Outliers Discussion Thread

Discuss and analyze various feats!
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ZillaJr-KaijuKing
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Re: Outliers Discussion Thread

Postby ZillaJr-KaijuKing » Tue Oct 13, 2015 7:31 pm

^Well, in case anyone's wondering, this took place in ScrewAttack Forums -> DEATH BATTLE -> DEATH BATTLE Calculations Thread, pgs. 97 (very last comment) to 102.

I have to admit I don't like the idea of Godzilla kaiju being Town Level. That seems too underwhelming. I expected them to be City Level. Funny enough, there are two separate calcs in the VS Battles Wiki implying that Showa Godzilla is Island Level.

The VS Battles Wiki takes the Area of Effect =/= Power Level argument to heart, and to be fair this does seem to happen a lot in fiction. It would be awfully difficult to convince them to downgrade anything.

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alienhulk2099
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Re: Outliers Discussion Thread

Postby alienhulk2099 » Tue Oct 13, 2015 9:06 pm

How did Kumonga gain speed after Godzilla threw him?

Godzilla swirled him around so hard it entrapped all the air nearby in a whirlwind and the area Kumonga went had no air thus no air resistance thus he sped up.
How much heat did Gamera and Gipsy Danger experience?

I'm going with 1800 degrees Fahrenheit for 500 dollars.
How hot were HB Godzilla's lasers in order to melt concrete?

I'll take 3000 Celsius and post this:



I'm amazed that is the feat problem you had with HB Godzilla and not the one where he goes from the Pacific to Antarctica and back in what would barely be an hour. Or the one with the giant ice planet whose gravity was messing with the planet to the point of throwing the Giza Sphinx.
You can say something is impressive all you want.

Kamen Rider Ichigo and Nigo can both tank a nuke at least as strong at the atomic bomb point blank and come out without even radiation poisoning, but someone like Kamen Rider Sango or Decade can beat them up with a few melee attacks. Somehow Decade can take out opponents like Kamen Rider J, but 15 can easily take him out. Technically this makes Kamen Rider 15 capable of busting kaiju skulls (to be fair the first seven and eight Kamen Riders have fought kaiju and one so for riders that isn't saying a lot; on the other hand the Great Leader isn't much of a kaiju to begin with so it swings both ways). Kamen Rider Kuuga's kicks can form explosions that go on for over two kilometers, but at best they only shatter windows. I'll even mention the time Kamen Rider Wizard kicked a monster into the sun faster than the speed of light! Final Wars debacles are nothing compared to Kamen Rider! :P

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Inferno Rodan
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Re: Outliers Discussion Thread

Postby Inferno Rodan » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:10 pm

Gerdzerl wrote:Oh lawdy, when IR sees those pages....

Image

Already seen them. Just rolled my eyes and left.


alienhulk2099 wrote:Godzilla swirled him around so hard it entrapped all the air nearby in a whirlwind and the area Kumonga went had no air thus no air resistance thus he sped up.

No only does that make precisely zero sense, but it also goes against what was shown on screen.

I'm going with 1800 degrees Fahrenheit for 500 dollars.

Prove it.

I'll take 3000 Celsius and post this:


Dude. I already explained that poop to you years ago on KP. That's not the concrete that's being melted. It's molten iron from the thermal lance. All you're proving by posting that is that you have no idea how a thermal lance works. Much like how the writers of HB Godzilla had no idea how concrete works, or the writers of G:GotU and PR had no idea how ram pressure works. Funny parallel there, huh?

I'm amazed that is the feat problem you had with HB Godzilla and not the one where he goes from the Pacific to Antarctica and back in what would barely be an hour. Or the one with the giant ice planet whose gravity was messing with the planet to the point of throwing the Giza Sphinx.

