Ridley Scott's "Prometheus" (2012)

[zilla103192]

I avoided spoilers for this movie like the plaque. But I am kind of glad I read a few reviews on it learning that there isn't as much of a connection to ALIEN as I thought. Now I can go in with a much more open mind.

[wataru]

I avoided spoilers for this movie like the plaque. But I am kind of glad I read a few reviews on it learning that there isn't as much of a connection to ALIEN as I thought. Now I can go in with a much more open mind.

Except it happens in the same universe, involving the same Space Jockey species, Weyland, ALIEN terminology and tech and I hear at the end a Xenomorph bursts from the Engineer aka Space Jockey's chest.

[Terrier]

I avoided spoilers for this movie like the plaque. But I am kind of glad I read a few reviews on it learning that there isn't as much of a connection to ALIEN as I thought. Now I can go in with a much more open mind.

Except it happens in the same universe, involving the same Space Jockey species, Weyland, ALIEN terminology and tech and I hear at the end a Xenomorph bursts from the Engineer aka Space Jockey's chest.

And that's about it.

People shouldn't expect answers about the Alien, we already know (or were told) way too much about it, too much is assumed or given for granted about it. Part of what made the original so effective was the mystery, that we didn't know for sure. Then came "Aliens", with its queen and the aliens themselves reduced to space ants; then came "Alien 3", with a production comparable if not worse than that of "Dune", was pretty much written as they filmed it (Filming even started before an script was decided), and subjected the Alien to the idea of changing depending on the host, resulting on countless ridiculous hybridizations...

Today the aliens are a joke, just cannon fodder and bitches for the oh-so-badass Predator. I don't want "Prometheus" to be a straigh prequel to "Alien", I don't want it to give us answers, I want it to return this universe to it's roots, I want it to give us questions, mystery, possibilities, things that will make us think and speculate indefinitely.

There are still some days before the movie is released were I live; I won't be so quick to label things "plot holes" instead of "voids to fill" (like the content of the suitcase in "Pulp Fiction" (Screw the soul theory), or whatever the tartarus was "Gamera 3" about, or whether Gorosaurus did break King Ghidorah's column or not in "Destroy All Monsters", or the original "Alien"). It seems that picking on this movie is just the current thing to do...

[Tyler]

How could the alien that came out of the engineer at the end be the first Xenomorph since this( http://www.prometheus-movie.com/media/p ... ncap49.jpg )was there?

Maybe it wasn't the first Alien. Maybe the image on the mural was a warning - to say that whatever the black goo comes into contact with eventually leads to something like the Alien we know of.

There are still some days before the movie is released were I live; I won't be so quick to label things "plot holes" instead of "voids to fill" (like the content of the suitcase in "Pulp Fiction" (Screw the soul theory), or whatever the tartarus was "Gamera 3" about, or whether Gorosaurus did break King Ghidorah's column or not in "Destroy All Monsters", or the original "Alien"). It seems that picking on this movie is just the current thing to do...

I think there's a difference between ambiguity and lazy bullshit.

[Terrier]

By the way, the figures by NECA based on the movie were revealed recently. I'm not showing links because they may count as spoilers, anyone interested should look it up in the company's site.

[Hellspawn28]

I just came back from seeing it and I saw it with low exceptions. The movie was awesome and I love every second of it. The effects were top notch, best 3D that I saw since Avatar. The movie had great atmosphere, the movie had me on the edge of my seat, the acting was good, and it actually made me care for these characters more than I thought I would. I personally like how the movie left many unanswered questions for the viewer and I don't see how that is a bad thing. Overall, I enjoy every moment of the film.

[kaiju115]

I just got back from seeing the movie, & I thought was pretty good. I like the characters, the atmosphere, the effects, pretty much everything. I won't spoil it but the ending gave me chills.

[Hellspawn28]

The ending did give me the chills and made me shit my pants. I do wish some things where explain but I like how most of things where made for the viewer to debate on.

