I'm New To The Godzilla Franchise

[DaveTheAnalyzer]

Crackle.com legally has the original Mothra and many of the Heisei and Millenium films. However, they are dub only, so think that what you will (I'm personally fond of the Hong Kong dub, even if there seems to be only six voices).

And there were two Godzilla cartoons. The first was made by Hanna Barbara of Scooby Doo fame and it's...divisive, like the American Godzilla. The first 13 out of 26 episodes are availabe at Hulu, so you could judge for yourself.

The second cartoon was inspired by the American Godzilla, and many consider it to be the best thing that came out of the whole mess of a movie. IMHO, it's not the Japanese Godzilla, but it manages to form a nice identity of its own and the human characters are a fun, snarky bunch.

[tymon]

Only on TK would people argue what video release a newcomer should buy.

Who's arguing? We were discussing the details of different releases of the same film, brah.

..And I see my man already went with the Criterion, nice. Still, if you're gonna get the CM discs too, I would just pick up the Godzilla Collection boxset - it breaks down to $3.50 per film that way for seven movies.

[JVM]

I'll buy both, although my GODZILLA Criterion will be arriving tomorrow from Amazon. So I'll invest myself into that first. Then I'll buy the classic media version with my next paycheck.

Well if you already went for the Criterion release, not much reason to go for CM yet. Criterion version IS superior to the CM release, I just wished to make the point I don't think a newer fan would see a tremendous amount of difference compared to the more senior ones around here.

[James23873]

In case you don't know already, the series has several different continuities. It goes like this.

Godzilla (original)-Terror of Mechagodzilla (Technically speaking Destroy all Monsters is last because it took place in the then future 1999, but you don't have to watch it last. Also, other non godzilla movies tied into this series are Rodan, Varan, Mothra, Atragon, Frankeinstein vs. Baragon, War of the Gargantuas, and King Kong Escapes.)

Godzilla/The Return of Godzilla-Godzilla vs Destoroyah. (This series ignored all previous movies with The Return of Godzilla acting as a direct sequel to the original movie.)

The American Godzilla completely stands on it's own and was followed by the show Godzilla The Series, a cartoon.

The third series is divided into several different continuities that would take forever to explain. Here's a link to an article that explains it all. http://www.tohokingdom.com/articles/art_mill_conti.htm

Just thought I'd let you know, this way you won't be watching Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah and wondering why they never heard of him before.

[Tyler]

Also, other non godzilla movies tied into this series are Rodan, Varan, Mothra, Atragon, Frankeinstein vs. Baragon, War of the Gargantuas, and King Kong Escapes.

I thought it was only Rodan and Mothra and even then it was very loosely.

[Kaiju-King42]

Also, other non godzilla movies tied into this series are Rodan, Varan, Mothra, Atragon, Frankeinstein vs. Baragon, War of the Gargantuas, and King Kong Escapes.

I thought it was only Rodan and Mothra and even then it was very loosely.

Everyone's interpretation of what's connected in the showa era is valid. Toho hasn't yet come up with an official timeline anyway. I personally would add Mysterians and Space Amoeba into his list, for example.

[DagarahX]

I wanted to post early after watching the Japanese Godzilla 1954 Version, but you know how life can be. Throwing unexpected factors and always playing an obstacle in your way without much reason. Oh well.

Anyway, here's what I thought about them:

Gojira:

The Original Godzilla film, within its true format.

The film was pretty straight forward and admitting here and now, this Godzilla was pretty haunting. Sure, there's the GMK Godzilla and it drives that same feeling home within its design, but the original is something that can never be replaced completely due to how he was used during the film IMO.

Anyway,

A number of ship vessels are sent to a watery hell (The first being the Eiko Maru, a fishing vessel, the other is the Bingo Maru) by a monstrous sea of flames. Of course reports are sent in about the events happening off the coast of Oto(Or as some would say Odo) Island, and it is soon investigated. Upon the island, the film tells that the villagers worshiped a legend, or God named Godzilla. A terrifying beast that lived out in the sea that they sent female sacrifices, thinking it would please Godzilla and in return he would not cause a fish shortage and would not cause destruction.

