2).

Now, the next question is, should G vs Megalon be 2.35 : 1 or 2.39 : 1? How does one know if the image was originally 2.39 : 1 but "stretched" to 2.35 : 1 for the transfer? One way to do this would be to measure the Toho logo at the beginning of the film, with that of the PAL release as well as an official Toho Blu-ray. I measured the height / width ratio of the Toho logo on War of the Gargantuas Blu-ray and found it to be ~1.065. Then I measured the logo of the R1 and R2 releases of G vs Megalon.


Madman Region 4 Godzilla vs Megalon PAL


Media Blaster's Region 1 Godzilla vs Megalon NTSC

If Godzilla vs Megalon was supposed to be 2.39 and stretched to 2.35, we would expect the logo ratio to be squeezed by the same amount, from 1.065 to 1.083. However, this is not the case. This suggests that Godzilla vs Megalon is in it's original ratio on the R1 and that ratio is 2.35 : 1.

So it looks like the Madman release showed more than the R1 for G vs MechaG '74, but less for G vs Megalon. So far so good, right? Yes, but things will start to get more interesting when I analyze more Toho films on DVD where image distortion issues start to arise.

Stay tuned.

[gvamp]

Could it be possible the reason for the different aspect ratios is because one is PAL and the other is NTSC?

[Qaenos]

Could it be possible the reason for the different aspect ratios is because one is PAL and the other is NTSC?

Unfortunately, no. The aspect ratio is unaffected by PAL vs NTSC. Framerate (NTSC = 23.976/29.97 fps vs PAL 25 fps) and the vertical resolution (NTSC 480 vs PAL 576) of the stored/transmitted information is different, but aspect ratio (4:3, 16:9, etc) of the displayed image should be identical.

PAL DVDs have more information stored and therefore should have higher resolution than NTSC (assuming that the transfer was film to PAL instead of film to NTSC then to PAL), but actual aspect ratio of PAL should be identical to NTSC...unless someone screwed up the transfer or the mastering. While at first, it may seem that PAL's aspect ratio should be different if it has more pixels representing the vertical resolution but the same number of pixels representing the horizontal resolution, but the key is to understand that the pixels used to describe the image are not perfectly square. This means that a 704 pixels x 480 pixels NTSC image will describe a 4:3 image if the pixel width is 10 units long while it's height is 11 units long. Similarly, a 704 x 576 PAL disc will describe the same 4:3 content if the pixels have a 12:11 ratio.

The difference between 704 and 720 in the resolutions for both PAL and NTSC is basically just some buffer that was used to allow for some overscan on old CRT analog tvs. But if you work out the math, horizontal resolution for all PAL and NTSC videos should be 704, whether they are standard 4:3 images or anamorphic. Sometimes, they author the discs including the overscan, i.e. at 720x480 instead of 704x480 and this can alter the aspect ratio slightly (by making it wider than it should be). However, in both of these images, they don't do that because neither of the images extend horizontally all the way to the sides. There is some buffer there.

[Goji]

You'll want to switch all of the MEGALON images. The top image (for both the the one with Goro, and the one of the logo) are clearly the Madman release, evident by the washed out look.

[Space Hunter M]

Yeah, Toho just opened up the negative's/IN's frame on Mechagodzilla for some reason. You're never supposed to see that much projected in a theater. Also, the 2.35/2.39 approximation is something most people don't follow. 2.35:1 is usually the catch all ratio for all pre-Super 35 anamorphic stuff.

[Qaenos]

You'll want to switch all of the MEGALON images. The top image (for both the the one with Goro, and the one of the logo) are clearly the Madman release, evident by the washed out look.

Yep, just fixed that, thanks. The original post is now edited with the right labels.

Ok, on to the analysis of Godzilla vs Hedorah. Unfortunately, I only have the Madman R4 release to analyze, but it yields some very interesting results. There's the Japanese trailer, as well as the Japanese main film on the disc. Taking a look at the trailer, and checking the logo screen, we get the following:



Note that the AR of the picture is 2.39:1 and the logo ratio is ~ 1.065, so everything looks good! Now let's take a look at the main film.