[Svitska Donkun]

Because it was a poorly written, stupid, movie.

Thank you for that in-depth and articulated opinion, Donkun. Always a pleasure to have you around.

$5 says he didnt even see it.

There will be Spoilers here.

Anyone who is willing to spend trillions of dollars on an endeavor based off of the baseless opinions of a couple of "scientists", should be treated as something of a wacko, fringe expedition. However, the "scientists" are treated as if their opinion should be valued. It is not given enough weight or merit to feel warranted besides the fact that it is in a movie where we know they will be right, which displays poor writing. I say "Scientists" with quaotation marks because these are possibly the worst scientists I've ever seen in a Science Fiction film, I mean, Goddammit are they bad at their job, and they do not appreciate basic scientific protocol or the Scientific Method at all. ("Hey! We have an alien lifeform's head! Let's shove this magic rod in here and make it's face move for no reason!" It's brain would've deteriorated to a point where it couldn't even speak, so there's really no point in doing it except for the lulz)

You also fail to realize the complexity of the situation they are in, as do the writers. They are in an alien planet. Simply because the air is breathable, does not mean you want to remove your masks. Even if there weren't evil alien life forms there, there is the possibility of a multitude of contaminants like viruses, which any scientist taking on such an endeavor would assuredly worry about, as even travel to different continents on our own planet can prove lethal in such a regard.

Then the issue is compounded by none of the characters behaving in a capacity that is befitting their job description. The biologist acts like a kid in a petting zoo. This is directly antithetical to anyone who has even taken a biology class, let alone a biologist. Especially when the creature does the UNIVERSAL DISPLAY OF AGGRESSION THAT PRACTICALLY ALL ANIMALS ON EARTH DO. This wouldn't be problematic if he was just some guy, but I'm assuming that not only has he dedicated his entire life to such a field of study, but that he is good enough at it so that one of the most powerful business men would pay him. But he behaves unprofessionally, and... Well, stupidly.

Then there is mohawk man who basically has "I die first" tattooed on his head. He is aggressive, annoying, and stupid. Sure, you can justify his actions but this doesn't make him less of a caricature who is only there to get killed. It is something a bit bothersome that anyone who is interested in knowledge would want to run away and not be a part of the most important discovery ever, but I guess that's because he's written as a moron. Which makes him a cheap pointless character that no one should care about.

Then there's Holloway, whom I only remember because I saw his name written on his helmet. He's a stupid douchebag. That's it. Once again, he doesn't say anything beyond whatever stupid exposition he had to dribble out that was only marginally better than that in Alien Versus Predator, and then he just gets to muck it up being a douche bag. Why? Because he got to make the most important discovery ever but it wasn't the most important discovery he wanted to make. Wah. Is his getting drunk justifiable? Maybe. If he's being characterized as a short sighted ******* who doesn't realize the prominence of his discovery, which, as I'm attempting to get across about all the characters, doesn't make him sympathetic or likable. Or feel real.

The problem with Weyland is that they treat him like a twist plot point. HE WAS ON THE SHIP THE WHOLE TIME?!?!?! So? Why keep it a secret. Why wouldn't an old man doing a last ditch attempt to save himself be on the ship? Why is Theron's character being his daughter a plot point? Why is it in the movie? Aside from whatever idiotic creator/created theme they thought they were emphasizing, it does nothing. It doesn't make her any less of a 2D hard ***** caricature and doesn't make his "surprise" inclusion any less cheap and nonsensical.

Then there's Rapace's character. She's religious but is on a quest to find her Alien makers. Her justification, rather than scientific fact, is because she believes in things. This is not scientific. This wouldn't be as much of an issue IF SHE DID ANYTHING THAT DISPLAYED ANY REAL APPROACH TO THE ENTIRE SITUATION THAT RESEMBLED A SCIENTIFIC MIND. But she doesn't. She's just religious, and in doing so, as with Lost, Lindleof forces his bizarre believes of faith vs. science into the film with even less finesse or real meaning to it.

