Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Tue Aug 09, 2011 2:33 pm

shinmattiathekaiju wrote:
GotengoXGodzilla wrote:I feel differently about Destroy All Monsters than I have in the past. During the attack on Monster Island (after the Killaks had taken over), I found myself saying, "Could you please get to the good stuff already?" Then when the military was attacking Godzilla and Anguirus, I was saying the same thing.

Nowadays, I think Destroy All Monsters is very repetitive and becomes eye-rolling at a couple points. Some scenes serve no purpose other than to have an action scene, like the attack on Tokyo, and others just repeat what other scenes have already done, like the whole Fire Dragon thing at the end of the film. To be fair, the acting is decent and I enjoy most of the characters, but that's all that needs to be said about that. And, obviously, the fight against King Ghidorah is still amazing to watch. The problem, though, is that you have to sit through a lot of the same scenes to get to that moment of awesomeness. The question I was asking myself at the end was, "Was the monster fight worth the wait?"


So the monsters destroying the city wasn't enjoyable?

There's only so much you can do with monsters destroying a city. By the time you get to the attack on Tokyo, there's already been the scenes of monsters destroying major cities. By the time they get to the attack on Tokyo, it's become stale. They're shot fine and look great, but I'm just not that interested in it by the time we get to the attack on Tokyo.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Killswitch » Tue Aug 09, 2011 2:54 pm

NSZ wrote:
Shazam14 wrote:Still a 32 year old baby. xD


Considering we really don't know the full extent of either Godzillas' mutations in the Showa timeline, and with natural, gargantuan, prehistoric monsters like Varan, Manda, Baragon, and Rodan running around, and one of those monsters posessing a beam weapon of their own, it's quite possible that in the Showa timeline, the Godzillas only suffered radiation burns from our atomic tests. So maybe with Minilla's egg being so close to the surface, unlike the Godzillas who were in the dark depths of the ocean at the time when the H-Bombs went off, the radiation from the failed test effected his future development as a growing individual.

And I'm sure the premature hatching by the Three Stooges didn't help any.


Minya = Gary Coleman. Not only in appearance, but maybe stunned growth too? LOL

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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Tue Aug 09, 2011 4:09 pm

Legion1979 wrote:
GotengoXGodzilla wrote:There's only so much you can do with monsters destroying a city. By the time you get to the attack on Tokyo, there's already been the scenes of monsters destroying major cities. By the time they get to the attack on Tokyo, it's become stale. They're shot fine and look great, but I'm just not that interested in it by the time we get to the attack on Tokyo.


What the bloody hell are you talking about? Yes, we see bits and pieces of the monsters attacking major cities, but all of it is tantalizingly brief. Maybe a minute total when combined. If that. The Tokyo attack gives us a really good, sustained city destruction sequence featuring multiple monsters (one of whom we've never seen in an environment like this) backed by a great Ifukube score. It's a major set-piece of the film.


They may be brief, but they're interesting, because we've never seen monsters like Rodan and Godzilla attack cities like Moscow and New York (when done by Toho, at least). They're the more exciting of the destruction scenes in the film, at least for me.

Sure, the attack on Tokyo has great music, but it's repetitive and gets old really fast. After a while, I just zone out and say, "Okay, they're attacking a city. I get it. Please keep the film moving."
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby MekaGojira3k » Tue Aug 09, 2011 4:49 pm

How can it get old? The shots of the kaiju attacking are, as mentioned, very brief. It all builds to the larger fight in Tokyo, as Tokyo is safe during the initial attacks and gets hit the hardest. If it takes that little to get old, you must have been board by the time you made it to your third or fourth Godzilla film.

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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Tohosaurus » Tue Aug 09, 2011 5:11 pm

GotengoXGodzilla wrote:I feel differently about Destroy All Monsters than I have in the past. During the attack on Monster Island (after the Killaks had taken over), I found myself saying, "Could you please get to the good stuff already?" Then when the military was attacking Godzilla and Anguirus, I was saying the same thing.

