Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

For the discussion of video games not produced by, or related to, Toho and their films.
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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

Post by LSD Jellyfish »

Not gonna lie, this is cool:
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Getting very heavy Godzilla/Gamera vibes from the former.

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While I have no substantial proof, I have a feeling this Pokemon was based off a plethora of ultraman monsters and kaiju. Makes sense as in trailer its fighting Tyranitar.
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I also like a lot of the new character designs.
Im still excited for SWSH, not some "Gamefreak Apologist". Im just excited for the game. I think at this point, I`ve seen a lot of people bandwagoning hate against GameFreak, and while Im sure they could do better, the majority of it seems to just be a way to profit off of controversy on youtube. I sickened by the toxicity of the Pokemon Fandom. Just gonna get the games and enjoy them.
Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

Post by _JNavs_ »

It's probably because the designs and concepts are getting weaker yet the gameplay is remaining the same, with very little changes.

I stopped after Soul Silver and Heart Gold. Those were peak perfection.
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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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_JNavs_ wrote:It's probably because the designs and concepts are getting weaker yet the gameplay is remaining the same, with very little changes.

I stopped after Soul Silver and Heart Gold. Those were peak perfection.
Can you stick to just having bad opinions on the Godzilla series please? :roll:

Pokemon has always had design inspirations from other things, thats kind of the point. Pokemon like Nidoking and Tyranitar explicitly take design elements from Godzilla and Baragon. The whole concept was inspired by the UltraSeven Capsule Monsters. All I did was point out that a new Pokemon, that has a great design, has a clear inspiration from a type of kaiju in the ultra series. And still it has a unique enough design to stand out from what I posted.

Also if you read the descriptions of what the Gigantimaxed pokemon do its super awesome competitively. GigamaxDreadnaw has an attack which does damage and sets up stones! Great! It feels like they put a lot of lore and thought into the new pokemon. Have not seen a design that Im iffy about.

Some really great character designs as well:
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Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:38 pm, edited 4 times in total.
Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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LSD Jellyfish wrote:
_JNavs_ wrote:It's probably because the designs and concepts are getting weaker yet the gameplay is remaining the same, with very little changes.

I stopped after Soul Silver and Heart Gold. Those were peak perfection.
Can you stick to just having bad opinions on the Godzilla series please? :roll:

Pokemon has always had design inspirations from other things, thats kind of the point. Pokemon like Nidoking and Tyranitar explicitly take design elements from Godzilla and Baragon. The whole concept was inspired by the UltraSeven Capsule Monsters. All I did was point out that a new Pokemon, that has a great design, has a clear inspiration from a type of kaiju in the ultra series. And still it has a unique enough design to stand out from what I posted.

Also if you read the descriptions of what the Gigantimaxed pokemon do its super awesome competitively. GigamaxDreadnaw has an attack which does damage and sets up stones! Great! It feels like they put a lot of lore and thought into the new pokemon. Have not seen a design that Im iffy about.
Okay one, I don't think me and you have actually discussed any opinions about the Godzilla franchise beyond whether KOTM was good or not lol.

But two, yeah the design inspirations from this, that and the other are perfectly fine, it's why Gen 1 - 3 are so beloved. But after that they started coming full circle with essential repeats of Pokemon with slightly different colors/designs. The most recent gen has to be one of the most blandest generations in recent memory. Plus they've started doing what Digimon did years ago, the whole "here's a cheat device that makes my creature a Mega-Ultra-Maxed creature!!". It made sense in Digimon since they're essentially digital lifeforms, enter the cheat code, get a better monster. Pokemon is about animals living amongst people together, training, evolving and getting stronger. but now they've got steroid devices that temp-boosts said Pokemon till the match is over. Idk, feels superficial to me.

It could just be because I haven't played any of the new games so I don't know how the lore fits into the game itself. But that's just an outsider perspective.
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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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_JNavs_ wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:
_JNavs_ wrote:It's probably because the designs and concepts are getting weaker yet the gameplay is remaining the same, with very little changes.

I stopped after Soul Silver and Heart Gold. Those were peak perfection.
Can you stick to just having bad opinions on the Godzilla series please? :roll:

Pokemon has always had design inspirations from other things, thats kind of the point. Pokemon like Nidoking and Tyranitar explicitly take design elements from Godzilla and Baragon. The whole concept was inspired by the UltraSeven Capsule Monsters. All I did was point out that a new Pokemon, that has a great design, has a clear inspiration from a type of kaiju in the ultra series. And still it has a unique enough design to stand out from what I posted.