Then there's the simple issue of the aliens and the presentation of them. The alien sacrifices itself and starts existence on Earth. Cool. Good scene. But why show the mother ship fly away? Did they decide to go away and wait many many million years then come back when man finally came about? Is the film trying to say that evolution actually didn't happen at all? Then what are dinosaurs? Were they already dead then the aliens showed up? Did they only create us? Then why do all life on Earth have the same base pairs? If the aliens did leave when he threw himself in, why are the cave paintings there in the first place? If they didn't leave, my make a point of showing it leave? Why does this alien after being awoken immediately attack the humans like a big brute? It's an alien that has mastered space travel and the creation of life yet it still just attacks like any other creature. Fine, I'll buy that...

But why were they going to attack Earth at all? They have this weapon place that they left us clues telling us to go there, then we go there, and it's been abandoned for 2000 years? And it was built for our destruction? Why didn't more aliens just come and then destroy us? Are they dead too?

The film thinks that by depriving answers to the audience that it is allowing itself to be a more thoughtful and philosophical film, but it is shallow and lacks any real logic behind it. It is full of half baked ideas and doesn't have any of the ambition to follow them through to any kind of conclusion.

Furthermore, the pacing is atrocious. With the span of just a few minutes of her character having screen time, we learn that Rapace can't have kids in an awkward, poorly written conversation, then that she is pregnant with a monster baby, and then she's having a c-section. Boom boom boom. Nothing is set up before hand or given time. It just happens. Just like everything else in the movie.

I would also like to add the plot point of putting the lifeform in ALCOHOL(which should've killed it) then giving it to Holloway. This is so Biologically unsound. Ok, so the organism is in him...to do what? This is something the organism is in no way designed for or meant to deal with. ****, how does David know that the human's antibodies won't destroy the agent like any other infection? OR just dies because it can't survive on its own inside of a human body? And if that doesn't work, wouldn't he only get sick until given antibiotics or dies? So this, organism grows in him or something, and he has sex with Shaw while it's doing so, and this infection is somehow a sexually transmittable one, as far as human intercourse(It having no genetic experience with) is concerned, and rather like any other biological agent where the victim get's the same sickness as the person she got it from does, this organism does something COMPLETELY different and far more advanced than ANYTHING it should have been capable of prior. It is able to adapt to human physiology, and make her pregnant(She's barren, by the way so, no egg to react with, it's just growing in her where a baby is supposed to be. Magic).

Not only that, it forms into a fully developed fetus within a matter of hours(The host is somehow completely oblivious to gaining a 5 pound weight in her stomach that is feeding off her), and comes out as a fully developed, unprecedented creature, with a specific biological purpose, that is immune to being "Decontaminated"(That Medical Table is downright MAGIC, btw), and grows into a gigantic monster in a matter of hours without anything fueling it's growth. And it, in turn, gives birth to the first Alien(An obviously completely different animal). That is down right, ****ing AWFUL writing.

I would also like to point out that the two doctors she fought off to get to the Magic Med table(that makes you instantly recover from massive surgical procedures that are executed within minutes while a patient is struggling), whom weren't knocked out, made no attempt to pursue this possibly dangerous contaminated person, or even report it to anybody. No one even KNEW she used the table apparently. And apparently she never told anyone about the monster squid thing, so they never followed up on it and let it squirm around the Med Lab. No cameras on this advanced research vessel apparently. I also love how she runs into the room where Weyland is, covered in blood and basically falling over, but everyone's just like, "Sup!". I'd also like to point out that for a machine that there are only 12 of in the universe, she sure knows how to use it perfectly.

Lastly, I'd like to know WHAT killed all the Jockey's on the ship and WHAT the danger was, but I guess we'll never know because Damon Lindelof is a lazy skreeonk. It's not just a stupid movie, it's a really stupid movie. It just pretends to be smart and some people(Mostly Alien fanboys from my experiences on RT) are fooled by it.