Nowadays, I think Destroy All Monsters is very repetitive and becomes eye-rolling at a couple points. Some scenes serve no purpose other than to have an action scene, like the attack on Tokyo, and others just repeat what other scenes have already done, like the whole Fire Dragon thing at the end of the film. To be fair, the acting is decent and I enjoy most of the characters, but that's all that needs to be said about that. And, obviously, the fight against King Ghidorah is still amazing to watch. The problem, though, is that you have to sit through a lot of the same scenes to get to that moment of awesomeness. The question I was asking myself at the end was, "Was the monster fight worth the wait?"

Pretty much. I haven't found the movie that fun to watch and is low in my personal Showa era rankings.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby GotengoXGodzilla » Tue Aug 09, 2011 5:24 pm

MekaGojira3k wrote:How can it get old? The shots of the kaiju attacking are, as mentioned, very brief. It all builds to the larger fight in Tokyo, as Tokyo is safe during the initial attacks and gets hit the hardest. If it takes that little to get old, you must have been board by the time you made it to your third or fourth Godzilla film.


It gets old, because by DAM, monsters destroying a city had been done to death. It might be because I thought the destruction of Tokyo went on WAY too long. If they had kept it shorter, I probably would have enjoyed it. But, I really don't care if the destruction was built up (It wasn't built up very well, either), because around the time Manda shows up, the scene has gone on long enough.

Usually, monster destruction is done very well in the Godzilla films, especially in Gojira, Mothra vs. Godzilla, Ghidrah, The Three-Headed Monster, Invasion Of The Astro-Monster, etc. I love the destruction in those films, but I don't like it here. While it's made very well, the scene really drags on for way too long and gets stale. Especially when there are already several other scenes in the film that do basically the same thing, like when the military attacks Godzilla and Anguirus. When there's already several scenes that do the same things, that makes other scenes pointless and boring.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Kubo » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:12 am

^ DAM was meant to be the big boom at the end of the Godzilla franchise (which obviously didn't happen, as AMA would be released the year after). They wanted to make this epic. Tons of military and destruction sequences were used to make this movie feel significantly more apocalyptic than its predecessors. That was the goal in mind. Personally, I think they executed this pretty well and did a good job of utilizing the military. Speaking of which, the missiles and stuff actually blow up the buildings when they miss. I can't recall any other Showa movie that has that... 8-) I'm not saying your wrong for not liking it; I'm just pointing out what it meant.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Hipster Thor » Thu Aug 11, 2011 2:57 pm

I actually think DAM is overrated. Everyone lauds the final battle, but its actually really short and one sided. Then the monsters take a back seat while the SY3 fights a UFO. Its rather anticlimactic . I wish there was more monster destruction in the film.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Kubo » Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:22 pm

Svitska Donkun wrote:I actually think DAM is overrated. Everyone lauds the final battle, but its actually really short and one sided. Then the monsters take a back seat while the SY3 fights a UFO. Its rather anticlimactic . I wish there was more monster destruction in the film.


Everything leading up to the last battle is what makes the movie for me. That final battle with the Moonshine--scuse me--Moonlight-SY3 destroyed anything the final battle had created. Besides, Ghidorah's constant cackling got really annoying. I definitely agree with you on the final battle part...everything else, well, not so much.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Hipster Thor » Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:26 pm

King Caesar wrote:
Svitska Donkun wrote:I actually think DAM is overrated. Everyone lauds the final battle, but its actually really short and one sided. Then the monsters take a back seat while the SY3 fights a UFO. Its rather anticlimactic . I wish there was more monster destruction in the film.


Everything leading up to the last battle is what makes the movie for me. That final battle with the Moonshine--scuse me--Moonlight-SY3 destroyed anything the final battle had created. Besides, Ghidorah's constant cackling got really annoying. I definitely agree with you on the final battle part...everything else, well, not so much.