Also if you read the descriptions of what the Gigantimaxed pokemon do its super awesome competitively. GigamaxDreadnaw has an attack which does damage and sets up stones! Great! It feels like they put a lot of lore and thought into the new pokemon. Have not seen a design that Im iffy about.
Okay one, I don't think me and you have actually discussed any opinions about the Godzilla franchise beyond whether KOTM was good or not lol.

But two, yeah the design inspirations from this, that and the other are perfectly fine, it's why Gen 1 - 3 are so beloved. But after that they started coming full circle with essential repeats of Pokemon with slightly different colors/designs. The most recent gen has to be one of the most blandest generations in recent memory. Plus they've started doing what Digimon did years ago, the whole "here's a cheat device that makes my creature a Mega-Ultra-Maxed creature!!". It made sense in Digimon since they're essentially digital lifeforms, enter the cheat code, get a better monster. Pokemon is about animals living amongst people together, training, evolving and getting stronger. but now they've got steroid devices that temp-boosts said Pokemon till the match is over. Idk, feels superficial to me.
No, contrary to your beliefs, the new pokemon designs are not bland, and clearly have a lot of inspiration to them.

Yamper is cute, but fits the vibe and atmosphere of the region. It is specifically based off a Corgi, a culturally significant and iconic dog for the Queen of England. Wooloo is just a sheep sure, but again it and the cotton and coal pokemon fit right into the vibe and aesthetic of the franchise. Its funny because most people complain that there are too many "overlydesigned pokemon" meanwhile GF has been making a lot of simple pokemon. There`s just no satisfying everyone is there.

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Here is just a very small sampling size of pokemon from Gen 7 that are completely original with their own lore and background+gameplay mechanics.

If you have not played any of the recent games your opinions are invalid.
Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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LSD Jellyfish wrote: No, contrary to your beliefs, the new pokemon designs are not bland,
Subjective.
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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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UltramanGoji wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote: No, contrary to your beliefs, the new pokemon designs are not bland,
Subjective.
That`s true, but the OP was subjective as well. What is bland and isnt is up to Jnavs, but because he posted no actual explanation as to what he means by bland, I can`t effectively agree or disagree with him. He does the same thing when he criticizes older Godzilla films/shots. If he doesn`t like the newer pokemon thats fine. If he thinks that some of the newer pokemon are differently designed then older ones, thats fine. But if he says that the newer pokemon are bland, I can easily give examples why thats not the case.


And there are a healthy variety of Pokemon designs, some cute, some edgy, some simple, some complex. When I read that someone doesn`t like newer pokemon designs, the majority of it comes from people who havent played the games in ages, like JNAVs flat out admitted, and have super nostalgia. There`s plenty of modern designs I dont like, but there`s plenty of older designs I also dont like. However, there seems to be this absurdly false-hipsterish trend of POKEMON WAS COOL WHEN I WAS 8 CAUSE IM A 90`s kid mentality.
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Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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Gotta be honest, I'm disappointed in what these games have shown so far. A lot of the new Pokemon seem derivative both in terms of concept and playstyle, definitely a step back from Alola so far. Gigantamax is just plain dumb, it's effectively Mega Evolution + Z-Moves rolled into one (no wonder they removed both!), is a straight upgrade over Dynamax and from what little we've seen it's already clear that they're going to increasingly centralize the metagame, like Gen 5's weather wars on steroids. "More balanced" my ass.

It also comes off as a way to skirt around the total number of Pokemon since the new forms could've just as easily been evolutions, when Generation 6 introduced Mega Evolutions, one of the smart things they did was prioritize generations that had fallen out of favor due to powercreep. None of the Kalos Pokemon had one, because why would they need a new form when you can just make them evolve? I can't really see how Drednaw and Alcremie's new forms are better off as a temporary situational power-up that you can only use in certain areas over a permanent upgrade. Megas were flawed in their overall execution but I think they're better than what we're seeing here. The quality seems inconsistent too--Corviknight's Gigantamax appearance is particularly bland.

This is all without acknowledging the fact that this just the latest in a line of new gimmicks that will inevitably be shelved in the following generation, so why even get invested in it. The battle system hasn't gotten an improvement at the fundamental level since Diamond and Pearl. At least Sobble might get a cool evolution, I guess.