Unlike you, AH, I don't have a ridiculous fetish for making absurdly long lists that no one will read. I just provided a handful of examples to make my point, as any reasonable person would do.

inb4 you take my usage of "fetish" the wrong way and think I'm implying you're sexually aroused by those lists you make

Kamen Rider Ichigo and Nigo can both tank a nuke at least as strong at the atomic bomb point blank and come out without even radiation poisoning, but someone like Kamen Rider Sango or Decade can beat them up with a few melee attacks. Somehow Decade can take out opponents like Kamen Rider J, but 15 can easily take him out. Technically this makes Kamen Rider 15 capable of busting kaiju skulls (to be fair the first seven and eight Kamen Riders have fought kaiju and one so for riders that isn't saying a lot; on the other hand the Great Leader isn't much of a kaiju to begin with so it swings both ways). Kamen Rider Kuuga's kicks can form explosions that go on for over two kilometers, but at best they only shatter windows. I'll even mention the time Kamen Rider Wizard kicked a monster into the sun faster than the speed of light! Final Wars debacles are nothing compared to Kamen Rider! :P

That's... uhh... nice? I don't see how it's in any way relevant to the discussion though.
"The rantings of an upjumped zealot make for tedious listening." - Grigori, Dragon's Dogma

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alienhulk2099
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Re: Outliers Discussion Thread

Postby alienhulk2099 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:22 pm

That's... uhh... nice? I don't see how it's in any way relevant to the discussion though.

The point of that was to point out that excluding a feat just for looking improbable is silly when you look at the medium overall when far more improbable things happen all the time. I think it's a bit of a double standard.
Funny parallel there, huh?

Whoops, sorry about that.

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Gallavant123
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Re: Outliers Discussion Thread

Postby Gallavant123 » Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:04 am

Gerdzerl wrote:http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/ssb ... 0712002934

Believe me, I'd kill for Heisei Godzilla (or hell, any Godzilla incarnation in general) to be legitimately Planet Level or Solar System Level but he just isn't. Someone needs to set VS Battles straight, because I can guarantee you anyone in their right mind who's actually paid attention to what the character has consistently displayed in terms of feats would never place any incarnation of Godzilla any higher than low end Town Level.


I apologize if this is considered a necro, but there's not that many threads in this section to begin with

While that place does have major problems under any power system viewpoint its not just VSBattles and the Wikia places. It's practically all the more known.. less fandom oriented VS sites. The late Moviecodec Lounge, its spiritual successor Take5, Narutoforums/OutskirtsBattleDome, SpaceBattles (much less so), the Whiskey Media duo (Animevice and Comicvine).. etc.. they all ironically have a generally higher view of Godzilla's power than this place does.

I agree that the blackhole/supernova stuff is too vague and inconsistent to be legitimate. But the power measuring system present on many of those sites is practically in a parallel universe compared to this one's. While there's other differences that I've noticed, the main thing is that the amount of feats that would be considered "outlier" on this site is 1000% higher.

"Average showing" isn't something you'd hear that much. With concepts like attack potency and powerscaling being prevalent, what is consistently "displayed" has become irrelevant. Its less proving something consistent and more.. having to prove something is inconsistent. Even the most textbook example of an outlier known over there, Master Roshi destroying the Moon, required canonical lore to debunk the feat, the fact that the strongest attack of the character who defeated him was only "comparable to a nuclear bomb" in power. Not just that it was "displayed" as being.

Its pretty much an apples and oranges way of looking at things that has little to do with how much someone knows of a certain fictional verse or character.
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LamangoKaijura
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Re: Outliers Discussion Thread

Postby LamangoKaijura » Thu Feb 25, 2016 12:43 am

When the skreeonk did we start judging Kaiju with DBZ Naruto InuYasha BS busting skills?
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Inferno Rodan
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Re: Outliers Discussion Thread

Postby Inferno Rodan » Sat Feb 27, 2016 3:43 pm

Gallavant123 wrote:"Average showing" isn't something you'd hear that much. With concepts like attack potency and powerscaling being prevalent, what is consistently "displayed" has become irrelevant. Its less proving something consistent and more.. having to prove something is inconsistent. Even the most textbook example of an outlier known over there, Master Roshi destroying the Moon, required canonical lore to debunk the feat, the fact that the strongest attack of the character who defeated him was only "comparable to a nuclear bomb" in power. Not just that it was "displayed" as being.

That's silly.

Ultimately, in discussions over who would win in a fight it doesn't matter what a character is capable of doing. It's what they actually do in battle that matters. It doesn't matter if a character is capable or erasing things from existence with a mere thought if all they ever do when fighting is fart out cotton candy.

For example: There's a kaiju from Ultraman Max named Luganol. He blows up a planet at the start of the episode. But when he gets around to fighting Max, he never displays any sort of exceptional power, and certainly nothing planet-busting. So it's ridiculous to say that he'd win a fight by using that level of power.
"The rantings of an upjumped zealot make for tedious listening." - Grigori, Dragon's Dogma


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