MOGUERA v Gotengo v Mecha Ghidorah v Kiryu03

[Gojira1604]

MOGUERA; https://www.tohokingdom.com/kaiju/mogue ... i.htm#msrf
MKG; https://www.tohokingdom.com/kaiju/king_ ... isei.htm#m
KIRYU Type 2; https://www.tohokingdom.com/kaiju/kiryu.htm#03
Gotengo 2; https://www.tohokingdom.com/aliens_sdf/gotengo04.htm#n

Arena: Fukuoka
Mog & Kiryu are same height as Heisei Godzilla 90s, Gotengo and mecha King ghidorah are the same sizes as they were in their appearances.

I think Moguera would win in the end due to its nice combo of competent durability(which I think it trumps Kiryu and MKG in) & sheer firepower. Though I would put my bets on MOGUERA, I could see either Gotengo or Mecha King being possible victors. Would like to hear anyone else's thoughts>

[Ivo-goji]

Gotengo is the drill that will pierce the heavens.

It has the maneuverability and raw firepower to win here, and it's Absolute Zero Cannon trumps Kiryu's Hyper Maser.

[Zarm]

Have we ever had a confirmed that that was an Absolute Zero Cannon, I thought it was just referred to as a Maser... Perhaps a Freezing Maser?

I always got the impression it wasn't anywhere near as powerful as the AZC, and was only as effective as it was because they got Manda superheated first- the old 'rapidly heat it up and cool it down to make it shatter' trope. But I got more the impression that it was akin to the Godzilla versus Destroyah weaponry, and not powerful enough to actually kill a Kaiju in ordinary circumstances. It's hard to tell due to only a singular usage in the entire movie, but there were a number of situations where it seems like it would have been used if it was a One-Shot killer.

[Ivo-goji]

^The description in the profile on our website linked above says it freezes to absolute zero, ergo it is an Absolute Zero Cannon.

[Desghidorah]

My problem with the Gotengo taking this is while very resistant to the Xilian fighter craft's fire and sporting a huge gun, it gets knocked down easily. It only frozen Manda with a well lined up shot on a foe coming directly towards it with no return fire. Very powerful, but it think it needs to not get focused. Especially by three foes that can fly after it.

Not to mention MOGUERA's drill is bigger (lol)!

Honestly I'd actually put my bets on MOGUERA marginally. The thing's a friggin tank and put up with focus fire from SpaceGodzilla for an extended period of time, no small feat. It's not invincible, Kiryu would lay it out in close quarters, but in terms of raw firepower and durability, as well as respectable mobility I don't see the others keeping up. Kiryu and the Gotengo are both more fragile and Mecha-Ghidorah lacks mobility and firepower. Plus even if someone closed the distance, on a foe lacking regeneration I doubt any of MOGUERA's drills or spiral grenades fail to do massive damage.

[Ivo-goji]

I don't know about Gotengo being fragile. It was boring holes through the earth and into the Xilien mothership. It was able to recover from every beating it took fairly quickly and only went down after it had used up its energy to empower Godzilla.

Not to mention it can fight at range as well as evade attacks by burrowing under ground more effectively than it's opponents here. MOGUERA can give chase in the air, but doesn't have Gotengo's speed underground. Kiryu can only fly short distances and has no way to defend against attacks from below. Mecha King Ghidorah is pretty slow all around compared to the others. I can see the Gotengo simply dodging their attacks and taking them down one by one. Only MOGUERA can follow it underground, then it's just the two of them. Defeat MOGUERA, then only Mecha Kimg Ghidorah will be a problem in the air. Defeat him, and comes down to just Gotengo and Kiryu. Divide and conquer.

[Zarm]

I don't know about Gotengo being fragile. It was boring holes through the earth and into the Xilien mothership. It was able to recover from every beating it took fairly quickly and only went down after it had used up its energy to empower Godzilla.

To play devil's advocate- sure, Gotengo is strong when it leads with its drill; that's primarily its function. But if it takes hits other than head-on, it seems to have trouble. Part of the problem is that I feel like we only see it in extreme situations, though.

-We see it shot down at the start; but that's at the conclusion of a lengthy battle with Godzilla, so who knows what it's been through?

-It's damaged fighting Manda and down for repairs- again, after a battle of indeterminate circumstances, and a gauntlet of extreme heat.

-I was under the impression it basically crashed into the mothership, and was in ill-repair, so a few minutes dogfighting was enough to put in on the ropes (though that could be a mistaken impression on my part); later, it gives energy to Godzilla (but that was Ozaki's, as far as I could tell), but is then downed by Godzilla. So I'd interpret that as either it was nearly taken out by dogfighting (enough that a sucker punch from Godzilla was enough to finish it off), or else it was only mildly harmed by the fighters but one shot from Godzilla was a killer blow.

-I'm trying to remember if we see its sister ships actually destroyed; one seemed to crash after getting spike-balled by Anguirus, if my notoriously poor memory isn't failing me?

...So basically, every time we see Gotengo or ships of its class, it is crashing or being disabled. One could argue extenuating circumstances in most cases, though. Still, how it fared against the fighters would seem to be the best benchmark of how it would stand up to punishment of the type being dealt out here. And I don't think examples where it drilled through things count; it's designed to do that. But it's durability being broadsided by an energy beam is very different to how durable it is following in the drill that's designed to destroy things out of its path.


