Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby GojiDog » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:36 am

The story mode for Unleashed is an incoherent mess.

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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby GodzillaBurgh » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:01 am

GojiDog wrote:The story mode for Unleashed is an incoherent mess.


Yeah, I know what you mean. Lots of backtracking to the same areas you've already been when you're either fighting a monster or destroying a crystal.
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby G&G-Fan » Thu Sep 06, 2018 4:14 pm

-Destoroyah being treated on the same tier as Gigan and Megalon despite being far more powerful then both. Seriously, he's the living incarnation of the oxygen destroyer and killed Godzilla Junior. He should be treated as more than just another minion evil monster. They also made him too skinny and purple instead of the badass red and black he was in the movie.
-Heisei and Showa Mechagodzilla's completely inaccurate portrayal. They bastardized both of them so bad. Heisei, which was a killing machine that relied mostly on long-ranged weapons was turned into a karate ninja robot which was terrible (and the ranged weapons he did have were really inaccurate), and Showa took way to many liberties with its model. The bendable fingers was terrible. I also hate how both of them have rotatable torsos. Way too cheesy. And Heisei Mechagodzilla was given the name of the 1975 Mechagodzilla.
-They neglected to add the Garuda to Heisei Mechagodzilla in G:STE (yes, they considered this, and it would've been awesome) because it wouldn't have allowed them to just copy-and-paste his model and moveset from the last game (I heard the reason why they scrapped him is because they would've had to redo the moveset). What laziness. Super Mechagodzilla is also badass. It would've been great.
-They called Kiryu "Mechagodzilla 3" in the first two games.
-Unleashed for the PS2 was half-assed. It was literally a copy of their previous game with two reskinned monsters that look awful.
-The Wii version, while better than the PS2 version, has so many glitches its ridiculous.
-They made MOGUERA say his own name. Probably the stupidest mecha sound effect I've ever heard in my life.
-They didn't allow you to select Mothra and Battra Larva and Imago separately so you can just either play as or fight against one form instead of having to play as or fight again both.
-Made Mothra an airstrike in G:DAMM and Battra an airstrike in G:STE because they were too lazy to make them into fully playable characters. Use the Super X's, the Gotengo, and the Garuda, not monsters that people would much rather be playing as!
-They called Gotengo "Atragon" in G:U........ seriously? Pipeworks, want a little Toho lesson? The name of the ship is Gotengo. The name of the movie is Atragon. Get it right. They're not the same thing. Jeez.
-You can't finish G:U Training Mode as Megaguirus because Simon Strange made a change and the game testers must've been lazy.
-The stories. Save the Earth could've had a much better story than another generic alien invasion story. For DAMM it was fine because it was a tribute to the film it's named after, Destroy All Monsters. But Save the Earth it just feels repetitive. Maybe something relating to the title like the previous game. A Hedorah centered story? Maybe there's a bunch of pollution making the monsters run wild, but at the end, it all combines into Hedorah and all the monsters must team up to fight him. They also could've done a Destoroyah centered story. Maybe the military is trying to create a new oxygen destroyer but accidentily create Destoroyah, who could wipe out all life on Earth if Earth's monsters don't unite and fight him. Meanwhile, the alien monsters join forces with Destoroyah so they can work together to kill all of Earth's monsters and wipe out humanity, and in the end betray Destoroyah and take the world for themself. Something INTERESTING. The Vortaak are also unnecessarily thrown into Unleashed. The SpaceGodzilla stuff was actually pretty cool, but the Vortaak stuff just makes me cringe. Basically, the Vortaak should've been gone after DAMM.
-Way too many liberties taken with the monster's abilities, and often they would unnecessarily mix and match incarnations (most notably, they gave Heisei Mothra poisoness powder (which only the Showa incarnation had) instead of her awesome and way cooler scale and lighting attack, and also gave her the stinger abdomen attack that only the GMK version had). Not every monster needed to be given a beam! Varan, Titanosaurus, Anguirus, and Rodan (they call him "Rodan", not "Fire Rodan", and he's not red, so he shouldn't have the uranium beam. It also would've made him more unique of a character) shouldn't have had beams. They had the potential to do something really cool with King Caesar but just gave him generic laser eyes instead.
-They made Megaguirus fire the beam of her opponent in G:U instead of her fireball, and made it so she can't drain energy from other monsters. They did it justice in Save the Earth, so why did they screw it up in Unleashed?
-Battra was cut from Unleashed for Wii for no reason, and in the PS2 one, his model looks awful, and he's literally a Mutant... what?! Did they even watch Godzilla vs. Mothra? How does "Battra was created by the Earth itself" equal being a mutant monster?
-Made every monster move as fast as Zilla. The monsters have no weight to them, especially in Unleashed. They are giant monsters. They should be presented as them. Kaiju are supposed to be slow, lumbering giants that can literally destroy buildings just from their sheer mass, not acrobatic and doing a bunch of gymnastics.
-Godzilla 1954 and 1990's models being inaccurate, not being in story and training mode, and having no music. With Heisei Godzilla being my favorite Godzilla (and series) and Godzilla 1954 being my second favorite I was so disappointed as a kid. It was great to play as them but I was so sad I couldn't play training or story as them.