Special shoutout to Duraludon for being a cool concept that looks the result of an internal "design the the dumbest thing ever" contest.
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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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Smuggers wrote:Gotta be honest, I'm disappointed in what these games have shown so far. A lot of the new Pokemon seem derivative both in terms of concept and playstyle, definitely a step back from Alola so far. Gigantamax is just plain dumb, it's effectively Mega Evolution + Z-Moves rolled into one (no wonder they removed both!), is a straight upgrade over Dynamax and from what little we've seen it's already clear that they're going to increasingly centralize the metagame, like Gen 5's weather wars on steroids. "More balanced" my ass.

It also comes off as a way to skirt around the total number of Pokemon since the new forms could've just as easily been evolutions, when Generation 6 introduced Mega Evolutions, one of the smart things they did was prioritize generations that had fallen out of favor due to powercreep. None of the Kalos Pokemon had one, because why would they need a new form when you can just make them evolve? I can't really see how Drednaw and Alcremie's new forms are better off as a temporary situational power-up that you can only use in certain areas over a permanent upgrade. Megas were flawed in their overall execution but I think they're better than what we're seeing here. The quality seems inconsistent too--Corviknight's Gigantamax appearance is particularly bland.
Agreed with this part. But I have a feeling that some of the designs for the Gigantmax depends on how well the design aids a specific idea. Like the cream pokemon, looks cool cause its literally sitting on a gigantic cake. You can feel the weight to Dreadnaw`s max form because it looks cool when its big. As a normal sized pokemon it would look dumb. Until I see more I cant have a full conclusion.

Duraludon is still a quick favorite for me. I get why others think it looks dumb, just reminds me of a bulky ass kaiju.

Found exactly what I was thinking of!
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Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Mon Jul 08, 2019 9:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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The gym leaders look great, and we may finally get a dark gym.
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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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UltimateDitto wrote:The gym leaders look great, and we may finally get a dark gym.
I gotta say the character designs for this gen seem like a big standout and the early emphasis on them makes me believe that there will be more of a story.
Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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Truthfully: I not that upset over "losing" the National Dex. I have a feeling it will mostly be "special" Pokemon: like the regional legendaries, ultra beasts, and download only with a code or online Pokemon. I don't use the uber legendaries; ie Groudon, Lugia, and the like, and Mythical Pokemon. And to be honest; never really used any sort of legendary until Hyper Training IVs became available. I can cope with certain Pokemon not being available right now. Who knows? Down the road, they may have a "Vote on which Pokemon you'd like to see in Sw/Sh and the top few Pokemon will be chosen to be included in an update!"
I more upset with Mega Evolutions being gone. Truthfully, it feels like another mechanic to get us fans all excited and then drop for the next round. Maybe they'll be back in another game? Possibly. It just gets old, that's all.
I was mentioned in the SciFi Japan article about the appearence of extras on the Godzilla vs. Megalon DVD.

http://www.scifijapan.com/articles/2012 ... p-mystery/

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Tim85 wrote:Truthfully: I not that upset over "losing" the National Dex. I have a feeling it will mostly be "special" Pokemon: like the regional legendaries, ultra beasts, and download only with a code or online Pokemon. I don't use the uber legendaries; ie Groudon, Lugia, and the like, and Mythical Pokemon. And to be honest; never really used any sort of legendary until Hyper Training IVs became available. I can cope with certain Pokemon not being available right now. Who knows? Down the road, they may have a "Vote on which Pokemon you'd like to see in Sw/Sh and the top few Pokemon will be chosen to be included in an update!"
I more upset with Mega Evolutions being gone. Truthfully, it feels like another mechanic to get us fans all excited and then drop for the next round. Maybe they'll be back in another game? Possibly. It just gets old, that's all.
I`m not upset either. It makes no sense for Zekrom, Rayquaza, the Alolan Gaurdians and others to be in the region. It makes the local legendaries less powerful, and forces a ton of unique items and events to have to be made. Same thing for the Ultra Beasts. If I had had to guess most, if not all the Sinnoh legends will be cut, because it will make the Gen 4 remakes more special, and they can devote time to making the models then.

