New kaiju game from Matt Frank + Simon Strange [Archive]

[Lenbo]

Viewing the monsters stats doesn't need to be an option in-game. Having them viewable at the character select screen (like they always have been) is perfectly fine.

Yeah, that's what I meant. Sorry if that wasn't clear. I meant holding the left trigger on the character select screen to bring up the stats that you currently have your cursor on, just as an example of how it could mechanically be done.

The online play was actually quit good..maybe you just had a bad experience with it *shrugs*. I played matches with four players all the time, and it was very rarely choppy. Two player matches were always spot on for me.

Comparing the online to play to a game that came out 4 years later on completely different hardware (Mario Kart Wii) seems like a pretty unfair fair comparison if you ask me.

Well G:U was on Wii, and considering this new game will be using a similar version of the Spigot engine as G:U for Wii, I think it's a somewhat relevant comparison. The fact that it supported 12 players and managed to be smooth is quite remarkable regardless.

Again, this is a video game, not a movie. The monsters are going to have certain actions that don't necessarily represent what they did in the films. Rolling is added for the sake of balance, because it allows you to escape what may otherwise be inescapable situations. It's been in Tekeen for decades for a reason.

Having only some monsters roll would be horrible unbalanced. I am highly against it.

I am aware we're talking about a video game and not a movie. I even said that gameplay-wise I liked rolling. Rolling just thematically doesn't make much sense for Godzilla and friends to be doing all the time.

Why would it be unbalanced if only some monsters rolled? Megaguiras, Mothra, and Moguera already didn't roll in StE. Unleashed had no rolling in it at all.

- Lenbo

[Supergeon]

I want to know what everyone thinks single player should be like.
Should it
A) Be an arcade ladder
B) Be a predetermined match order depending on monster picked (Exclusively monster matchups from films) keep in mind this would only apply to a TOHO or DAEI release..
C) G:U style where you have a map and can choose your location

[Supergeon]

All characters from G:U (Is this okay?)
Hedorah
Gorosaurus
Kamacuras FW
Kumonga FW
Battra (Larva and Imago)
Kamoebas
Gezora
Ganimes
Ebirah
Manda
Bagan
Monster X

That is asking a lot!

[hammysammy59]

I like B because it's basically like having an arcade ladder, but a cooler arcade ladder that is tailored to each monster. Hell, with the tailored ladders, the order of matches tells a story for each monster, without even having to use cut scenes and stuff. I'm not opposed to C, but I'd still want the map choices to be unique for each monster and have my map choices affect what other choices I can make, and how the story concludes.

[Mr. Strange]

I also think B - because it can be very interesting to have unusual match-up orders. In G:DAMM, for example, I loved that MKG fought Destoroyah first. People thought of Destoroyah as such a nasty fight - but MKG could absolutely clobber him - so just the fight order there really opened some people's eyes as to how the mechanics of the game worked.

[JVM]

Gotta agree on B, except for the movie match-ups rule. Strange put it nicely, I think, but I also think it adds an extra diversity - it gives you more reason to try out other monsters. If you play the same gang of monsters each time, why not just take the same player monster every time - plus it would eventually get boring.

[Living Corpse]

Maybe we can have a secret bonus boss fight after you beat the game under the right conditions like beat the game on hard mode.

[Goji]

Well G:U was on Wii, and considering this new game will be using a similar version of the Spigot engine as G:U for Wii, I think it's a somewhat relevant comparison. The fact that it supported 12 players and managed to be smooth is quite remarkable regardless.

Nope, nice save attempt there, but you were clearly comparing Godzila: Save the Earth's online play on the original Xbox to Mario Kart Wii's online play, which came out on superior hardware, 4 years later. You were not talking about G:U.

Yes, the online play was great for MKW, but again, the comparison doesn't make any sense.

I even said that gameplay-wise I liked rolling. Rolling just thematically make much sense for Godzilla and friends to be doing all the time.

Well..yeah, but we are talking about a video game, are we not? I don't understand the problem.

Why would it be unbalanced if only some monsters rolled? Megaguiras, Mothra, and Moguera already didn't roll in StE. Unleashed had no rolling in it at all.

I was talking about opponents that are actually grounded, and walk.

MOGUERA and Mothra larva were the ones who were more succceptable to getting stuck in certain situations agsinst a solid player because they couldn't escape a situation once grounded. For example, a Destoroyah player could demolish a grounded Mothra with his Katana Horn because she couldn't roll. Additionally, a good player can avoid MOG's get up attack, and keep pressuring them. Rolling allows monsters to escape certain situations. It needs to stay.