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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby SuperPawnageGigan » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:34 am

Well. Destroyah is to op in medium mode in save the earth. I was trying to get the Godzilla vs Ebirah Challenge but Destroyah is to op on Medium mode.
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby G&G-Fan » Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:42 am

SuperPawnageGigan wrote:Well. Destroyah is to op in medium mode in save the earth. I was trying to get the Godzilla vs Ebirah Challenge but Destroyah is to op on Medium mode.

But his underwhelming presentation as just another minion kaiju (I can tell you for sure Destoroyah wouldn't take any poop from SpaceGodzilla; he wouldn't care that they are both mutant monsters, he would kick his ass) and his model are lackluster. Destoroyah should be treated as a big deal. They did it right in the PS4 game.

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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby UltramanGoji » Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:57 pm

Destoroyah wasn't even that big of a deal in his own movie. Godzilla was the much bigger threat. Destoroyah's the perfect example of a paper tiger in the Godzilla franchise. He looks tough and intimidating but really doesn't do anything that warrants his praise in the fandom. Dude dies from the military, for crying out loud.
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby Maritonic » Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:57 pm

UltramanGoji wrote:Dude dies from the military, for crying out loud.


But Godzilla coulda taken him, I tell ya!! :lol:
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby Godzillian » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:12 pm

Surprised that one guy who use to frequent the forums and worked on this game hasn't rushed in to defend it
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby G&G-Fan » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:54 pm

UltramanGoji wrote:Destoroyah wasn't even that big of a deal in his own movie. Godzilla was the much bigger threat. Destoroyah's the perfect example of a paper tiger in the Godzilla franchise. He looks tough and intimidating but really doesn't do anything that warrants his praise in the fandom. Dude dies from the military, for crying out loud.

Destoroyah killed Godzilla's son and held his own against Godzilla when he was at the height of his power (in his Burning form). It was only when Godzilla was getting really close to meltdown that he was getting torn apart. Regular Godzilla wouldn't have stood a chance. If it weren't for his instant regeneration he gained from absorbing all of that radiation from Birth Island exploding, Godzilla would've been sliced in half by Destoroyah's laser horn (you can see it literally goes through him).

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And the military had special freeze weapons designed to fight Destoroyah, as he was weak against the cold. It's the equivalent to what the cadmium missiles on the Super X did to Godzilla. Regular military artillery didn't do poop to Destoroyah.
Last edited by G&G-Fan on Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby UltramanGoji » Fri Sep 07, 2018 3:05 pm

All I'm seeing is a lot of fantasy match bullshit that means nothing to me and doesn't take into account narrative impact or anything like that.

Destoroyah was an underwhelming villain that didn't do anything noteworthy on screen to set him apart from any other Heisei-era villain. Him killing Junior makes us more sad for Junior than it makes us mad at Destoroyah. The character could be replaced with Gigan, Hedorah, or any other villainous kaiju and the film would've remained mostly the same. The only real creative touches to Destoroyah are his design (which is so outrageously structured that it wasn't able to be properly rendered in suitmation, thus it makes the most intimidating form an immobile brick) and his origin (which is mentioned a few times throughout the movie and ultimately doesn't thematically matter as it doesn't really collide with Godzilla in any way).
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby G&G-Fan » Fri Sep 07, 2018 3:30 pm

UltramanGoji wrote:All I'm seeing is a lot of fantasy match bullshit that means nothing to me and doesn't take into account narrative impact or anything like that.