Really, the highlight of the film is supposed to be the Tokyo destruction sequence...but its just REALLY poorly done and, like, the only one of its nature in the whole film. Which is inexcusable. They SHOULD have spent more time on the monsters destroying global cities, like the film advertises. All we got was Godzilla(shitty suit) in the water tank, breathing fire at one of the worst city sets Tsuburaya ever made, Imitation Baragon destroying a lesser french landmark with just his head coming out of the ground, and Rodan flying over Moscow.

I also had no idea that Mothra attacking Peking was the equivalent of ramming a toy train head on.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Kubo » Thu Aug 11, 2011 8:21 pm

So it's poorly done. Doesn't mean it can't be exciting if you can look past the minor, technical faults. I agree that global destruction scenes would have been cooler if they had been elaborated further upon, but the budget didn't allow for five or so sets to be made for a few minutes of screen time. They worked with what they had and did a pretty decent job with it IMO
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby DoctorMafune » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:47 pm

I think a lot of this has to do with when and where one first saw the film.

Seeing it first on the small screen (with Toho's awful international dub), after seeing films like 1993's Godzilla vs. MechaGodzilla, might leave some underwhelmed.

But seeing Destroy All Monsters first on the big screen, with AIP's excellent dub, in a large theater reverberating with Ifukubean brilliance and near-deafening monster roars, the way I had the good fortune to in 1969... meant being completely blown away. The sheer breadth of the spectacle is unlike anything ever produced to that point, and damn little, since. (DEFINITELY not Final Wars.) DAM's blend of monster action and sci-fi is unmatched.

And I simply do not agree at all that there is anything "poorly done" or "boring" about the Tokyo attack or the scenes of Godzilla and Angilas fighting the army. I have to wonder what anyone bored by those scenes gets out of kaiju movies, at all.

Toward the end, it might have been nice to have a scene where Ghidorah, panicking when he realizes what's happening, tries to escape, with Manda wrapping around his tails to prevent it, Kumonga and Mothra blinding him with webbing, and Baragon adding some magma-breath to the mix, to cut off KG's retreat. (Yeah, I know... there was some problem with the Baragon suit for awhile... getting it back from Tsuburaya Productions, perhaps?) Then again, this might have seemed like too much of a good thing... with nine monsters ganging up on him, even a villain like Ghidorah could seem sympathetic.

But otherwise, what's not to like?

This is still my second favorite film of all the Godzilla movies.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Hipster Thor » Fri Aug 12, 2011 3:19 am

King Caesar wrote:So it's poorly done. Doesn't mean it can't be exciting if you can look past the minor, technical faults. I agree that global destruction scenes would have been cooler if they had been elaborated further upon, but the budget didn't allow for five or so sets to be made for a few minutes of screen time. They worked with what they had and did a pretty decent job with it IMO


These two sentences contradict each other...

In any case, I'm of the opinion that if something is poorly done, it CAN impede your enjoyment of the film. Especially when the whole point of the movie, or so I thought, is Monsters destroying things. You'd think the majority of the budget would go towards that. The monster scenes need to be good in a film. because otherwise you have to lean on the human characters, and in this film, they're some of the worst.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Kubo » Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:49 am

Svitska Donkun wrote:
King Caesar wrote:So it's poorly done. Doesn't mean it can't be exciting if you can look past the minor, technical faults. I agree that global destruction scenes would have been cooler if they had been elaborated further upon, but the budget didn't allow for five or so sets to be made for a few minutes of screen time. They worked with what they had and did a pretty decent job with it IMO


These two sentences contradict each other...

Hush...i just realized that...ignore the first sentence then. -_-

In any case, I'm of the opinion that if something is poorly done, it CAN impede your enjoyment of the film. Especially when the whole point of the movie, or so I thought, is Monsters destroying things. You'd think the majority of the budget would go towards that. The monster scenes need to be good in a film. because otherwise you have to lean on the human characters, and in this film, they're some of the worst.


Funny, I actually was pretty hooked on the human plot. Maybe because I'm a huge Akira Kubo fan, or maybe because the plot was intriguing. I wanted to know what was going to happen with the humans.