Ok, here we have a problem. The logo is distorted implying that the film was transferred incorrectly. So we need to correct the AR so that the logo is ~1.065. Readjusting we get the following:



Great! The picture has been adjusted so that the logo is right, but this leaves the AR at ~2.49 : 1 which is wider than the 2.39 : 1 of the trailer. What gives? Well, let's look at a scene a little deeper into the movie. First, from the trailer:



Ok, now from the main film:


Clearly the trailer footage has been cropped (or matted) down to 2.39 from something wider. The Madman release clearly shows more than the trailer, which begs the question - is the film supposed to be 2.39 : 1, or something wider?

So what do we know so far?

1) Madman R4 of Godzilla vs Mechagodzilla has a AR > 2.39 which seems to be correct (at least it shows more than the Sony release which is ~2.35).
2) Madman R4 of Godzilla vs Megalon has a AR > 2.39 but it's cropped. The R1 release of 2.39 seems to be correct.
3) Madman R4 of Godzilla vs Hedoram has a AR > 2.39 which seems to be better (based on comparison with the Japanese trailer at 2.39)
4) DVDs (at least Madman DVDs) are not always encoded properly. What I mean by this, is that the DVD images are distorted in x/y ratio which can be seen when we measure the Toho logo in terms of the width/height ratio.

Ok, on to Ebirah. First up, let's look at the logo screen for the Madman R4 trailer and the Sony R1 main film.



Notice that the logo ratio of the Sony R1 is not the 1.065 we are expecting, but they are also using a different (English) title screen than the normal Japanese one we are used to. Although we might suspect that this logo is stretched, the overall print as it's presented on this DVD is in a ~2.35 : 1 AR, so we'll assume it's correct for the moment. Now let's take a look at the Madman R4 trailer.



The Madman R4 trailer, however, clearly has some problems. The logo ratio is 1.104, so the overall AR of this print (2.54 : 1) is distorted. Correcting the AR gives the following:



which is about an AR of ~2.45 : 1.

Ok. So now we have a 2.35 image from Sony and a 2.45 image (after correction) from the Madman trailer. Two questions remain:

1) Was I right to correct the aspect ratio of the Madman using the Toho logo as a basis?
2) Which ratio is correct?

To answer these questions, let's look a little deeper into film. Here's a good scene from the Sony DVD:



Now, that same scene is also in the trailer as shown below:



Clearly, the trailer at 2.45:1 shows more picture than the Sony DVD at 2.35:1, suggesting that the 2.35 print was "cropped" or matted. Now to verify this and also answer the second question, I measured out a box (shown in pink) from the Madman trailer scene, of what is being shown on the Sony 2.35:1 print. Once I measured it, it was ~2.36 : 1, well within the tolerance of all the processing and measurements being used so far.

Based on what I have observed from the Megalon, Hedorah and Ebirah analysis here are my conclusions:

1) Not all widescreen transfers are equal in terms of aspect ratio and the total image area being presented.

2) Just because a picture is in the 2.35 or 2.39 aspect ratio, it doesn't mean that it's the complete picture (see the Mechagodzilla example). It may mean that it's the original theatrical print, possibly, but it doesn't necessarily mean that there isn't a cut out there that exposes more scene than the 2.35 : 1 print exposes. Whether or not that's something you prefer, is a matter of your taste.

3) At least some transfers, (Madman in particular) have distorted aspect ratios, meaning people will look slightly shorter and fatter, or slightly taller and skinnier, than they actually should.