Some of you really need to give it a rest with these "it looks silly" or "they never did that in the movies", type of complaints. To make gameplay more interesting, small liberties need to be taken. I'm sorry, but this should be obvious to everyone..

[Oasis_S]

Some of you really need to give it a rest with these "it looks silly" or "they never did that in the movies", type of complaints. To make gameplay more interesting, small liberties need to be taken. I'm sorry, but this should be obvious to everyone..

I was thinking about this, and wondering if maybe because the visual style tries to present itself as "realistic" that maybe some expect the monsters to act "realistic" as well? Some things may look silly because they're being done in an... ATMOSPHERE that leads one to not expect it. So... if THAT'S the issue, then maybe the visual style should be less ...serious. So it's not taken as seriously.

Though, I would be in the "just get over it" boat like you. Don't want the gameplay compromised. Before you can make a good Godzilla game, you have to make a good game first. If you stripped away the charm the Godzilla license provides for the Pipeworks Godzilla series, would it still be enjoyable...?

[Godzillabrawler]

Not to bring up the size issue again, but I prefer the Heisei / Final Wars standard. For one, the awe-inspiring factor is appealing to those who don't watch the movies, because if they see that Godzilla is able to shouldknock over a skyscraper that could dwarf Kong... yeah. But for technical reasons, it is much easier. The models for environments don't have to be as big compared to the monsters, so you save space. New York is already massive in the Pipworks games... imagine how daunting it'd be to do that for a 50m monster vs an 100m monster.

Besides, like I said, the visual appeal is that the monsters are HUGE. I prefer it when Godzilla can knock over a small building by walking straight through it, whereas a Showa monster would have to work at it more.

[jdude1996]

Mr. Strange do u think it would be possible 2 have critical mass return but this time you can choose to either keep it or exchange it 4 a rage attack?

[matrix]

Mr. Strange do u think it would be possible 2 have critical mass return but this time you can choose to either keep it or exchange it 4 a rage attack?

Well, im no Mr. Strange, but I think that is pointless, rage seems alot cooler.

[Mr. Strange]

Mr. Strange do u think it would be possible 2 have critical mass return but this time you can choose to either keep it or exchange it 4 a rage attack?

I'm not fond of Rage Attacks, for a couple of reasons:

1 - They rely on getting a power-up. If you don't get it, you don't get the attack.
2 - They need to be triggered. If you don't (or can't) trigger it, you don't get the attack.
3 - People want them to be super-strong attacks, which makes the scarcity problems of #1 and #2 that much worse.
4 - They are complex, which means they need a lot of work if they are going to be guaranteed hits.

I'm much more in favor of giving monsters awesome regular moves, that they can use at will. For example, Destoroyah's Rage Attack used to be the Oxygen Destroyer Missile - in G:U I made that a 100% cost weapon, which he could use at will. I thought that was a lot more interesting.

Also, if the attacks aren't this awesome special super-damaging "Rage Attack" that gets all built up in the player's head - they can be allowed to miss, which means they are much less complex to implement, and gives us greater freedom in design & animation.

All of these terms are pretty meaningless - "special attack" "regular attack" and "rage attack" are all the same thing under the hood - but "Rage Attack" has a ton of preconceptions built up around it, which makes it really hand to please people.

[Blackout286]

Mr. Strange do u think it would be possible 2 have critical mass return but this time you can choose to either keep it or exchange it 4 a rage attack?

Ah, I know a game that had this kind of gameplay deal.

It was Naruto The Broken Bond, during combat whenever you fought or got hit you built up your rage meter. The rage meter had 3 levels, and each level obtained allowed the player's character to unlock and use the jutsu for the specific.

The first level was either a weak short cinematic jutsu (Like Shadow Clone Barrage) or a short timed power-up state (Self Regeneration or Sharingan)

The second level was a short but medium damaging cinematic jutsu, or a real time jutsu (Like Fireball Jutsu or Palm Rotation), or a much powerful state (Curse Seal/Curse Mark State 1)

The third level was a decently longer but the most powerful jutsu within the set, and it was cinematic.

Anyway, the game allowed this, HOWEVER, when you have a full rage meter, you could sacrifice the entire filled meter in order to enter a monstrous Rage Mode (However in this mode you cannot use any Special Attacks/Jutsu). Once the mode ends, the rage meter is completely empty and the player has to refill their rage meter all over again.