I think whats lame though is the prospect of if Gigantamaxing is going to be a temporary thing like Megas now, which makes me less hyped. What if they just give the same forms/models of megas to Gigantamaxed pokemon? Just big? I dont like Megas mechanically, but I like the designs, and I like how Beedrill was actually a usable pokemon.
Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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It'll probably go the wayside the same as Triple Battles, Type Gems, Z-Crystals, and (unless they reveal some for the Galar region) Regional forms. I honestly miss Triple Battles (I never used Rotation Battles). I loved the extra strategy it brought and I had teams that worked the best in that format. Type Gems were a nice boost, especially Flying Gem and Acrobatics. Now it's only the Normal Gem available (big whoop). Z-Crystals are a great one time nuke or boost, depending on the move but I won't be heartbroken if they go. Alolan forms was a great idea but the number of said forms is pitiful. 18 Pokemon and 8 of them are pre-evolutions. And yes I too thought it was a missed opportunity to bring in more with Ultra Sun and Moon like more Megas in ORAS; instead we get a couple of new Ultra Beasts. I'm tired of getting hyped for the "the next evolution in Pokemon battles" only to have them pulled or ignored after a generation or two. While I know you can't please everyone; it raises my eyebrow when most of the fandom is saying, for example: "I love Mega Evolutions! Do more!" and they go "We could, but how we about take them out of the new game altogether and just give you the option to make your Pokemon bigger?" I hope something happens that'll get me more hyped then I am. For some reason I just can't get excited over these new games.

I don't like to complain too much seeing how that's all fandoms seem to do nowadays but I had to get this off my chest.
I was mentioned in the SciFi Japan article about the appearence of extras on the Godzilla vs. Megalon DVD.

http://www.scifijapan.com/articles/2012 ... p-mystery/

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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LSD Jellyfish wrote: I`m not upset either. It makes no sense for Zekrom, Rayquaza, the Alolan Gaurdians and others to be in the region. It makes the local legendaries less powerful, and forces a ton of unique items and events to have to be made.
Nobody is asking for them to be tied to the lore of the region. We're literally just asking for their code to exist in the game so we can bring them over to complete our Pokedex like every single other game in the past. It's been proven time and time again that it's possible and GameFreak is just illogically refusing to do so.
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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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Tim85 wrote:It'll probably go the wayside the same as Triple Battles, Type Gems, Z-Crystals, and (unless they reveal some for the Galar region) Regional forms. I honestly miss Triple Battles (I never used Rotation Battles). I loved the extra strategy it brought and I had teams that worked the best in that format. Type Gems were a nice boost, especially Flying Gem and Acrobatics. Now it's only the Normal Gem available (big whoop). Z-Crystals are a great one time nuke or boost, depending on the move but I won't be heartbroken if they go. Alolan forms was a great idea but the number of said forms is pitiful. 18 Pokemon and 8 of them are pre-evolutions. And yes I too thought it was a missed opportunity to bring in more with Ultra Sun and Moon like more Megas in ORAS; instead we get a couple of new Ultra Beasts. I'm tired of getting hyped for the "the next evolution in Pokemon battles" only to have them pulled or ignored after a generation or two. While I know you can't please everyone; it raises my eyebrow when most of the fandom is saying, for example: "I love Mega Evolutions! Do more!" and they go "We could, but how we about take them out of the new game altogether and just give you the option to make your Pokemon bigger?" I hope something happens that'll get me more hyped then I am. For some reason I just can't get excited over these new games.

I don't like to complain too much seeing how that's all fandoms seem to do nowadays but I had to get this off my chest.
Pretty much agreed. I also have a feeling that Battle Royales won`t make a return. I could be wrong, but rather then taking an old mechanic and improving on it, Game-Freak is pretty much just making something flawed, and abandoning it for something new and shiny.

Replying to UltramanGoji; I`ve routinely completed the national dexes since back in HG/SS, and at that time with much less Pokemon it was much harder to pull off. I feel satisfied for completing it then, and I have my own self-satisfaction. So long as I catch the new ones, in the new game, then I`ll have caught them all. It`s not GameFreak, or the people in charge`s fault that everyone has massive OCD. You`re not even asking for a pokemon to integrated; you just want something to tick off a box.
Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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I'm going to be honest I think I'm going to skip this game which will be the first since Black/White 2 and UltraSun/UltraMoon. I'm not to fond of the idea that they removed the National Dex because I was really looking forward to moving my Pokemon from lets Go Eevee into the game. Hell I even completed the Pokedex in that game with the exception of getting Meltan's evolved form Melmetal.