Some of those shots taken in the city destruction ARE good though. I mentioned earlier that the military projectiles actually destroyed the buildings. The set that is used after the battle with the sun setting in the distance (which I don't believe is shown, but we know it's happening) is one of the most impressive in the whole Showa series. Gorosaurus (or Baragon) destroying the Arc de Triumph is also notable.

monster scenes need to be good in a film


And they were. If not good, they were average. I don't know what you were expecting really. It may not be a Godzilla, but it does hold its own in the series. Personally, it's my second favorite of the Showa age, behind Godzilla vs Gigan.


...and wasn't it you that told me to enjoy a movie for what it tried to do, rather than what it failed to do and not have expectations? :?
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Hipster Thor » Fri Aug 12, 2011 9:08 am

King Caesar wrote:...and wasn't it you that told me to enjoy a movie for what it tried to do, rather than what it failed to do and not have expectations? :?


I believe I said to consider it when reviewing the film, and determining whether is succeeded or not as a pro or con to the film. Extremely variable.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Kubo » Fri Aug 12, 2011 9:56 am

You wrote:First off, I know I've said strange things, but to take the genetically superior remark seriously? Idk...
Troll 2 is a wonderful film, and has recently been receiving cult status that hasn't been seen since Rocky Horror Picture Show debuted. Sure you can go ahead and call Troll 2 "bad" or "weird" but what would that accomplish? What are you proving by saying that? You are looking at it extremely one dimensionally in terms of its appeal. Don't ask what the movie does wrong, ask what the movie means in context to society and the effect it has. Look at it for what it is and judge it on that. Say its a bad movie and learn to enjoy it on that level.


So enjoy a movie regardless of it's degree if bad-ness? :?
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Hipster Thor » Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:50 am

King Caesar wrote:
You wrote:First off, I know I've said strange things, but to take the genetically superior remark seriously? Idk...
Troll 2 is a wonderful film, and has recently been receiving cult status that hasn't been seen since Rocky Horror Picture Show debuted. Sure you can go ahead and call Troll 2 "bad" or "weird" but what would that accomplish? What are you proving by saying that? You are looking at it extremely one dimensionally in terms of its appeal. Don't ask what the movie does wrong, ask what the movie means in context to society and the effect it has. Look at it for what it is and judge it on that. Say its a bad movie and learn to enjoy it on that level.


So enjoy a movie regardless of it's degree if bad-ness? :?



Well there's a difference between bad and boring. You're taking what I said way too literally and applying it to everything. The only way to enjoy Troll 2 is to get past that its a bad movie. The problem with DAM is that it has the makings for a good movie but ends up disappointing and being boring.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Kubo » Fri Aug 12, 2011 3:09 pm

But Svitska, what are you getting out of saying the movie was boring? What is being accomplished by you saying it's bad?

-_-
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby DoctorMafune » Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:19 pm

Being a newcomer to this forum, I'm wondering what the people panning Destroy All Monsters actually like about any of the other Godzilla movies.

So, if you're bored by DAM and consider it "poorly done," what Godzilla movies did you like, and what was, IYO, well done about them?

I'm not looking to shoot you down... just curious.

So far, these are the only possibilities I've thought of:

(1) Someone who reveres the original Gojira, but considers the rest of the series a regrettable offshoot. I don't agree, but I can understand that point of view.

(2) Someone who only likes the campy films, because they can't take any of the others seriously, either.

(3) Someone who grooved on the spectacular effects in films like 1993's Godzilla vs. MechaGodzilla and can't get into the effects scenes that 1960s budgets allowed.

Any other points of view? What am I missing, here?
Last edited by DoctorMafune on Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Talkback Thread #9: Destroy All Monsters (1968)

Postby Hipster Thor » Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:23 pm

King Caesar wrote:But Svitska, what are you getting out of saying the movie was boring? What is being accomplished by you saying it's bad?

-_-


Nothing really. Just how I feel. This is a talkback thread. lol.
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