[Tamura]

It's not too complicated really. All of Toho's Godzilla movies from 1962 to 1975 are 2.35:1 (possibly 2.39:1 for the 70's entries). The aspect ratios of the home video releases are not good indicators of how the movies would look when viewed in properly projected original prints. Toho Video's 2.50-something releases are wrong, by definition; an image that wide isn't even the same aspect ratio anymore. And in film, overcropping is definitely a bad thing, but way more picture isn't better either. Sure, some of Sony's releases are probably zoomed in more than they should be, I can agree with that, but the Toho Videos show more than what audiences would have seen. What these movies need more than anything is competent preservation masters of the Japanese, US and international versions in 2K or 4K or something, with better digital grading and framing, and smaller doses of DNR. I'd patiently wait 10 years for something that monumental rather than have a single company acquire the rights to all 28 films and then proceed to cheaply port every Japanese DVD.

[MustafaDaisenso]

I definitely agree with Tamura on this one. The porting of the Japanese prints, while perhaps the wet dream of those who want to "original japoneese vershion" (in every sense of the word), I gotta say that many of Toho's prints are severely lacking. These films deserve a greater degree of recognition, and perhaps if the new Godzilla movie is a hit with moviegoers and critics, then perhaps the Showa films will pique the interest that would earn them a quality restoration.

That being said, I watched some videos showing HD remasters of the Showa films on youtube, and comparing screenshots from GTTHM (the Classic Media print, which has lots of discoloring and noticeable damage, and Toho's HD remastered print) the Toho print actually looked superior. I couldn't detect a lot of softness in the image, even at full quality and in fullscreen.

Even the HD print of King Kong vs Godzilla was a massive improvement over the awful DVD that Toho put out in the early 2000's, as the colors looked normal and the print was quite clear.

[Goji]

and comparing screenshots from GTTHM (the Classic Media print, which has lots of discoloring and noticeable damage, and Toho's HD remastered print) the Toho print actually looked superior. I couldn't detect a lot of softness in the image, even at full quality and in fullscreen.

The source that CM used was actually Toho's R2 release, meaning it's identical to the Toho DVD. I've heard the HD remaster was an improvement, but nothing to rave about.

Even the HD print of King Kong vs Godzilla was a massive improvement over the awful DVD that Toho put out in the early 2000's, as the colors looked normal and the print was quite clear.

The Japanese version has been horribly preserved, but that's really an entirely different discussion; one that's been covered a lot here in the past. (If I can dig up some of the topics, I can post them here if you're interested). Universal created a new master of the John Beck version for the 2005 DVD release, which explains why it looked so nice.

[cmdmstudios]

I do wonder if we may have better luck at understanding the true aspect ratios from Criterion's recent remasters? I think it would of great help (provided they were able to work from the original film like they were with the 54 film).

[UltramanGoji]

I do wonder if we may have better luck at understanding the true aspect ratios from Criterion's recent remasters? I think it would of great help (provided they were able to work from the original film like they were with the 54 film).

I can't imagine Criterion would willingly not correct the ratios for their releases.

But that said, is the Criterion version of 54/KOTM the correct ratio?

[Terasawa]

I do wonder if we may have better luck at understanding the true aspect ratios from Criterion's recent remasters? I think it would of great help (provided they were able to work from the original film like they were with the 54 film).

1. The only film Criterion has remastered is Godzilla (1954). The Filmstruck versions are Toho's work.

2. Technically, Criterion couldn't work with the original negative for G54 since it no longer exists.

[Goji]

What the hell? Had no idea the Filmstruck version was Toho's '08 master. (I didn't even bother checking). Weird.

[Great Hierophant]

But that said, is the Criterion version of 54/KOTM the correct ratio?

Criterion uses a 4:3 aspect ratio (1.375 canonical OAR) on both Godzilla and Godzilla KOTM. KOTM would have in most theaters probably have been projected in "widescreen" using a mask on the projection lens blocking the top and bottom of the 4:3 frame to project a 1.85:1 image.

[Space Hunter M]

KOTM's end credits were composed for 1.375, but yeah, it was probably shown matted since by '56 most first run theaters abandoned Academy.