Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

For discussions covering more than one Toho film or show that span across more than one “era.”

Is Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

No
59
95%
Yes
3
5%
 
Total votes: 62

User avatar
tymon
EDF Soldier
Posts: 3674
Joined: Tue May 24, 2011 10:56 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby tymon » Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:11 pm

GodzillaSpawn wrote:I literally cringe at the last-minute "You know, I've learned something today" type of forced dialogue that is shoved down our thoats before the credits roll, especially in the range from Godzilla vs. Mothra through Godzilla vs. Space Godzilla.

The one at the end of Monster Zero was pretty bad too. Thankfully the charisma of Takarada and Adams saves that final scene.
JAGzilla wrote:And then there was The Giant Condor. He...seemed very dedicated to what he was doing?

User avatar
GodzillaSpawn
JXSDF Technician
Posts: 881
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:15 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby GodzillaSpawn » Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:25 pm

Agreed. Presentation and delivery can make it or break it.

Those two guys truly made Monster Zero a fun film. The Hesei films I indicated above didn't really have that. As I'm sure you will agree, the thought of saving the earth, caring about the planet or mother nature is a great theme in a film, especially in the early 90's before it has become completely played out and run-of-the-mill. But the delivery from the characters was brutal.

And, "life vs. artificial life"...?

:roll: X_X

:P
Last edited by GodzillaSpawn on Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

edgaguirus
Kwaidan
Posts: 5503
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 1:25 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby edgaguirus » Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:33 pm

They played off eachother well. Their characters, aided by a good script, made MZ a fun film.
Kaiju are just like people- giant, radioactive people.

Megalon went into a bar and saw Gigan. Megalon said, " Again? I thought you gave this up."
" What can I say," Gigan asked. " I'm hooked."

User avatar
GodzillaSpawn
JXSDF Technician
Posts: 881
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:15 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby GodzillaSpawn » Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:40 pm

Also the Xilians costumes.

I still cannot decide to this day if Toho made them corky on purpose or if they really thought they made some badass and scary looking aliens.

User avatar
Tohosaurus
E.S.P.Spy
Posts: 4831
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:35 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby Tohosaurus » Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:26 am

GodzillaSpawn wrote:Really? Lucky you.

I literally cringe at the last-minute "You know, I've learned something today" type of forced dialogue that is shoved down our thoats before the credits roll, especially in the range from Godzilla vs. Mothra through Godzilla vs. Space Godzilla.

But all those other things you mentioned only make it more painful.

And Mechagodzilla II (man vs machine and parenting). Personally I didn't feel that preached too even if it was there, just again unimpressive movies.
고질라

한국, 일본: 친교

Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. -Ian Maclaren

User avatar
eabaker
Seatopian Daikaiju
Posts: 11137
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 6:16 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby eabaker » Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:43 pm

Living Corpse wrote:As long as the message is delivered well like in Gojira, Hedorah,ROG, Biollante or GMK then I'm okay with a deeper meaning to the film. Otherwise it just feels tacked on if they don't do it well.



Exactly. I don't think the problem with the later Heisei films is the inclusion of deeper themes; I think it's the fact that those themes are addressed in such a shallow, offhand way. They're not fundumental to the movies, they're tacked on, which makes the finished product empty and preachy.
Tokyo, a smoldering memorial to the unknown, an unknown which at this very moment still prevails and could at any time lash out with its terrible destruction anywhere else in the world.

User avatar
GodzillaSpawn
JXSDF Technician
Posts: 881
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:15 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby GodzillaSpawn » Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:38 pm

Co-signed. This might come across as a joke, but the way an episode ends on "South Park" with Kyle or Stan saying "I learned something today.." (and then they go off on this ridiculous rant where they clearly have still missed the broader point) reminds me of the end of those Godzilla films. Except the Godzilla films are trying to be taken seriously. Not because they miss the point, but because how they actually reach that POV at the end just feels completely scripted. And it's delivered in the same fashion.

User avatar
Tohosaurus
E.S.P.Spy
Posts: 4831
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:35 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby Tohosaurus » Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:53 pm

Living Corpse wrote:As long as the message is delivered well like in Gojira, Hedorah,ROG, Biollante or GMK then I'm okay with a deeper meaning to the film. Otherwise it just feels tacked on if they don't do it well.

