The Dark Knight Rises (2012)

[SuperSaiyan4Godzilla]

The series starring Adam West was more like the late Showa Godzilla Era, campy but going along with its time. For a Tri-Star Godzilla equivalent I would look at certain comics like "All-Star Batman & Robin", personally.

I really can't say that. Partially because the series never finished. Probably because Jim Lee's been too busy goofing around with my comic book store guy.

[Tyler]

Wataru - Frank Miller paved the way for dark Batman. No Miller, no Burton.

I think Burton was influenced much more by Alan Moore and The Killing Joke although at the time I guess you couldn't get away from the gritty Bronze Age stuff.

[Tim85]

I think everyone is missing the bigger news. Keith, you worked at DC and Marvel? My God, what haven't you done my friend?

Anyway, the Adam West Batman has a special place in my heart because it was the old movie that got me interested in Batman when I was little. Mom worked at a video rental store and the old Batman movie was a regular rental for me because I loved it. If it wasn't for the Adam West Batman, I wouldn't have gotten into Batman. And you know what? I still enjoy watching it and the old series for that reason.

And another thing: I heard on one of the commentaries of B: TAS that Bruce Timm credits the Burtan Batman movies for the GP accepting a dark Batman. So if it wasn't for Burtan: the animated series may not have even gotten on the air. Stuff to think about.

[mecha-gino]

I think Burton was influenced much more by Alan Moore and The Killing Joke although at the time I guess you couldn't get away from the gritty Bronze Age stuff.

absolutely not. From the various comic book movie documentaries I've seen, whenever talking about Burton's first batman the one thing that's always mentioned was he had the dark knight returns with him all the time when on set.

[miguelnuva]

Anyone see this video yet. Attack of the Show promotes the dark knight rises.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sk5jIjB404

[wataru]

Wataru - Frank Miller paved the way for dark Batman. No Miller, no Burton.

:forehead slap:

Whatever dude, just be wrong, it doesnt effect me at all.

[tymon]

^

From the various comic book movie documentaries I've seen, whenever talking about Burton's first batman the one thing that's always mentioned was he had the dark knight returns with him all the time when on set.

Oh wats, cheer up. I'm not saying that Burton's films weren't highly influential (and of course catapulted Batman into serious mainstream recognition), they just aren't as important as you seem to believe. Like mecha-gino, I've seen plenty of comic writers/Bat-historians who attest to Miller's enormous influence on the 89 film - all of whom are, sorry to say, more credible than you.

[wataru]

Congrats on proving absolutely nothing. Feel free to examine your statement and get back to me.

[tymon]

Proving that Burton's films wouldn't have been as dark/serious (and therefore not as successful) if not for Miller's work? Which was my original intention?

This was one of your original statements:

"Batman came out in 1989, when Batman comics were NOT dark shadowy books. They were adventure books with a little but of gritty crime.'

Miller's work, obviously, pre-dates B89, and is actually darker/grittier than the film.

"Comic Book God" my ass.

[Goji]

Why is it so hard for wat's to admit he's wrong? One of the many mysteries of our universe.


In regards to Adam West Batman..the show was fun (used to watch reruns when I was a youngster), as was the movie, but is easily my least favorite version of the character. It's good for a laugh, and not much more.

I saw BATMAN ('89) when I was 5, and preferred it to the show, even at that age. Batman simply works better as a "dark" character, and honestly, it should stay that way for future films.

[wataru]

Proving that Burton's films wouldn't have been as dark/serious (and therefore not as successful) if not for Miller's work? Which was my original intention?

This was one of your original statements:

"Batman came out in 1989, when Batman comics were NOT dark shadowy books. They were adventure books with a little but of gritty crime.'

Miller's work, obviously, pre-dates B89, and is actually darker/grittier than the film.

"Comic Book God" my ass.

Yes, tymon, a limited run non-canonical Batman is totally all encompassing all of Batman.

And Goji, I will happily admit when Im wrong. And right now, Im not.

[Goji]

I'm sorry, what exactly are you 'right' about here? I just don't see it.

THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS dropped in '86..several years before BATMAN was released.

[RedZillaKing]

Yep. In fact, it was the inspiration for the dark and gritty style of that film. From what I hear, Mr. Burton was a big fan. Or that might've been The Killing Joke. Or maybe both...

[Goji]

I do still like 89, but Batman Returns is awful.

Y u no likin' RETURNS brah?

[Legionmaster]

I do still like 89, but Batman Returns is awful.

Y u no likin' RETURNS brah?

He can't handle the pure awesomeness that is Christopher Walken, because he's been a Bond villain AND a Batman villain.

[wataru]

I'm sorry, what exactly are you 'right' about here? I just don't see it.

THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS dropped in '86..several years before BATMAN was released.

Please, do the research before posting.

Locate and read Batman comics from 1989 to 1993. I own them, I recently re-read them. Theyre NOTHING like Miller's books because Miller's books are NON-CANONICALLY. Of course Burton read them. They were the biggest Bat-Books at the time but Batman (1989) is obviously an evolution of the canonically Batman. By Batman Returns, Batman was falling back into the pre-COIE style. After Batman Returns and Knightfall and Knightquest, Batman's stories evolved more to involve the look, stories, feel and architecture of Burton's Batman. This can be seen for YEARS.

The next biggest change to the character of Batman was in 2002 when Loeb and Lee published Hush. This character form and attitude STILL lives today. Morrison's Batman is a close 2nd.

Every single huge Bat-Book published before 1989 isnt going to be a major influence to Burton, or Nolan. Miller's comics changed the status quo on Batman books and while Burton mightve read them and got some ideas (influenced), the Miller comics did NOT change the face of the canonical Batman stories. Burton's movies did that

And Batman Returns is a great flick.

[Goji]

Jesus skreeonk Christ, why are you *still* missing the point? I'll spell if out for you, since you're clearly having some trouble.

1986: Miller's The Dark Knight Returns is released. Features an extremely dark Batman story.

(You still following me?)

1989: Tim Burton's BATMAN is released, and is *much* more similar in tone to Miller's story than any other Batman stories up to that point in time.

I don't need a wall of text explaining about canonical Batman stories/the evolution of tone in stories *after* 1989. None of that is relevant. At all.

Every single huge Bat-Book published before 1989 isnt going to be a major influence to Burton, or Nolan. Miller's comics changed the status quo on Batman books and while Burton mightve read them and got some ideas (influenced), the Miller comics did NOT change the face of the canonical Batman stories. Burton's movies did that

This is the issue. Nobody was saying that to begin with. Miller's "dark" take on the character clearly influenced the tone of Burton's films. That's all that people here are trying to say.

[wataru]

BUT MILLER'S WORK DID NOT MOLD HOW BATMAN'S CHARACTER CHANGED POST-BURTON FILMS.

Yall are so stuck up on 1986, 1986, Miller, 1986, dark, gritty that yall FAIL at thinking.

Batman comics were mostly HORRIBLE pre-Miller's run. His comic was DIFFERENT. So was Watchmen. While Miller's comic was obviously an inspiration of Burton's through process (BECAUSE IT'S skreeonk OBVIOUS HE READ IT), it was NOT Miller's work and writing that changed THE CORE CHARACTER OF BATMAN from 1993 on, it was BURTON'S WRITING OF BATMAN. THE BURTON-ESQUE FEEL LASTED NEARLY TEN YEARS.

If you bothered to read the canonical Batman comics from 1989 to 1993, you'd see that Burton's Batman is an evolution of the canonical Batman, NOT Miller's. He doesnt even resemble Miller's Batman. And Batman was physically changed to resemble Burton's Batman when Bruce Wayne came back from his injuries.

Unless you've actually READ the 1989-1993 Batman comics, you have NO LEG to stand on when trying to say what influenced them. I have, it's Burton's writings. Burton did not C&P Miller, he didnt "trace" Miller, he didnt keep anything but some of the angsty feel of the books with a more serious note and focusing more on crime and less on sensation crimes.

[Goji]

BUT MILLER'S WORK DID NOT MOLD HOW BATMAN'S CHARACTER CHANGED POST-BURTON FILMS.

Who. The skreeonk. CARES. Nobody is talking about this dude. Good God, you are thick.

irrelevant wall of text

If you bothered to read the canonical Batman comics from 1989 to 1993, you'd see that Burton's Batman is an evolution of the canonical Batman, NOT Miller's. He doesnt even resemble Miller's Batman. And Batman was physically changed to resemble Burton's Batman when Bruce Wayne came back from his injuries.

There are those years again. What does this have to do with how Miller's work influenced the tone of Burton's first film? The answer is nothing at all.

Unless you've actually READ the 1989-1993 Batman comics, you have NO LEG to stand on when trying to say what influenced them. I have, it's Burton's writings. Burton did not C&P Miller, he didnt "trace" Miller, he didnt keep anything but some of the angsty feel of the books with a more serious note and focusing more on crime and less on sensation crimes.

WOW. Where the skreeonk did I say that?

You're putting words in my mouth (and in others) and ranting and raving about shit that isn't even relevant to the original point, that there was an obvious influence in tone with Burton's film, in comparison to Miller's work. That's all I've been saying. Why is this so incredibly hard for you to understand? WHY?

[wataru]

Whatever, Goji. Continue to talk about something you know nothing about. And you can enjoy life on my Foe List.