[Hellspawn28]

They are working on a sequel, so I guess we could find out soon. I don't see how it's a bad thing if they keep what killed the Jokey's on the ship a mystery? It seems like people now these days always want things to explain for them. It would be like if they explain what the Matrix was in the intro credits for the movie or show Ozymandias killing The Comedian in Watchmen .

[Svitska Donkun]

They are working on a sequel, so I guess we could find out soon. I don't see how it's a bad thing if they keep what killed the Jokey's on the ship a mystery? It seems like people now these days always want things to explain for them. It would be like if they explain what the Matrix was in the intro credits for the movie or show Ozymandias killing The Comedian in Watchmen .

Because those are questions that the plot revolves around, the reason behind why all the Jockey's are dead is apparently unimportant. In fact, apparently it was nothing, as there was nothing else on board the ship when they got on it. The digital recordings go unexplained s well. Why leave recordings of what happened everywhere? For whom re they? Especially when you aren't even showing what the threat is? All it is is a plot device that sets up the abandoned Ship. Nothing more. It's a sloppy loose end that is never resolved, which is simply lazy and insulting to the audience. And don;t excuse it with "Well there's going to be a sequel". For one thing, She and David are OFF the planet, and the ship where all the bad stuff happened was destroyed. They aren't going back there again. Also, great movies should be ble to stand on their own. A sequel is never a given. The sequel for Prometheus won't even be greenlight until it makes back at least twice it's budget. You can't rely on another film to shoulder your's up because it makes your film worse as an overall experience. Especially if there never IS a sequel. It's jsut a naive and lazy way to make a film or excuse poor or rushed writing. "Well it will be expanded on in the sequel". Well I may not want to see sequel, because as it stands, your movie kind of sucks.

But I digress, the ship's crew being dead? It's just mindless plot device. There's no real reasoning at all for the way anything on the ship is. I've heard a theory that the last living one was a mutineer. That was the only theory I;ve heard that makes logical sense, but as I stated before, it is clearly not going to be revisited, and it clearly wasn't important enough to the writers. It's just a shallow plot device.

[godzillathrilla]

I would also like to point out that the two doctors she fought off to get to the Magic Med table(that makes you instantly recover from massive surgical procedures that are executed within minutes while a patient is struggling), whom weren't knocked out, made no attempt to pursue this possibly dangerous contaminated person, or even report it to anybody. No one even KNEW she used the table apparently. And apparently she never told anyone about the monster squid thing, so they never followed up on it and let it squirm around the Med Lab. No cameras on this advanced research vessel apparently. I also love how she runs into the room where Weyland is, covered in blood and basically falling over, but everyone's just like, "Sup!". I'd also like to point out that for a machine that there are only 12 of in the universe, she sure knows how to use it perfectly.

This is really the only thing I 100% agree with you with, the rest i just feel you're mad at us, the people who liked the movie, so you bash it in all the ways you can to make us seem dumb for liking it.

[Svitska Donkun]

this is really the only thing i 100% agree with you with, the rest i think you're over examining a little to much.

Or maybe you and others here are examining it far too little, and are content to enjoy anything part of the Alien Franchise, or that has CG Monsters in it, regardless of how mediocre to outright bad it is. But then again, this is a Godzilla Forum that I am actually apart of, so I probably should've expected as much. And it's possibly a little bit Hypocritical to make such criticisms about people's attitudes here towards the movie. However, what absolves me is tht Godzilla films never pretend to be better than what they are. They are self aware in the sense that they know what they're there for and are honest enough in their story telling to never allude themselves to being better than they actually are. It's "Hey, let's make a movie where Godzilla fights a cyborg version of himself! That would be fun to see!" Prometheus, however, is actively trying to con people into believing it is far better than it actually is, and it is actually tricking people. If you strip away all the "big questions it dares the audience to ask", it's a schlocky monster movie rife with cliche's. This, I find to be extremely insulting to movies that legitimately ARE better and really ARE pushing boundaries. Prometheus is to 2001 as Avatar is to District 9. The former is manipulative, the latter is genuine.