As you probably picked up by now, the character's special attacks/jutsu and Rage Mode are tied together by the Rage Meter. Because of that, you had to carefully manage yourself and your decisions.

Do I want to keep all of my unlocked abilities and fight with whatever chance I have? Or do I want to gain a massive advantage and sacrifice my abilities for awesome power?

It was pretty awesome, of course some characters only had two levels within their rage meter due to the lack of abilities that certain character held within the source material. With that, the developers made the first level bare medium damage potential, while the second one was the most powerful.

Anyway, I can see this idea work for a monster fighting game, it just has to be planned out and managed properly.(And have the special attacks be mostly real time)

[ゴジラ]

Mr. Strange do u think it would be possible 2 have critical mass return but this time you can choose to either keep it or exchange it 4 a rage attack?

Anyway, the game allowed this, HOWEVER, when you have a full rage meter, you could sacrifice the entire filled meter in order to enter a monstrous Rage Mode (However in this mode you cannot use any Special Attacks/Jutsu). Once the mode ends, the rage meter is completely empty and the player has to refill their rage meter all over again.

As you probably picked up by now, the character's special attacks/jutsu and Rage Mode are tied together by the Rage Meter. Because of that, you had to carefully manage yourself and your decisions.

Do I want to keep all of my unlocked abilities and fight with whatever chance I have? Or do I want to gain a massive advantage and sacrifice my abilities for awesome power?

I pretty much only use my jutsu, I only use rage mode whenever dealing with players online who use Orochimaru or any Itachi. And I normally come out on top during those encounters, but barely.

Don't forget in order to pull of a jutsu that you had to use a great deal of chakra (Energy for those who don't know), if someone interrupted you then the amount of you gathered up was lost, until your chakra bar regenerated it all on its own. (Although it restored itself in a mildly slow fashion, of course this was for balance).

I can see this in a Godzilla fighting game, but so long as the attacks are real time. (I'm not against cinematic specials, but real time would keep the action going).

[Lenbo]

I was thinking about this, and wondering if maybe because the visual style tries to present itself as "realistic" that maybe some expect the monsters to act "realistic" as well? Some things may look silly because they're being done in an... ATMOSPHERE that leads one to not expect it. So... if THAT'S the issue, then maybe the visual style should be less ...serious. So it's not taken as seriously.

You brought up the visual style of the game, and that's something I was thinking about too. How will this new game look?

I agree with you that the visual style doesn't need to be too serious. StE and G:U visually were more realistic and much darker than G:DAMM.

I felt that G:DAMM for Gamecube was the most visually appealing out of all the Pipeworks Godzilla games. It had a very bright, clean look to it. The lighting and the monsters didn't have all that cluttered, bumpy texturing they received in the subsequent games. The night stages had a cool neon, slick appearance to them.

StE had a rather muddy, messy look to a lot of the monsters and stages. I think that had a lot to do with the fact that it had to be made to work on PS2's limited hardware capabilities.

Unleashed was a step in the right direction, but I still felt the environments looked murky, and some of the monster's features were difficult to make out.

What do other people think? G:DAMM arguably looked the least realistic, but I felt it was the most aesthetically appealing. For a game that's supposed to be a fun brawler, G:DAMM on Gamecube nailed it visually.

With Matt Frank spear-heading the art direction, I think this game could return to a less gloomy looking Godzilla battling game. I'm looking forward to seeing what he has in mind for this game's look.

- Lenbo

[matrix]

You guys are going to hate me but, I like G:StE coloring of the monsters best, because I like it better dark, the other 2 were bright, and godzilla movies are dark too.

[Goji]

STE was not that visually different from DAM:M...in fact, the Xbox version looked better than both versions of DAM:M.

[Blackout286]

Well Lenbo, I'll say that G:DAMM's graphics are good, especially the monsters. I felt that Godzilla 90's, and a handful of other monsters looked great. And everything mostly did look smooth, especially during a fight whenever the camera would close in, or during the slow replays. You could see the mostly smooth texture of the monsters and everything.

But personally for me, I felt that G:U had the better visual presentation of both monsters and the game's environments.

Although like you Lenbo, I'm curious in seeing what Matt can dish for this possible game, but still I can't help but feel disappointed that there's little to no chance of Toho allowing Matt to design how the monsters appearance will look like in the game. A Godzilla animated/anime-ish like fighting would have been awesome to experience. But there is always DLC if there's enough funding and if enough people demand it.

[Living Corpse]

Guys, would you be cool with a bonus boss that you fight after meeting the right conditions, like beat the game on hard mode?