Later during one stormy night, thunderous foot-steps echo throughout the island, and destruction soon follows. In the morning the damage is revealed, and in turn another investigation is set into motion but through a group of scientist. Dr. Kyohei Yamane becomes the central focus at this part of the film, which told me that he was a important character in the film. And of course there's Emiko, Yamane's daughter (I'll open that box later). Large doses of radiation is found at the sight of the destruction, as well as a massive foot print and a prehistoric horseshoe crab fossil within it. Suddenly, the village's (I guess) alarm bell sounded and everyone went up to the hill, and as they go the thunderous foot steps are heard once more.
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Cut, at this point within the film, a friend of mine had shown up and ended up watching the film with me. I brought him up to speed then continued. Although he did make a few comments.

Comment 1:

Friend: "Hold on, pop the breaks there. Godzilla had worshipers? And they sacrificed young Japanese girls to him hoping that it would please him?"

Me: "That is correct."

Friend: "Huh...So that's how Chuck Norris was conceived. "


Comment 2:

Friend: "Wait, wait, let me absorb this...The village has sound off the bell, the giant monster is coming...And everyone is heading toward the direction of the giant monster? Look I know 'curiosity killed the cat' but there's just no common sense in that!"

Me: "Dude, it happens in most films, be it slashers, or creatures, or giant monsters it happens. Even in film from today's generation as well."

Friend: "Exactly! Have we not learned from our past mistakes?"

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Going onward, Godzilla makes himself know to the world of mankind, and as expect, people flee for their lives. After the event, Japan learns about the king of monsters from Dr. Yamane and from the evidence that he had managed to collect. Of course, Japan does not want Godzilla around due to seeing him as an obvious threat to them and possibly to the entire world. Soon the order of depth charges to be sent out was given, and later everyone believes that Godzilla had been killed.
And later on during the evening, the King himself returns the deed by briefly terrorizing Tokyo before returning back to the sea. I had to admit, the music playing during Godzilla's rampage really sold that Godzilla was truly an unstoppable force, even if it was a short attack the film managed to get the point across.

Next day, Japan prepares themselves, having a seemingly flawless plan that would protect Tokyo from Godzilla. A giant blockade of electric towers/power-lines. Of course, night rolls along, and the King once again rises from his aquatic realm to establish his dominance, and showcase the nightmarish power that mankind had foolishly granted it. And I'll admit, the suspense was fairly built up and stacked when Godzilla made his way over to the blockade and stopped to look at it. I was deeply invested into the film at this point.
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Cut, right at this very moment, my friend made a comment through a common joke, but it still made me laugh lol

Friend: "Japan's strongest defense ever built! Upon this day, Japan saw it as the greatest, most horrifying day of their entire lives. But for Godzilla...It was a Tuesday."

Right after that statement, the very second it was finished, the power lever was turn on and Godzilla tore through the blockade. It was the perfect moment lol.

Due note that it was the last joke he made, because after seeing the grand scale of Godzilla's rampage, and the huge choir of children singing, any funny bone he had was pretty much broken. Hell even I was speechless and did not say anything. The film was that strong at that point.
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Of course after a monster's grand display, there will always be someone or something that stops it in the end. That someone was Dr. Serizawa, and that something was the Oxygen Destroyer. A scientist who had discovered a unbelievable power, a power that's as destructive and equal to Godzilla himself. This character, is the only character who I managed to connect with and understand. He's a tragic character but for understanding reasons that someone makes the viewer feel more invested into the character. Everything that he said made sense, the weapon was too powerful to be used, and that humans are somewhat weak animals for when under pressure will eventually give in and spill all the beans. When he started burning the papers of his work, I was wondering if he was just going to keep the secret all to himself and just move on to something else, sadly, that was not the case.