Also, Alien is actually IN the movie, at least a Proto-Alien is, I thought this kind of obvious exploitation of a name character(That in reality has no sensical reason for being there, it being born on a DIFFERENT PLANET than the one in Alien) in hopes of making a connection to the audience, was so out of context with the pretentious weightiness of all the "Themes" and "Questions" prior that it would dissolve the widely held notion of this being "high-brow" Sci-fi almost immediately. It was so reminiscent of Schlocky, Horror, Blockbuster stylings that I'm not even sure Ridley put it in the film. It was so out of place and unnecessary, and ties the movie to Alien in a way Ridley Scott said he was never going to do. Great way to end your Intellectual Sci-fi Romp. With a non-cliffhanger clearly meant to exploit rather than provoke. What a skreeonk cop-out.

the rest i just feel you're mad at us

Nice edit.
Not mad at you guys, just disappointed. But again, as I said, I should've assumed as much given the normal content of this forum. But I wasn't even outwardly expressing my disappointment in you guys. I was expressing my disappointment in the movie. The movie I m legitimately mad at. I had more reason than any of you to love it, and I wanted to love it. I wanted it to be a masterpiece and see Ridley Scott return to true form, but he didn't. The movie was crap and he wasted my hopes and money. My most anticipated film all year was complete shit.

[CommanderJoe]

SPOILER HEAVY!!!!!!

Prometheus is one of the worst movies I've ever seen. I spent most of my time laughing at the screen at the senseless script(the hack who co-wrote is being brought in to "save" World War Z)
and the sad use of some terrific character actors. And when you go back and read some of the inane things the director has said about the important issues this movie rises, I laughed some more.

Some writers actually believe that by writing themselves into a corner and then starting new threads that go nowhere, they are composing works on the level of some religious tomes, like the Bible for instance. I can fill my script with parables and that will make it seem deep and philosophical, when in fact, like those religious tomes, they are DEAD ends to the meaning of existence.

There is no real "science" in this movie. One moron actually said that the reason one of the characters was able to walk after surgery was because of the advanced pharmaceuticals she was taking. BULLSHIT!

Why are the space jockeys chests exploded? This is a different planet from the original Alien but their chests are exploded? Why is the primordial Earth in the star chamber showing the planet as it exists today and not Pangea?

Why does Charlize Theron mention to Indris Elba they are only a few billion miles from Earth when they are in fact, trillions of miles away?

Why wouldn't an engineer ship have defense systems on it just in case some stupid progeny decides to ram it?

Why would any of the "scientists" do any of the things that they do in this movie?

How can a geologist become lost when he has access to a set of mapping droids?

Why would a biologist try to touch a species he has never seen before?

Why does this movie rip off so many others? Like both versions of the Thing (1951-!982)
Forbidden Planet, so much of Planet of the Vampires (Terrore nello spazio) that even the sounds from that film are replicated along with costumes and flame weapons?(The original Alien was a ripoff of It: The Terror from Beyond Space and Planet of the Vampires but it is a superior ripoff in every aspect) Star Trek The Motion Picture and don't forget the black oil from the X-Files!

Forbidden World, Galaxy of Terror, Leviathan, any one of the Quatermass films. The works of AE Van Vogt, Arthur C Clarke. Carl Jung, Freud. Every piece of Japanese alien torture porn ever made.

Why are the scientists so STUPID?

Again, why are the scientists so stupid?

One of the worst movies ever. I gave it a two at IMDB because I love to watch Theron do pushups and walk away from the camera constantly and the wonderful job the effects crew and art directors did (but pretty pictures do not a movie make, unless you think Terrence Malick is a skreeonk genius, which he isn't).

100% pure junk and Ridley Scott has officially joined his hack sibling Tony as one of the worst directors in Hollywood. Sad, but we still have Blade Runner.

[Legionmaster]

ITT: Hipster fanboys that are mad because Prometheus wasn't Alien.