Destoroyah was an underwhelming villain that didn't do anything noteworthy on screen to set him apart from any other Heisei-era villain. Him killing Junior makes us more sad for Junior than it makes us mad at Destoroyah. The character could be replaced with Gigan, Hedorah, or any other villainous kaiju and the film would've remained mostly the same. The only real creative touches to Destoroyah are his design (which is so outrageously structured that it wasn't able to be properly rendered in suitmation, thus it makes the most intimidating form an immobile brick) and his origin (which is mentioned a few times throughout the movie and ultimately doesn't thematically matter as it doesn't really collide with Godzilla in any way).

I'm just stating what happened in the movie. I literally even included an image from the movie as proof. You're just being salty because for some reason you don't like Destoroyah.

I could say the same about Gigan in Godzilla vs. Gigan. The film would've remained mostly the same if it was some other monster. Replace him with Megalon, what difference does it make to the plot of the film? None. Same could be said for Anguirus in Raids Again (what if he was replaced with Rodan or Baragon? Wouldn't make a difference either), King Ghidorah, Ebirah, Kamacuras and Kumonga, Megalon, Titanosaurus, Orga, the guardian monsters in GMK (they made Ghidorah a guardian monster, so clearly nothing is stopping them; plus the guardian monsters were originally going to be different in an early draft, but they changed them, showing that it really didn't make a difference who the three were), and every kaiju featured in Final Wars besides Godzilla. But it was cool to see them. Same thing with Destoroyah. It doesn't make him bad as a kaiju. So I guess you also hate Anguirus, Gigan, Megalon, King Ghidorah, Kamacuras, Kumonga, Titanosaurus, Orga, the GMK guardian monsters, and Monster X.

Godzilla vs. Destoroyah makes lots references to the original, which is awesome. It was meant to be the last movie, so having the plot relate to the original (mostly the oxygen destroyer) makes it go full circle. It's a great way of ending the series. And having the final villain's origin relate to the original is another way the movie goes about making references to it.

Whether you like him or not (which I do, a lot), Destoroyah is shown to be a very powerful monster in the film (no other villain would've stood a chance against Burning Godzilla, I guarantee you. Godzilla's uranium spiral ray when he was normal destroyed Super Mechagodzilla and SpaceGodzilla, and his blue spiral ray blew off Ghidorah's middle head. Destoroyah took several hits of Burning Godzilla's extremely powerful spiral ray that was over a million degrees celcius), so they should've treated him better in these three games.
Last edited by G&G-Fan on Fri Sep 07, 2018 3:35 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby Zarm » Fri Sep 07, 2018 3:44 pm

Welllll... it destroyed SpaceGodzilla after he took 76 other hits from a combination of Godzilla and a super-advanced 2nd-generation mech improved from a mech reverse-engineered future technology, and only after his central power source was taken out. So, I mean, I think he could've stood tough against BG, too. :)
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby UltramanGoji » Fri Sep 07, 2018 4:28 pm

G&G-Fan wrote:I'm just stating what happened in the movie. I literally even included an image from the movie as proof. You're just being salty because for some reason you don't like Destoroyah.


Quite the contrary. I like Destoroyah and, hell, I even like the movie too. It's the revisionist history that certain fans spout about him being an apocalyptic, nightmarish beast/one of Godzilla's toughest foes that I hate. The cracks about his design and history are more cracks at the film's faults displaying these aspects than anything about the concept of Destoroyah as a character.

G&G-Fan wrote:Really weird argument about replacing the monsters in the movies with others that doesn't even come close to what I was originally saying.


You clearly misunderstood my point, which I can take some of the blame for as I explained it poorly.

The argument of "removing a monster" doesn't argue that the monster is bad, but that the monster is an outlier in their own movie. The central plot of Godzilla vs. Destoroyah does not focus on the appearance of the titular antagonist monster, but Godzilla's meltdown. Destoroyah just happens to be a third party that shows up around the same time as humanity tries to deal with the eventual destruction of their planet. The goal of the film's characters is not to defeat Destoroyah, it's to stop Godzilla's meltdown. In this case, removing Destoroyah from the movie doesn't really change much in regards to the film's core plot. Like I said, it's not a matter of "character bad", it's a matter of "screenwriting bad".

G&G-Fan wrote: So I guess you also hate Anguirus, Gigan, Megalon, King Ghidorah, Kamacuras, Kumonga, Titanosaurus, Orga, the GMK guardian monsters, and Monster X.