Before moving onward, let me tell everyone the character I did not like. Emiko. Maybe its how she loved someone else and didn't bother to try to tell her father or Dr. Serizawa about it. Sure, it was a arranged marriage, and that's understandable. But at least let it be known and give the doc a heads up. Or maybe, its how she just keeps breaking down and crying nearly all the time. Ogata, eh...I don't have much to say about. Although he was a bit of a dick when trying to take the Oxygen Destroyer away from Serizawa.

My friend didn't like Emiko either, although he did make another comment.
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Friend: "This women is starting to become annoying. Really. I'm struggling with Ogata here, and after the struggle the first person you check up on is him?!"

Me: "He is bleeding ya know."

Friend: "And? We're soon to be married, she's suppose to be checking up on me first then him. I know he was thinking the same thing when that little scene unfolded in front of his very eyes. Well, he was probably thinking that and praying that Ogata wouldn't charge for assault."
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The conclusion comes along, Godzilla was dead, and Dr. Serizawa had committed suicide (For understandable yet tragic reasons). The whole scene was gravely sad, and I did shed a tear(A manly tear), especially when he wished Ogata a happy life with Emiko. That alone made me gain a new respect for the character.

My friend thought it was sad as well, although he was hoping that Godzilla would just pick up Emiko and drag her down with him.

Overall, I enjoyed Gojira very much. The characters were well done (Including Emiko, and don't worry folks, I understand her position within the matter and understand how stressful it could be.), Godzilla was godly as ever, the atmosphere, the music, the whole film was just amazing. Oh, and my friend has taken a slight interest within Godzilla as well. So TohoKingdom you might get another new member on here soon.

Now, tomorrow I will watch the American Version. And I will let you know how I feel about that one and the changes it has.

[Living Corpse]

Your friend should make riffs.

[GreenAiden555]

Everyone's interpretation of what's connected in the showa era is valid. Toho hasn't yet come up with an official timeline anyway. I personally would add Mysterians and Space Amoeba into his list, for example.

Batman from the '60's TV show is valid, then.


Do the movies have references or monsters in the Godzilla series? Yes? No?

There's your answer.

[DagarahX]

Your friend should make riffs.

He'd probably be very skilled in that area lol, although it seems that its an influence due to over-exposure to the Mystery Science Theater 3000 when he was much younger.

[Goji]

Also, other non godzilla movies tied into this series are Rodan, Varan, Mothra, Atragon, Frankeinstein vs. Baragon, War of the Gargantuas, and King Kong Escapes.

I thought it was only Rodan and Mothra and even then it was very loosely.

Everyone's interpretation of what's connected in the showa era is valid. Toho hasn't yet come up with an official timeline anyway. I personally would add Mysterians and Space Amoeba into his list, for example.

They most likely never will, either.

Tyler is correct. The only films that are really hinted at to exist in the Showa (Godzilla) time line are MOTHRA (due to Mothra's existence already being known in 1964) and RODAN (A Rodan emerges from Mount Aso in GHIDORAH, the same volcano where the other two Rodan burned to death).

Anything else is reaaaally stretching it. Using DESTROY ALL MONSTERS isn't a good example either. It was meant as a send off film for Godzilla and co., which is why Toho threw practically all of their monsters into one film (despite some of them being "dead").

[Godzilla 1995]

Anything else is reaaaally stretching it. Using DESTROY ALL MONSTERS isn't a good example either. It was meant as a send off film for Godzilla and co., which is why Toho threw practically all of their monsters into one film (despite some of them being "dead").

I assume you're speaking of Kumonga here?

And also, where would Frankenstein, Baragon, and Gorosaurus fit into the timeline? How'd they get in DAM?

[Goji]

Uh, how about Kumonga, Varan, Baragon AND Gorosaurus? They were all killed in their debut films.

I literally just said in my last post that DAM can't be used as an example, because Toho intended it to be the last Godzilla film. The film makers didn't care about continuity (which has already been discussed to death on these forums). Monsters like Gorosaurus were used simply because the suit was in such good condition, what with it not even being a year old at the time.