I would suggest, though, that whether it was the fighters or Godzilla's ray at the end (or a combo of the two), both Moguera and, arguably, Mecha-King Ghidorah can dish out that level of punishment and beyond- considering the harm they did to foes on the Heisei super-scale of power. Now if Gotengo really can AZC (I am still skeptical based on the film's showing and the universe that it functions as effectively as Kiryu's), it could become a race- how many it could charge and one-shot before taking too much damage itself- so there is the potential for evened-up odds there... but I do think that it has been shown to be pretty 'fragile' comparative to the levels of offensive weaponry being thrown around here. I doubt it could survive the long-haul, so Gotengo's only chance, to me, is to neutralize its enemies very quickly... if it can. (I suspect it will be able to take out Mecha-KG's organic parts most easily with the freezing maser; what effect it would have on Kiryu, who was able to survive its own AZC discharging proximately, or MOGEURA, is harder to say).

MOGUERA can give chase in the air, but doesn't have Gotengo's speed underground.

I don't recall seeing its underground speed demonstrated?

I can see the Gotengo simply dodging their attacks and taking them down one by one.

It didn't really do a lot of that in the film- and both Star Flacon's blasts, Mecha-KG's rays, and Kiryu's beams seemed to be able to track pretty quickly; much quicker that Gotengo tended to maneuver.

Only MOGUERA can follow it underground, then it's just the two of them. Defeat MOGUERA, then only Mecha Kimg Ghidorah will be a problem in the air.

However, underground, we don't have any evidence that any of Gotengo's weapons function (that I can recall), whereas MOGUERA still seemed to pack some pretty potent firepower down there with the auto-canons. I don't necessarily think that Gotengo has the edge there; land MOGUERA is kind of a tank. It all comes down to how well Gotengo's weaponry functions while in burrowing mode... which is just speculation unless it's been specified elsewhere?

[Ivo-goji]

1- You forgot when Gigan knocked the Gotengo down with it's laser, then it got right back up and lead Godzilla on a world tour without a problem
2- Godzilla only brought it down at after it used all its energy to power up Godzilla in the final battle. Neither the damage it took earlier nor Godzilla's beam were what crippled it, it was a result of the power transfer.

Gotengo displayed impressive speed and maneuverability during its battle with Manda. The original Gotengo from Atragon could bore through 9.6 kilometers of earth in a few minutes, which would make it at least twice as fast as Land Moguera's stated one kilometer per minute speed. We would expect the futuristic Millennium era Gotengo, which has all of its Showa era counterpart's capabilities, to have similar if not faster tunneling speed.

MOGUERA's weapons can't phase through solid rock any more than Gotengo's could. Underground they would either both have to close the distance and ram each other head on, or one would have to intercept the other's tunnel and fire on it from behind. Gotengo's drill is the only weapon it needs to beat Land Moguera in a head on collision, and it's greater digging speed gives it enough of an edge it could circle around its opponent sooner than MOGUERA could try the same tactic.

[Zarm]

1- You forgot when Gigan knocked the Gotengo down with it's laser, then it got right back up and lead Godzilla on a world tour without a problem

So I did! So there's a durability feat, at least, and something in more normal circumstances.

2- Godzilla only brought it down at after it used all its energy to power up Godzilla in the final battle. Neither the damage it took earlier nor Godzilla's beam were what crippled it, it was a result of the power transfer.

I disagree; as far as I can see, that was Kiazer energy from Ozaki, channeled through the maser, and nothing to do with Gotengo's systems at all. If there is a source estabslishing otherwise, however, I will concede the point.

MOGUERA's weapons can't phase through solid rock any more than Gotengo's could. Underground they would either both have to close the distance and ram each other head on, or one would have to intercept the other's tunnel and fire on it from behind. Gotengo's drill is the only weapon it needs to beat Land Moguera in a head on collision, and it's greater digging speed gives it enough of an edge it could circle around its opponent sooner than MOGUERA could try the same tactic.

For Land MOGUERA, from the main site: "Land Moguera also used the cannons while burrowing underground, enabling it to strike surface structures while in a subterranean state." I was not under the impression they had reached any kind of natural cavity (though I don't have the film in front of me to review), which would seem to indicate that even if they can't phase through solid rock, they can slice through it to damage targets at range.

Gotengo's digging speed is a matter of conjecture only, and in terms of a head-on collision, MOGUERA's drill is noted as being diamond hard. If its drill is superior in strength, theoretical increased speed from Gotengo would only exacerbate the damage Gotengo takes, rather than what it deals. Unfortunately, lacking data on the strength of Gotengo's drill, a precise comparison isn't possible; but this is a 50/50 situation in which such a circumstance could be advantageous or catastrophic to Gotengo, depending on whose drill is the stronger.

Notably, the Millenium version lacks the upper and lower buzz-saws, which not only conflicts with the Millenium-can-be-assumed-to-have-everything-showa-had theory, but may also slow its subterranean drilling speed since those would seem to rather assist in the process.