Monsters make for great symbolism and metaphors for many things, including the dangers of science crossing the line and going too far and going way, Way, WAY wrong. I would want LP to take advantage of that but only if they do it well and not just tack on the "Godzilla = Weapons of Mass Destruction" at the end.

This.
고질라

한국, 일본: 친교

Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. -Ian Maclaren

User avatar
eabaker
Seatopian Daikaiju
Posts: 11137
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 6:16 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby eabaker » Wed Oct 17, 2012 2:06 pm

NSZ wrote:The message tacked on at the end of GvsMGII with the 'Life vs Artificial Life' came out of left field, really. Showa MechaGodzilla and Kiryu are artificial lifeforms being capable of performing actions without the need of an operator, UN MechaGodzilla is a skreeonking toaster incapable of doing anything without an operator. It's NOT an artificial lifeform by any means.


Indeed not. The line has more significance if you take into account the deleted scene revealing that the character who says it was an android, but, even then, it's not something that was properly seeded throughout the movie. The movie is closer to being about valuing the natural environment over technological progress, but even that isn't really used in any meaningful way.
Tokyo, a smoldering memorial to the unknown, an unknown which at this very moment still prevails and could at any time lash out with its terrible destruction anywhere else in the world.

User avatar
Tohosaurus
E.S.P.Spy
Posts: 4831
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:35 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby Tohosaurus » Wed Oct 17, 2012 5:23 pm

eabaker wrote:Indeed not. The line has more significance if you take into account the deleted scene revealing that the character who says it was an android, but, even then, it's not something that was properly seeded throughout the movie. The movie is closer to being about valuing the natural environment over technological progress, but even that isn't really used in any meaningful way.

I hadn't heard of that. I hope deleted scenes in some of these movies end up on future releases. We've had decent releases of most G movies, save GvB (soon) and G85 (not at all), but the next step is more consistent offerings of proper subs and extras.
고질라

한국, 일본: 친교

Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. -Ian Maclaren

User avatar
Carthormerr
Interpol Agent
Posts: 570
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:57 am
Location: Devil's Island

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby Carthormerr » Wed Oct 17, 2012 5:33 pm

Well dead, slowed down, whatever anyone wants to call it. All I know is there is a movie coming soon, old movies being released for the first time on dvd, and a string of comics. This is far more than I can recall since gino, so I would consider it gaining good momentum
"A monster can live forever"

User avatar
Showa Gyaos
Keizer
Posts: 8543
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2010 5:06 pm
Location: West Virginia

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby Showa Gyaos » Thu Oct 18, 2012 10:45 am

Merchandise has been produced for eight years since GFW's release. If the franchise was dead, production would have ceased by now.
ScrumpBump wrote:
BARAGONBREH wrote:What a crap "theory". It's a great time to be alive though, I guess. Buy yourself a MacBook, spout some BS and post it on YouTube and you can make a buncha money.


Kong is Ness and Skull Island is apart of Undertale.

Gib money.

User avatar
Gojisan866
Interpol Agent
Posts: 701
Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:31 pm
Location: 20,000 fathoms under the sea.

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby Gojisan866 » Fri Oct 19, 2012 11:26 am

Not at all. It's still got a huge fanbase, as seen by this VERY WEBSITE, and if Legendary does a good job with the reboot, it may turn some younger people (as in my age who aren't already fans) onto the series.
I'm back? I guess. Haven't posted here in a loooooong time.

User avatar
Rody
E.S.P.Spy
Posts: 5143
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:55 am

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby Rody » Fri Oct 19, 2012 2:22 pm

Hopefully, there will be at least a FEW people who end up giving the old films another try, and realize how good they actually are; thus becoming more serious fans.

User avatar
Tohosaurus
E.S.P.Spy
Posts: 4831
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:35 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby Tohosaurus » Fri Oct 19, 2012 2:32 pm

Legion1979 wrote:OR (and this is VERY likely) it will turn some younger people into fans of Legandary's version of the character and not necessarily of the Toho version.