Even still, there is nothing to suggest films like VARAN or FRANKENSTEIN VS. BARAGON are canon with the Godzilla series. And we all know KING KONG ESCAPES isn't. It's clearly it's own "thing".

[Godzilla 1995]

Uh, how about Kumonga, Varan, Baragon AND Gorosaurus? They were all killed in their debut films.

Yes, I know that, I was just confirming that was what you meant, is all.

[NSZ]

Even still, there is nothing to suggest films like ... FRANKENSTEIN VS. BARAGON are canon with the Godzilla series.

Alright, I'll use examples that aren't DAM.
FvB:
- During the sequence when our heroes are consulting paleontologists on the possibility of Baragon's existence, a model of Anguirus is seen behind Kumi Mizuno's head.
War of the Gargantuas (It is the sequel):
- Oodako and the fact that the authorities don't even bat an eyelid about him.
- The Type-66 Maser Cannon. Was properly introduced here and went on to appear in Gigan, and not just as stock footage.

There, three examples on why it's canon.

[Goji]

-Telesdon is seen in sketches in TERROR OF MECHAGODZILLA. I don't think anyone is going to argue that the original ULTRAMAN series is canon with the Showa Godzilla series. Also, a model of King-Goji is seen in BIOLLANTE. That Godzilla didn't even exist in that universe.

-The Oodako example is silly, sorry. How else would they have reacted? "Oh! It's that giant octopus that battled Kong!" (that none of them ever saw happen, and probably never even heard about).

-You're talking about 70's Godzilla here. Slashed budgets meant lots of re-used props.

You're just grasping at straws dude, sorry. These aren't examples as to "why it's canon", they're examples as to why you think it's canon.

[NSZ]

- And that was done years after FvB. You can't use something done in 1975 as an argument as to why something done in 1965 would be nothing more than a shoutout.

- Oh I don't know, if Oodako was completely unknown as you suggest, I'd suspect they'd react something along the lines of 'There's a giant octopus off shore attacking ships!?' instead of just behaving as though it were just another flippin' Tuesday.

- Hah, well if this ain't the finest example of ignoring a counterpoint just because it doesn't fit your argument that I ever did see.

I'm stopping now before this gets drawn out.

[Living Corpse]

Guys, Maguma was planned in DAM originally. In his debut film the moon is destroyed yet a good chunk of DAM takes place on the moon. Even when Toho reuses monsters doesn't mean it's the same monster or even the same universe.

[Goji]

- And that was done years after FvB. You can't use something done in 1975 as an argument as to why something done in 1965 would be nothing more than a shoutout.

- Oh I don't know, if Oodako was completely unknown as you suggest, I'd suspect they'd react something along the lines of 'There's a giant octopus off shore attacking ships!?' instead of just behaving as though it were just another flippin' Tuesday.

- Hah, well if this ain't the finest example of ignoring a counterpoint just because it doesn't fit your argument that I ever did see.

I'm stopping now before this gets drawn out.

-It's an example of a monster being shown that clearly isn't canon with the film. It's a perfectly relevant example, guy.

-Oodako example is still silly. Nobody reacted strongly to it being a sea dwelling creature walking on land, much less that it was a giant octopus. Besides, who knows if it's even the same one from the Godzilla series. That's just speculation, and nothing more.

-That's cute, but it's obviously the reason they were included in GIGAN. The budget for that film was about half of what DESTROY ALL MONSTERS WAS, IIRC. Learn more about why Toho films were the way they were in the 1970's, and get back to me.

LC's example is yet another reason why a film like DAM was never meant to be taken seriously. Sanda and Gaira were originally planned in the film as well, along with Maguma. All three of them were dead monsters.

Why is it so hard for some of you to accept that Toho didn't give two shits about continuity? This shouldn't be this hard to swallow.

[Living Corpse]

Hell Toho wanted to use King Kong in DAM as well but they didn't have the money. Such a shame, would have been cool seeing the Eight Wonder of The World and the King of The Monsters team up to kill the King of Terror.