I mean, I hate Titanosaurus and don't really care about Kamacuras or Kumonga... :lol:

G&G-Fan wrote:Godzilla vs. Destoroyah makes lots references to the original, which is awesome.


The film can drop a lot of references, but if those references don't connect solidly with the new story the film is telling, then it ultimately doesn't matter.


G&G-Fan wrote:It was meant to be the last movie, so having the plot relate to the original (mostly the oxygen destroyer) makes it go full circle.


But it doesn't.

Godzilla's condition, the core of the film, is not something related to the original. Godzilla's meltdown is caused by something that happened off-screen linked to the last movie. Destoroyah was created from the Oxygen Destroyer, yes, but outside of some brief expository mentions in the dialogue, this ultimately does not come into play with the film itself besides just being the backstory for Destoroyah.

To make the movie really connect with the original, the cause of Godzilla's meltdown should've been from Destoroyah itself. Destoroyah's origin from the Oxygen Destroyer should've been what caused Godzilla to begin dying in the first place. Having Godzilla's second true death linked with his first would've been much more emotional and impactful.


G&G-Fan wrote:Destoroyah took several hits of Burning Godzilla's extremely powerful spiral ray that was over a million degrees celcius...


This is the fantasy match nonsense stuff that I'm talking about. I don't care about imaginary stats that have no bearing on the structure of the film. The technical aspect of all the matches are so boring, so dull, and based on arbitrary stats that ultimately are nothing but nonsensical filler to keep stat nerds interested because, for some reason, they tend to care more about rubber monster combat then they do about narrative structure, character developments, and the basic aspects of what makes a good film a good film.

When I watch GvD, I don't see this uber-powerful monster that all the guidebooks claim is the most powerful foe Godzilla's faced, I see a standard Heisei-era monster with an interesting yet underdeveloped origin and a neat but not very articulate design.
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby PitchBlackProgress » Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:54 pm

^ This. This to the 4th power! I seriously hope this post isn’t ignored because it hits the nail on the head so hard, I’m speechless. :lol:
Yeah, Godzilla wins... sometimes. I mean, he was killed by Dr. Serizawa's patented bubble-bath formula, heartburn, missiles, and poor box office returns, got his ass kicked by a drunken, circus-escaped gorilla, then he was beaten by two newborn worms, yeah some “king”.
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby Zarm » Sat Sep 08, 2018 5:06 am

Agreed.

Y'know, except for the part dissing fantasy matches and stat nerds. :) But especially that second-to-last section.
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby TitanoGoji16 » Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:54 am

Living Corpse wrote:Godzilla: Unleashed.

Nuff said.


Aw, you beat me to it. :lol:
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby alextheburger » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:34 am

Godzilla unleashed double smash
(i know it says trilogy but hey its a pipework Godzilla game)
the concept of a godzilla sidescroller on the ds has promise but what happened?
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby GigaBowserG » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:48 am

alextheburger wrote:Godzilla unleashed double smash
(i know it says trilogy but hey its a pipework Godzilla game)
the concept of a godzilla sidescroller on the ds has promise but what happened?


That one was Santa Cruz Games, not Pipeworks, though it did use plenty of sound assets from the trilogy. (Some wikis like to mistakenly credit Pipeworks for it.)
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby alextheburger » Sun Oct 21, 2018 10:04 am

GigaBowserG wrote:
alextheburger wrote:Godzilla unleashed double smash
(i know it says trilogy but hey its a pipework Godzilla game)
the concept of a godzilla sidescroller on the ds has promise but what happened?


That one was Santa Cruz Games, not Pipeworks, though it did use plenty of sound assets from the trilogy. (Some wikis like to mistakenly credit Pipeworks for it.)


oh
i didn't know that
i thought they did
then nevermind
Last edited by alextheburger on Sun Oct 21, 2018 10:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Say something negative about the Pipeworks trilogy

Postby PitchBlackProgress » Sun Oct 21, 2018 10:54 pm

Unleashed has zero replay value after unlocking everybody.
Unleashed comes off as so unimaginably rushed, it almost doesn’t seem like a game at all, just a series of repeating levels thrown at you.
And the lag, I could go on for days about that lag.
Yeah, Godzilla wins... sometimes. I mean, he was killed by Dr. Serizawa's patented bubble-bath formula, heartburn, missiles, and poor box office returns, got his ass kicked by a drunken, circus-escaped gorilla, then he was beaten by two newborn worms, yeah some “king”.
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