[Svitska Donkun]

ITT: Hipster fanboys that are mad because Prometheus wasn't Alien.

This actually isn't what I wanted at all.

[Goji]

"why are the space jockey's chest exploded"

"This is a different planet than the one from the original Alien, but their chests are exploded"

Gee, maybe because (gasp!) this is the beginnings of the xenomorph species. Imagine that!

The fact that you weren't even able to piece this together makes your whole rant invalid as skreeonk, as far as I'm concerned.

[CommanderJoe]

"why are the space jockey's chest exploded"

"This is a different planet than the one from the original Alien, but their chests are exploded"

Gee, maybe because (gasp!) this is the beginnings of the xenomorph species. Imagine that!

The fact that you weren't even able to piece this together makes your whole rant invalid as skreeonk, as far as I'm concerned.

How does any of that make any of my criticisms of the inherent lack of logic in the script invalid?
Why have any of the engineers/soldiers/angels/demons/giants/ADAMS chests exploded? Explain it to me since you're obviously so much more intelligent than anybody else on these boards. While you're at it, explain all the rest of the inconsistencies and lapses in scientific logic in the movie. Please.

[Legionmaster]

There is no real "science" in this movie. One moron actually said that the reason one of the characters was able to walk after surgery was because of the advanced pharmaceuticals she was taking. BULLSHIT!

I'm not sure how you think this is unreasonable in any way. She is clearly shown to inject herself plenty of times. She even begins to meander in the hallway, injects herself, and continues. It's very clear that the drugs are helping.

Why are the space jockeys chests exploded? This is a different planet from the original Alien but their chests are exploded?

There's on unknown relationship to this facility on LV-233 and the crashed ship on LV-426, but it's very clearly shown that their black liquid weapon is what makes the Xenomorphs. It happens on one ship, it likely happens on another.

Why is the primordial Earth in the star chamber showing the planet as it exists today and not Pangea?

It's a 2000 year old ship. Pangea was looooong gone. This problem can be solved by simply paying attention to what you're watching.

Why does Charlize Theron mention to Indris Elba they are only a few billion miles from Earth when they are in fact, trillions of miles away?

She's speaking in hyperbole, in jest. It's not a number read off a dial.

Why wouldn't an engineer ship have defense systems on it just in case some stupid progeny decides to ram it?

The ship design is at least 2000 years old. Humans still weren't even aware of how the solar system worked, much less the galaxy. Why don't all automobiles have weapons just in case cockroaches decide to ram them in 2000 years with their post-nuclear winter automobile technology?

Why would any of the "scientists" do any of the things that they do in this movie?

Overgeneralized bitching is overgeneralized.

How can a geologist become lost when he has access to a set of mapping droids?

He doesn't have the map in front of him. The "pups" send the data back to the Prometheus.

Why would a biologist try to touch a species he has never seen before?

Should mankind ever come into contact with an alien critter, you can have valid precedent to make a case for this.

Why does this movie rip off so many others? Like both versions of the Thing (1951-!982)
Forbidden Planet, so much of Planet of the Vampires (Terrore nello spazio) that even the sounds from that film are replicated along with costumes and flame weapons?(The original Alien was a ripoff of It: The Terror from Beyond Space and Planet of the Vampires but it is a superior ripoff in every aspect) Star Trek The Motion Picture and don't forget the black oil from the X-Files!

Forbidden World, Galaxy of Terror, Leviathan, any one of the Quatermass films. The works of AE Van Vogt, Arthur C Clarke. Carl Jung, Freud. Every piece of Japanese alien torture porn ever made.

I don't have time to explain intertextuality to you.

Why are the scientists so STUPID?

Again, why are the scientists so stupid?

I already answered these above.

There you go. Challenge answered.

[bananaoil]

Legionmaster, I love you.

Prometheus is science fantasy. It's dealing with themes of a fantastic nature. Regardless, it's a phenomenal film and a worthy successor to Alien.