Plus the game looks like the same too me. Oh well if you guys enjoy good for you but I'm going to pass on this one unless a later trailer/direct changes my opinion and they decide to add the national dex in later.
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Upon some research, some free time, and calculations about the National Dex, I have concluded the following:

According to serebii.net, there has been around 176 Pokemon revealed to be coming back from the old games so far. That gives us 633 Pokemon still up for grabs.
Speculation time: Now there's Pokemon that fall under the category of the most likely to be excluded, legendaries of all sorts and event only Pokemon (excluding Mew, who's coming back), there's 78 Pokemon right there. That drops to 537 Pokemon. Some other Pokemon that have the chance to be excluded are the starters from other regions, possibly sans Kanto thanks to the Charizard line and the fossil Pokemon: another 39 Pokemon, now giving us 498.

Of course not knowing how many new Pokemon are coming out and how big the Dex will be will also factor in. Who knows what GF will be doing? The last few figures are more discussion material then anything. Just thought I'd share.
I was mentioned in the SciFi Japan article about the appearence of extras on the Godzilla vs. Megalon DVD.

http://www.scifijapan.com/articles/2012 ... p-mystery/

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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Tim85 wrote:Upon some research, some free time, and calculations about the National Dex, I have concluded the following:

According to serebii.net, there has been around 176 Pokemon revealed to be coming back from the old games so far. That gives us 633 Pokemon still up for grabs.
Speculation time: Now there's Pokemon that fall under the category of the most likely to be excluded, legendaries of all sorts and event only Pokemon (excluding Mew, who's coming back), there's 78 Pokemon right there. That drops to 537 Pokemon. Some other Pokemon that have the chance to be excluded are the starters from other regions, possibly sans Kanto thanks to the Charizard line and the fossil Pokemon: another 39 Pokemon, now giving us 498.

Of course not knowing how many new Pokemon are coming out and how big the Dex will be will also factor in. Who knows what GF will be doing? The last few figures are more discussion material then anything. Just thought I'd share.
I have a slight inclination a few years down people are going to look back on this and laugh.

Right now, we really can't make a proper judgement until we see the final product. This goes for not only the pokemon, but graphics as well. The game still has a solid few months of development time. There`s tons of people criticizing the animations and backgrounds even though every trailer the game's graphics improve. if its something like 500 old pokemon, plus around 100 new, I`ll be absolutely content.

People forget the controversy surrounding Black and White, about how they essentially cut all the Pokemon. Don`t give me that BS that they were in the code, because during development people did not know that. It led to any new pokemon being hated because people complained that they were replacing things they like. I have my criticisms of Gen 5 pokemon, but I remember the controversy surrounding that game, and a lot of people look back on that era fondly. I actually liked how the story forced you to use new pokemon.
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Spirit Ghidorah 2010 wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 4:54 pm Anno-san pleasures me more than Yamasaki-san.

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Re: Pokemon Game Discussion 2.0

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Not sure how I feel about the new games. Guess I'll just have to wait until they actually come out before I can truly judge.

However, I will say I've been going back through each generation and doing a run of sorts that I'm unsure if many people have done, just something I thought would make an interesting play through:

* The aim is to catch every Pokemon available on the (Regional) Pokedex by the time the game is beaten the first time around [Elite 4/Champion]. The catch is that each and every Pokemon must have its objectively best nature (inevitably I find myself with 90% of the Pokemon having Adamant or Modest natures), and areas cannot be progressed through until the Pokemon that first appear there are obtained with the nature requirement.

It makes for what is at times a lengthy grind, as it is pure RNG. Why I imposed it on myself I'll never know. I will say I successfully have done it through LeafGreen version so far, and I am currently working on Black and White at this time. On the latter note, I have forgotten how much I actually liked Gen 5. I can confidently say I was not one of those people who hated the region because of the lack of old Pokemon in the base game; as a matter of fact I liked that because it made me have to learn the new monsters and form new strategies. The animated sprites as well as move animations were also terrific for the time, though they show their age now. I also find the story very engaging, even if the enemy team's foot soldiers look silly (who said Team Galactic or Team Magma didn't, though?), and their motives seem a little.. Forced? Radical? I guess that was the point. Regardless, I have consistently placed Gen 5 in the upper tier of my rankings of the Pokemon generations by gameplay, and this most recent play through, despite my absurd rules, reaffirms my feelings of Black and White as a whole; some of the better entries of the franchise.
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