I guarantee you that two years from now we're going to be swamped with new members who think even Toho's newer Godzilla films are silly, campy, ridiculous, phoney poop compared to the dark, realistic, CGI version. That's not going to help the franchise as a whole, and I think it's very likely to happen.

I believe this could often be the case. OTOH, way down the road when Toho inevitably makes another small batch of Godzilla movies though they may be inspired to go the American route in terms of the tone, aesthetics, etc. It won't be just like LPG because budget wise it simply cannot, but in a small way it could end up being good for the franchise (the LPG, not the part about getting new LPG-only fans). The Showa movies are classics and never again will we have movies truly like that, so they might as well not even bother trying to make Godzilla movies Showa-esque again anyway. I prefer my Showa movies to remain Showa. Now I'd like to see some new movies made in that vein, but that's another discussion.
고질라

한국, 일본: 친교

Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. -Ian Maclaren

User avatar
antovald20
Terminated
Terminated
Posts: 1153
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 8:51 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby antovald20 » Fri Oct 19, 2012 3:45 pm

This is the must one sided topic ever! I mean look at the poll.
"Continuity gotta love it. :D"- antovald20

EVERY KAIJU FAN SHOULD CHECK THIS OUT! HIT THE LINK BELOW!
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Nxd7cleqz74

GODZILLA VS GAMERA! THE ULTIMATE BATTLE IS FINALLY HERE! CLICK THE LINK BELOW TO SEE
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iMOl-amah8w

User avatar
GodzillaSpawn
JXSDF Technician
Posts: 881
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:15 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby GodzillaSpawn » Fri Oct 19, 2012 5:48 pm

Legion1979 wrote:
Gojisan866 wrote:Not at all. It's still got a huge fanbase, as seen by this VERY WEBSITE, and if Legendary does a good job with the reboot, it may turn some younger people (as in my age who aren't already fans) onto the series.


OR (and this is VERY likely) it will turn some younger people into fans of Legandary's version of the character and not necessarily of the Toho version.

I guarantee you that two years from now we're going to be swamped with new members who think even Toho's newer Godzilla films are silly, campy, ridiculous, phoney poop compared to the dark, realistic, CGI version. That's not going to help the franchise as a whole, and I think it's very likely to happen.


Well, I've been a fan of Godzilla films since a young boy and I even think that.

edgaguirus
Kwaidan
Posts: 5503
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 1:25 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby edgaguirus » Fri Oct 19, 2012 8:36 pm

Some new fans will consider the LPG film superior, but exposure to older films will cause others to become curious about them. That curiousity could blossom into love for the older films. Of course, these new fans are more likely to have access to the Hesie or Millenium films, so those will be the old classics for them.
Kaiju are just like people- giant, radioactive people.

Megalon went into a bar and saw Gigan. Megalon said, " Again? I thought you gave this up."
" What can I say," Gigan asked. " I'm hooked."

User avatar
GodzillaSpawn
JXSDF Technician
Posts: 881
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:15 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby GodzillaSpawn » Fri Oct 19, 2012 9:47 pm

Even if these kids don't appreciate the old Toho films but just love the big-budget American version at first, they may begin to love them as they mature.

When your a child and you expect every film to look a certain way and reach a certain standard, the Toho Godzilla films could look...well, aged. But as they get older, you'll either grow to appreciate the franchise, or you won't, regardless of how the SFX hold up. Suddenly, different aspects of the movies take priority. And in some cases (like SFX), the flaws and limits of the film give the franchise a certain bit of character, charm and uniqueness.

User avatar
miguelnuva
Seatopian Daikaiju
Posts: 11813
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:32 pm

Re: Do you consider Godzilla a "dead" franchise?

Postby miguelnuva » Sat Oct 20, 2012 12:25 am

If LPG looks and acts like Godzilla I don't see how newer fans wouldn't like the old Gino but at the sametime I wouldn't better me if that didn't as long as we have no GINO fanboys.

I don't mind Godzilla 98 as a monster film but I hate the fans that think G98 is the be all end all of Godzilla films.
The one thing I want to see in life,TOHO buy Gamera.

Shadow Area 1-0


Return to “General Toho Films”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests